Opinions and reliability experiences on a couple autoloaders, please...

[tbreihan]

I am looking to buy my first handgun in the next few weeks, spurred by a renewed interest in shooting and an attempted break-in/burglary of my house last week.

Over the past few months, I have visited local indoor ranges with rentals and shot a dozen or so handguns, primarily autoloaders. My preferences are toward a mid-sized or service-sized 9 mm. The gun, for now, will be used for range practice and home-defense. I am interested in obtaining my CCW permit, and a dual-use gun would be nice, but concealability is not high on my list of priorities at this point.

My short list is:

Beretta 92FS
Beretta PX4 Storm
Glock 17
Taurus PT-92AF

These guns are all within my price range (< $600) and I have shot 100 or more rounds through each. I am equally accurate with all four, able to put ten shots into a large 1-1/2 to 2 inch hole at 7 yards with each. In terms of operation, I like the combined safety/decocker of the Taurus best, and I find the Taurus and PX4 to be the most comfortable, but it is really too close to call. The grip angle of the Glock is weird, but it does force me into a wrist-down, thumbs-forward grip that it conducive to quickly getting the sights back on target.

I am mainly interested in hearing good/bad experiences with each in terms of functionality, reliability, and durability.

Finally, two guns that interest me are the CZ-75/P-01 and the Springfield XD. I have not had a chance to shoot either, but renting an XD is no problem. CZs on the other hand don't seem to be in anyone's rental inventory. However, there is a new P-01 (unfortunately with the Clinton-ban 10-round mags) at a local store for a very tempting price. If anyone could give me their opinions of this gun in comparison to say SIGs or Berettas, I would be interested.

Thanks for your time,
Tim

 

[jwxspoon]

I have the PX4 and the PT92AF in your list above. Love em both. No problems to speak of.

jw

 

[weisse52]

I have the Glock 17 and have been nothing short of thrilled with its performance.
Don't overlook that fact that you did find Taurus and PX4 to be the most comfortable. I would lean toward that. If it feels good, and you shoot good with it, it is a keeper.

 

[Frandy]

I've owned 2 Beretta 92FS pistols since 1989. Both function perfectly. A few thousands rounds without a hiccup. Eats all ammo I've put into them.

As for the Brunitron finish (slides are parkerized and then sprayed with an epoxy resin finish that contains inert Teflon. The slide is then baked for half an hour), it because I never carry mine, neither had much holster time. Can't speak to that.

 

[CountGlockula]

Welcome aboard! Go get the Glock 17, nothing bad to say about Glocks!

 

[DirksterG30]

Welcome to the forum, tbreihan.

Finally, two guns that interest me are the CZ-75/P-01 and the Springfield XD. I have not had a chance to shoot either, but renting an XD is no problem. CZs on the other hand don't seem to be in anyone's rental inventory. However, there is a new P-01 (unfortunately with the Clinton-ban 10-round mags) at a local store for a very tempting price. If anyone could give me their opinions of this gun in comparison to say SIGs or Berettas, I would be interested.

My CZ P-01 is by far my favorite handgun, and the one I shoot the best with (it is easier for me to shoot well than even a 1911). What sold me on the gun was the ergonomics; the only pistol I've seen yet that feels as good in the hand is the Smith & Wesson M&P series. My P-01 has been 100% reliable, and is very accurate (more accurate than I can shoot, I think.)

For me the plusses of the P-01 are:
- very reliable
- 14+1 capacity
- points very well for me
- great ergonomics, especially for a double-stack (decocker is in a good place, well-designed grip, etc.)
- polycoat finish is very durable
- spring-loaded decocker (I much prefer this to the Beretta/Walther style decocker/safety)

The drawbacks are:
- DA/SA trigger (required me to learn 2 different triggers, as this was my first DA/SA gun). This was only an issue the first few months. Now the trigger is easy for me to shoot
- Trigger pull can be heavy out of the box; mine was fine, and smoothed up nicely
- CZs can be undersprung from the factory (mine was fine)
- light rail on dustcover makes frame a little wide (the PCR has a narrower dustcover)

As for the 10-rd magazines, some people on the CZ forums have mentioned sending them in to CZ-USA for a free exchange with 14-rd magazines.

 

[mpmarty]

First get an XD in your hands and then try to borrow a CZ or a CZ clone (Baby Desert Eagle, EAA Witness, Springfiled whatever its called) and then decide. I would caution against a Glock for a number of reasons and would also advise against a polymer framed CZ clone from EAA as the Witness "P" series as in P for Plastic, has a poor reputation. The all steel EAA Witness pistols however are among the best out there if you like the CZ style pistols. Try them out and don't listen too much to the Glockenspeils but make your own decisions, after all you are paying for it and you will be depending on it to perform and meet your own specific expectations. That Said, WELCOME to The High Road.

 

[SRT1]

No problems at all with the Beretta 92FS or the Taurus. Only Glock I own is a 27, so can't say much either way on your choice there. Only caution I would throw in is this - Since your considering this for home protection (a stress oriented situation) I would shy away from any firearm that makes you adapt away from your natural point of aim. In a firefight that LAST thing you're thinking about is "Now how much did I need to aim high to make up for my grip?" and that is not a good situation. A strong case for the one that feels most natural in your hand and has the point aim that is natural to your grip etc.
Good luck!

 

[tbreihan]

Thanks for the replies so far!

Sounds like there are no real "problems" to speak of with any of my choices, so that is good.

I do find myself leaning toward the DA/SA pistols, for no other reason than that they are somewhat more forgiving of "bad" handling than the striker-fired guns. I am pretty obsessive about NOT putting my finger in the trigger guard until the gun is pointing downrange at the target, but in a high-stress situation, I'm not sure I trust myself to be so vigilant. This goes double for my fiancé, who is not a shooter.

On the other hand, the simplified manual of arms for the Glock and the XD is appealing. However, the true DA trigger pull of the first shot (or the option of a true manual safety in regards to the Taurus) are pushing me in that direction.

Between the Taurus and the Beretta 92, the Taurus grip is more comfortable to me. I suspect it has to do with the fact that the Taurus has slimmer, flatter grip panels, though I have handled a Beretta 92 with the two-piece Hogue panels and that seems to solve the problem. I am somewhat concerned about the durability of the Taurus' blued finish, but at half the price of the Beretta, it seems like a hard deal to beat. I didn't notice a difference in the trigger pulls between the two (they were both better than the SIGs I have shot, IMHO.)

Given the input on the P-01, I am now more determined than ever to shoot one. In terms of handling, they seem to fit me perfectly. Dirkster, how is smallish P-01 as a range gun? I tend to find medium-sized guns (Glock 19 for instance) a bit more work to shoot at the range. Is the P-01, in your opinion, an enjoyable gun for range practice.

Thanks again,
Tim

 

[DirksterG30]

Given the input on the P-01, I am now more determined than ever to shoot one. In terms of handling, they seem to fit me perfectly. Dirkster, how is smallish P-01 as a range gun? I tend to find medium-sized guns (Glock 19 for instance) a bit more work to shoot at the range. Is the P-01, in your opinion, an enjoyable gun for range practice.

Thanks again,
Tim

Tim,

The P-01 is considered a compact; it is roughly the size of a Glock 19. I do find the P-01 to be a great gun for shooting on the range, despite the somewhat smaller size. Of all the pistols I have or had, the P-01 is the one I shoot the best, probably because the ergonomics work so well for me. (that includes the Sig P226 & P6, Springfield Champion 1911, Kahr MK9, Glock 30 & Kel-tec P3AT. )

Something to consider if you are looking for a first handgun is a .22LR conversion. There are a number of pistols that will accept a .22LR slide & barrel. CZ has the Kadet, and I know there are conversions available for the Glock, 1911, Hi-Power, Beretta 92/96 & Taurus PT92/99. That way, you can use the same frame (with the same trigger pull etc.) and shoot much cheaper .22LR out of it. When I get some more money, I plan on getting the Kadet for my P-01 and my wife's PCR. I hope this helps.

Also, where do you live? If you're not too far from me, we could get together and you could try out my P-01. Just a thought.

 

[DirksterG30]

oops - double-tap

 

[DirksterG30]

triple-tap!

 

[DirksterG30]

quadruple-tap!

 

[tbreihan]

Also, where do you live? If you're not too far from me, we could get together and you could try out my P-01. Just a thought.

St. Louis, MO, so unfortunately that won't work. Thank you for the offer, though!

The one indoor range near me has a used CZ-75b in .40 S&W for sale. I'm going to see if they'll let me shoot a box through it.

 

[Calhoun]

tbreihan- My first handgun was a CZ75B and I had no problem learning the DA/SA trigger. It's all in what you get used to. CZs can have rough triggers at first but they smooth out very nicely. If you like the ergos of the 75B, you should like the P01. Most people do.