Opinion: Don't Fall into the .45GAP

[OnPointFirearms]

A few weeks ago, a story broke in Winter Haven, Florida regarding the KABOOM of several Police Department Glock 37 pistols [see article]. While the KABOOM phenomenon has been around for many years, this is the first time I can recall it affecting a large law enforcement agency using the .45GAP. In this particular case, Speer has accepted the blame for providing defective Gold Dot brand ammunition to Winter Haven PD. The department is now in the process of liquidating the model G37 and replacing it with the venerable Glock 21-- at a slightly higher cost per unit, of course. The question is: why choose the .45GAP in the first place?

The .45GAP is an answer to a question nobody asked. The .45ACP is legendary. “If it ain’t broke—don’t fix it,” and the .45ACP is definitely not broken! Glock developed the cartridge for the sole purpose of not being the only major firearms manufacturer left without their own round on the market. Sig Sauer developed the .357SIG for the same reason. “Cartridge Envy” makes companies do strange things.

Winter Haven’s decision to deploy the G37 was a mistake. Whatever short-term savings they enjoyed have long since been negated. The cost of ownership on the G37 is actually more expensive when you consider variable costs like ammo for training. Plus, you’re only getting a 10-round magazine capacity with the .45GAP model 37. Wasn’t the whole point of the .45GAP to offer a smaller profile, increased capacity, and comparable ballistics? No, that wasn’t it. The point of the .45GAP was to give Glock a caliber, however short-lived, that it could call its own.

-- Evan

 

[FlyPenFly]

357SIG is actually a good round.

 

[redactor]

In a longer-action service side arm, I completely agree.

In terms of a smaller concealment piece, I could be convinced that there is a reason for the .45 GAP. It seems to me that the GAP does for .45 Auto what .308 Winchester did for the .30-06, which is to provide almost as much out of a much smaller cartridge.

I've heard of lots of problems with tiny 3" 1911s (obviously, not all of them have problems). It seems to me that this would be the home platform of the .45 GAP. In fact I think the Springfield EMP would be ideal for the GAP... You get almost as much as a full-house .45 Auto, but in a smaller grip size and shorter necessary slide travel.

Recoil of course would be rather brisk, but target shooting wouldn't be the point here.

 

[TheReeves]

No thanks, us 3" 1911 shooters are plenty happy with .45ACP.

 

[RUT]

>>In this particular case, Speer has accepted the blame for providing defective Gold Dot brand ammunition to Winter Haven PD.<<

So, what's the problem? They could very well have supplied defective 45ACP ammo that would have Kaboomed the G21 as well.

 

[M203Sniper]

Too bad they don't make 3" 1911's in .45 GAP to see how it would shoot.

http://www.para-lda.com/pistolsTemp.html


I thought Glock was getting into the single stack market with the introduction of the GAP cartridge for the reasons stated - Smaller grips and almost the same punch in a polymer package.

I like the Glock 36 but it's too small. I think a full size single stack glock would sell, at least they could sell it to me


I never considered ego..... interesting theory.

 

[Newton]

Thread should be entitled - "Gun gets blame for faulty ammo - twice".

 

[wally]

A pox on .45GAP and WinNT for contaminating the brass stream. Still not as bad as 9mm with 38Super, 9x18, & 9x17 cases to seperate.

--wally.

 

[Confederate]

Well, this has been the way things are since...well, the .41 magnum, which really wasn't a magnum because there was no other .41 but the magnum.

I don't know anything about the .45 GAP at all. Is it just a +P version of the old .45? I've always thought the 1911s were too old of a design to use for military and law enforcement, but the round itself (especially a 185-gr JHP) certainly wasn't deficient.

I'm stunned that Glock would let such a thing happen. I'm not a Glock fan by any means, but they seem to be reliable when not limp-wristed.

Wonder if there will be a settlement in that guy who's suing?

 

[Fatelvis]

I predict the 45Gap will be 45GONE soon!

 

[Solid]

The reason the guns blew up is from bad ammo from Speer. Not because the GAP causes exploding guns...

The state depts. here switched over to the GAP when it was introduced. Since family at the time was serving I got a lot of hand on time with the G37. I have to say great gun, but obsolete with the 21SF now here.

Ballistics wise the .45 GAP isn't bad at all. It penetrates more than the ACP. Although ballistics tests are non-sense and what matters is placement, and speed of placement.

 

[22LongRifle]

The 45GAP was created to put a 45 caliber round in a 9mm/40S&W size weapon platform. It is on par with all 45ACP standard vel ammo and is better in shorter barrel weapon due to the higher pressures.

Believer it or not, not everyone has large hairy hands. This rounds was made for folks who wanted a 9mm size weapon to shoot 45 size bullets. It shoots bullet weights from 185 to 230 grains. And folks in the field seem to like them.

Now is it going to replace the 45ACP, no. So quit beating your chest and snarling at it! Its just an option that, really should be embraced by 45cal shooters. Now these is no excuse for your whole family to be shooting a 45 bullet.

I still have my G36 along with my G38. Both are here to stay.

BTW, ammo is just as plentiful and the cost differance is minute.

22lr

 

[plexreticle]

This reminds me of the Ford Explorer and Bridgstone tire problem except neither Ford or Bridgestone would admit a problem.

Kudos to Speer for taking fault.

 

[coloradokevin]

Hmmm... I carry the Glock 37 as a duty weapon, and we are issued Speer Gold Dot duty ammo.

So, that sucks.

As for the argument for or against the .45GAP, here's why I have it:

We have the choice of 9mm, .45GAP, .45ACP (the GAP and ACP ammo runs very similarly from a ballistic standpoint in our loads). Anyway, I've always shot Glocks, and I trust them... I don't like the 9mm, can't have a .40S&W, can't have a .357Sig, and can't have a 10mm. The Glock 21 is a fine gun, but I find the grip size to be a bit awkward for me (a touch too large). On the other hand, the Glock 37 has a grip size that exactly matches that of the Glock 22 (.40S&W) that I have shot and loved for years. So, I got the GAP.

Anyway, I've put a lot of ammo through my Glock 37 (probably around 8,000 rounds). It has performed flawlessly during that time, and I have not had a single failure.

But, I do think the GAP is going to someday head towards wildcat status... It doesn't seem to have more than a niche following at this point. Anyway, when that day comes I might have to look towards one of the Springfield XD's or Glock 21 "slim frames" I've heard about!

 

[jakk280rem]

45 gap

Glock developed the cartridge for the sole purpose of not being the only major firearms manufacturer left without their own round on the market.

actually they developed the gap as a first attempt to give 45acp performance in a smaller package i.e. smaller grip size. whether they succeded is not up to me to say, but if it had i dont think the g21sf and g30sf would be on the market.

 

[RUT]

>>It doesn't seem to have more than a niche following at this point.<<

As does the .357 Sig, 10mm, and a myriad of other cartridges. To that I say... to each his own.

 

[Ash]

The white elephant in the room is that the Glock platform is much less forgiving of ammo than others. And when a Glock becomes unforgiving, bad things happen.

Ash

 

[Rinspeed]

The .45 GAP was a stupid idea right from the beginning.

 

[DougDubya]

The .45 GAP was a stupid idea right from the beginning.

Stupid?

The GAP did away with all that extra empty space in many .45 ACP rounds, as the .45 ACP was designed in a time of less efficient powders. It's also smaller, so that you can design a double-stack magazine around it and still have it the same size as an ergonomic 9mm or .40.

Plus - SIG released the P239 in .45 GAP, which is as close to a .45 caliber PPK as one will ever hope to see.

 

[Phil DeGraves]

"I don't know anything about the .45 GAP at all. Is it just a +P version of the old .45?"

Confederate, it's a .45 in the case length of a 9mm, much shorter (and not interchangeable) than the 45 ACP. I suppose you could use them in a .45 ACP revolver with moon or star clips.

 

[Phil DeGraves]

"The GAP did away with all that extra empty space in many .45 ACP rounds, as the .45 ACP was designed in a time of less efficient powders."

But it's all that extra space that keeps the pressures down and GLOCK's are not forgiving when it comes to high pressures.

 

[Rinspeed]

Plus - SIG released the P239 in .45 GAP

Dream on.

 

[ewayte]

Plus - SIG released the P239 in .45 GAP, which is as close to a .45 caliber PPK as one will ever hope to see.

When?

 

[Gun Slinger]

I am forced to agree with the OP. If it ain't broken, don't fix it.

Perhaps I just far too 'jaded' to new cartridge developments because when I heard about the .45 GAP, I was rather underwhelmed and was forced to supress a yawn.

Glock has 're-invented the wheel', so to speak, and it isn't a very good rendition of the 'wheel' either.

It does nothing ballistically that the .45 A.C.P. can't/won't do, it does so at significantly higher internal operating pressures and the "benefit" we get for all this is that we get a grip frame that is marginally smaller in size with a "ballistically equivalent" cartridge.

Oh, yeah....the ammunition is more expensive and quite a bit harder to locate in appreciable quantities than the good 'ole .45 A.C.P.

I'll pass on this 'innovation' for now simply because of the fact that if I want a forty-five caliber Glock with a smaller frame, I can simply go out and pickup a brand new Glock 21SF or 30SF for the same amount of money and still have the .45 A.C.P. cartridge with the original ballistic performance and same size grip frame as found on the .45 GAP minus the high pressure/cost/availablity issues that seem to follow the .45 GAP.

If you like the GAP, that's fine with me, but I can find better things to do with my hard earned money than duplicate cartridge performance that already exists in a better, well proven package.

 

[DougDubya]

It was on display at the 2008 SHOT show.

Not up on sigarms yet.