Open Carry in Ohio

[Bigjake]

First off, I'm not sure if this is the appropriate forum for this question, so if it's not, Mods, feel free to move it.

It's now summer here and the past week temps have averaged in the low 90's. It really sucks trying to conceal a pistol in these conditions, even the tiny little airwieght Smith I usually pack in warm weather, and the pocket holster I have makes drawing it VERY difficult/cumbersome.

So....

What would be the pros/cons of just open carrying my 1911 in plain sight?? I'm pretty sure its legal here, I just wanted to toss the question out and see if theres good reasons NOT to open carry it that I missed (other than the odds of being harassed by an ignorant cop).

Your thoughts??



With packing.org down, I'm without a resource to check stuff like this.

 

[Pilot]

I don't know the laws in Ohio, but you may want to research the laws here. Its more up to date than Packing.org so I am told.

http://handgunlaw.us/

 

[Bennett Prescott]

http://www.opencarry.org is the resource you want, their forums are very good.

Regarding Ohio, from the above site: "Ohio is a traditional open carry state. Recently, the Ohio legislature passed HB-12 over Governor Taft's veto, thus preempting all local open carry bans even in Ohio's "home rule" localities. Unfortunately, despite passage of HB-12, a permit to conceal is still required to openly carry a handgun in a vehicle."

Since you already have your CCW permit, sounds like it shouldn't be a problem. Even my beautiful home state of NH has similar restrictions, which don't affect me, but do affect my friends who come visit.

 

[Bigjake]

thanks both of you.

I guess my only question now is, do the little NO CONCEALED WEAPONS signs count against open? By carrying open, do I think open myself up for tresspassing charges?

Basically, if I decided to go to the bank, grocery store and gas station, and carried open at all of them, would I be breaking any laws??

I'm thinking appearance would be a huge factor. I'm a clear cut kind of guy, shaved head and well kept mustache, and my usual dress code is jeans and a tucked in T-shirt. I don't look like a dirtball.

 

[jerkface11]

Buy a handcuff case and put it on your belt next to your gun (keep some gum or something in it). Stick a cell phone case next to that. Everyone will simply assume Cop.

 

[FieroCDSP]

If you're in North Central, then chances are you're in a place that is carry friendly. Guage this by how many "Criminal Protection Zone" signs you see on grocery stores, gas stations, shops, etc.

The ohio CPZ signs carry little weight with open carriers who don't have a conceal permit, but if you have one, then you could possibly lose it if you open carry in a marked zone. It's an undefined issue that will be slightly better when the new laws take effect.

It is easier to open carry, to some extent, if you have the conceal permit, as you don't have to clear and store the weapon when in a vehicle. This is a large reason many choose not to OC in Ohio. Drive to a store, load up, holster, walk around and shop, unholster and unload when back at the car, etc.

Be prepared to explain to cops at some point or another. Most departments know the rules, and with the spotlight of lawsuits regarding infringement on lawful carry becoming more common, they should have had some mention of legal open carry recently.
That doesn't mean some liberal who just moved in from NYC won't call the cops to report "HE'S GOT A GUN!!!", it just means the cops will respond, look around, and possibly ask you a few questions to feel you out. I doubt they'd haul you in unless you refused to leave private property if the owner asks. This is the most likely outcome of any issue in a grocery store. The manager gets a complaint and asks you to leave or stow your weapon in the car before coming in/back in.
Be nice....Be polite... especially with the cops.

 

[Scanr]

Many police departments have instructed their officers to charge someone with "creating a public disturbance" if they see someone open carry

 

[FieroCDSP]

Big Jake.... I think the wording of the sign has a lot to do with it. If it says specificly "concealed weapons" then OC probably won't involve a trip to jail, but likely a request not to and an escort out. If it says "a firearm, deadly weapon, etc on these premesis" you could possibly be arrested. I wish someone would sit down and spell these thing out for certain. More people would OC if it was.

Many police departments have instructed their officers to charge someone with "creating a public disturbance" if they see someone open carry

In Ohio??!!? Haven't heard of one here lately.

 

[Majic]

Many police departments have instructed their officers to charge someone with "creating a public disturbance" if they see someone open carry

Where did you get this information? The charge has to have some merit or the magistrate will throw it out and you then have a lawsuit. No agency is going to openly expose itself to a lawsuit.

 

[FieroCDSP]

Here's some info courtesy of the OHCC:
http://www.ohioccw.org/component/option,com_kb/Itemid,57/page,viewcat/catid,29/

 

[Kentak]

I haven't seen any "no concealed" signs. They all seem to be "no guns" signs. It means what it says, no matter how it's carried.

The answer to your question is that, to the best of my knowledge, it *is* legal in Ohio and, very, very likely, you will find yourself the center of unwanted attention sooner or later.

Report back and let us know how it works out for you.

I'm going to amend my answer to say, I guess it depends an what exactly you mean my north central. Are you talking about rural Amish area? Let me ask you this--how often do *you* see open carry by civilians? If you see it often in a variety of settings, then the locals are probably used to it, as are LEOs. If you don't see it, then you might be confronted.

K

 

[Scanr]

Where did you get this information? The charge has to have some merit or the magistrate will throw it out and you then have a lawsuit. No agency is going to openly expose itself to a lawsuit.

A friend who just came out of the police academy.

 

[Kentak]

deleted

 

[FieroCDSP]

3) The owner or person in control of private land or premises, and a private person or entity leasing land or premises owned by the state, the United States, or a political subdivision of the state or the United States, may post a sign in a conspicuous location on that land or on those premises prohibiting persons from carrying firearms or concealed firearms on or onto that land or those premises. A person who knowingly violates a posted prohibition of that nature is guilty of criminal trespass in violation of division (A)(4) of section 2911.21 of the Revised Code and is guilty of a misdemeanor of the fourth degree.

ORC 2923.126

But this statute is under "Duties of a Licensed Individual"

Hell, the more I read, the more confused I become. Technicaly, if you're already a CHL holder, OC-ing into a prohibited place puts you in violation of this and subject to the penalties.
But by this listing, if you're NOT a CHL holder, and you OC into a restricted Private property zone, you can be asked to leave and charged with trespassing if you don't, but are not subject to the penalties put forth by this statute. ::scratches head::

I'm going to have to dig further into the ORC to find anything else I can about OC.

 

[Bigjake]

FieroCDSP, thanks for all the legwork man, I'm doing the same with the ORC. Let me know where you end up opinion-wise.

thanks the rest of ya too.

 

[Jim March]

OK, let's back up and look at how Ohio's CCW system came into being.

Circa...I *think* 2001, "our team" lost a case at the Ohio Supremes in which they were trying to use Ohio's state constitutional RKBA clause to assert a right to CCW, or at least a right to a reasonable shall-issue permit system.

They lost. However, in passing, the Ohio Supremes noted in their decision that while CCW was banned, the state constitutional right to arms wasn't being infringed because the right to open-carry remained.

Oh really now?

Up until then, various city PDs had been busting people for open carry. Whether the state Supremes realized it or not, they'd just changed everything.

That led to the open-carry rallies that forced CCW in circa 2002.

That decision also led to the passage of HB-12, which wasn't really an attempt to legalize open carry. Rather, it was an attempt to keep cities from getting sued to oblivion. The Ohio Supremes had backed open carry not based on any law, but based on the state's RKBA constitutional clause. Any harassment of open packers would have led to an instant win lawsuit; HB-12 passed with bipartisan support as a measure blocking such suits in advance by ordering the cities not to screw people over in a fashion already banned.

Did I mention Gov. Taft is a blithering idiot yet?

So yeah, open carry is in VERY GOOD shape in Ohio. Rescinding HB-12 wouldn't screw it up; it would take a constitutional amendment at this point and that's got no chance whatsoever.

 

[Prince Yamato]

Substitute khakis for jeans and you'll look more "professional". Also, whoever suggested the handcuff case... that's a horrible idea, because he could be charged with impersonating an officer. You're (as far as I know) NOT a cop, but you clearly work somewhere, so you are a "professional". So, dress the part! . May I also suggest linen pants- they're VERY comfortable in a hot climate. You'd look cool and you'd feel it too. Less chance of rivets scratching the gun too.

 

[Avenger]

Technically, the template sign I see everywhere states it as "No Firearms" which pretty much covers everything, concealed or not.

There was an incident here in Columbus back in February or thereabouts where an armed private security guard was detained while open-carrying. Not sure of the details, but I do recall that the officer involved had no idea that open-carry was legal. Nor did his supervisor. The Dispatch went to great lengths to stretch the story into one of their typical, "MADMAN CARRIES PISTOL!!!!!" stories though.

 

[FieroCDSP]

Technically, the template sign I see everywhere states it as "No Firearms" which pretty much covers everything, concealed or not

Yes, the sign may say "no deadly weapons", but there's no penalty to back it up if you don't have a CHL. At worst, they can charge you with criminal trespassing if you refuse to leave, and maybe inducing panic, but that's a stretch.

In the ORC, the penalties for disobeying the sign are under "Duties of a licensed individual." If you're not licensed, the penalties cannot stand up under that code.

I think the main thing I'm gathering from this is that there needs to be an AG office pamphlet spelling out OC in Ohio. It's waaay too frikin confusing.

 

[FieroCDSP]

Back to helping the OP with something actually useful.

I purposely went out and spent money on a compact 9mm, expressly for summer carry. I can wear khaki shorts, a T-shirt, and a button up shirt over that, and it disappears. Sure i don't look "professional", but I don't look like I'm carrying a gun either. If you've got the money, 5-11 gear looks nice.

 

[Aguila Blanca]

Where did you get this information? The charge has to have some merit or the magistrate will throw it out and you then have a lawsuit. No agency is going to openly expose itself to a lawsuit.

A friend who just came out of the police academy.

The OHIO police academy?

Or Nevada?

I thought Kirk's second law of the Internet only applied to Texas ...

 

[Linda]

Open carry has been legal in Ohio for many, many years.......BUT, it is not widely accepted. There is nothing to stop someone from calling in a "man with gun" to the PD. You CAN be charged with inducing panic and many have been. As a generall rule in Ohio, just don't do it! It will save you a lot of time, money and aggravation.

even the tiny little airwieght Smith I usually pack in warm weather, and the pocket holster I have makes drawing it VERY difficult/cumbersome

Dude, come on! You're not serious, right? Perhaps a little more daily practice of drawing that "unloaded" firearm is in order. I'm a female who carries a 1911 in an IWB holster spring, SUMMER, fall and winter and have zero issues with concealing it in any weather conditions. So certainly a little Smith in you pocket isn't that much of a hassle to carry.........right?