Outdoor shooting - Meat!

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DontShootMe

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Well, today I took my nephew out to the Sierra National Forest land to do some shooting. We purchased a BUNCH of large pork shoulders to use as targets.

Since we live in the city, this was our first time shooting outdoors, not at a range.

The results are as follows:
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First, the 9mm:

FMJ (WWB) - straight through, exit hole same size as entry. Some did not exit - assume they hit bone

Hydra-Shock JHP - exit hole 3-4 times larger than entry, considerably more visible shock to the meat, bone shards flying 5-10 feet away from impact point

Magtech JHP - fast (FPS) round, performance similar to Hydra-Shock.
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The .45

FMJ (WWB) - entry/exit holes appear to be same size as 9mm

Hydra-Shock JHP - major damage, irregular wound channel, chunks of bone went flying, exit channel 1-2 inches wide

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The .357

.38 +P Nyclad JHP - good penetration and expansion, not nearly as much sound pressure as standard .357 - Great relatively 'quiet' round that still packs a major punch.

Cor-Bon .357 125gr JHP - This is hands down the most powerful handgun round in today's test. Amazing. Exit channel was nearly 5 INCHES wide.

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The .380

Speer Gold dots JHP - This was the only type of round I had for the .380 - Honestly could not tell the difference between these and the 9mm Federal Hydra-Shocks. Identical behavior/results. Made me feel real good about carrying .380

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The .22lr

Winchester Xpert .22lr JHP - I was very pleased with the performance of the cheap Winchester Xpert .22 rounds (7.95 per 550 at Wally World) Excellent expansion. Many did not penetrate though. We dug them out and the appeared to be 'smeared' - they looked like a ball of dough after a rolling pin rolled over them under hard pressure. Eliptical shaped pancakes of lead.

JHP Stingers - To me these are the ultimate 'hot' .22 round. Complete penetration, great expansion, exit channel nearly 1/2 inch around in some cases.

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And finally, the shotty:

12 ga. 7.5 shot, 2.75" birdshot: Blew the meat back 3-4 feet every shot. Energy was completely released without much penetration.

3" 1oz slugs - Wow. One of these turned one of the shoulders completely inside out. Could not find any of them afterwards because they blew through everything. Intentionally shot the ball-socket shoulder joint, and it was literally vaporized. Nothing but shards.

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Final notes - I was most impressed with the Cor-Bon .357. Believe the hype.
I have greatly raised confidence in carrying my Bersa .380 as an 'only gun' sometimes
It was great to be able to practice moving and shooting at the same time.
Proper Eye/Ear protection was worn at all times.
We left the area 'cleaner than we found it' of course.

All in all, we city boys had a great time out there in the National Forest land. We also learned quite a bit about how different types of ammo behave, albeit in these controlled circumstances.

:cool:
 
Thanks. You can look at all the data on paper, argue 9/40/45 and my JHP is better, but this is where the rubber meets the road. This is a meat and bone test. ALthough not scientific, it is a confidence builder. Good job.
 
I'm suprised at your .380 results too! I'm curious to know what grain ammo you used though?
 
7.62FullMetalJacket, I've always argued that velocity is king in handguns, anyone who has read any of my posts will vouch for that, but I was just merely pointing out that the current overpriced Cor-Bon load is identical to the Remington 125gr. JHP load of the past 25 years or so.
 
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Hi Pylon - yeah, it was a 90gr .380 round (the ones from Ammoman.com that come in 250 round bulk)

Hi Phoenix - here are the barrel lengths:

9mm - 4.49" (Glock 17)
.45 - 5" (Springer 1911)
.357 - 4" (Taurus 627)
.380 - 3.5" (Bersa Thunder)
.22lr - 6" (Ruger MkII)
12 gauge - 20" (Mossy 500)

Wondernine - you are correct. The Remington Express .357 is rated at the exact same FPS as Cor-Bon. (1450 FPS@muzzle) probably the main physical difference I can think of is that the Rem is SJHP and the Cor-Bon is JHP.

Price Diff:
Cor-Bon: $15 for 20 (approx)
Rem: $25 for 50 (approx)
 
One of the local stores sells entire skinned cow heads. Don't ask my why but they do.
Dunno.gif

They sell for about $12, thought someday I might try one. At the range.
 
The .380

Speer Gold dots JHP - This was the only type of round I had for the .380 - Honestly could not tell the difference between these and the 9mm Federal Hydra-Shocks. Identical behavior/results. Made me feel real good about carrying .380.
Click to expand...

Me too. I often get a chuckle at some statements I've read here and on other forums about the .380 being anemic or that it's better to throw the gun at a BG. Perhaps it's because the .380 round is "cute" or something, but if you've ever seen what it will do, like you demonstrated, then it should change your mind. That is not to say there aren't better choices for constant carry, but the .380 is not a bad choice by any stretch of the imagination.
 
I've fired at a live animal with a .380. While it breaks smaller bones, the heavier bone of a hip joint stopped it cold, no breakage and a cratering wound.

I'll agree that a 125 gr 357 is a power hitter.
 
Those pork shoulders are really good on a smoker at about 225 degrees for about 10 hours, too...
 
I've fired at a live animal with a .380. While it breaks smaller bones, the heavier bone of a hip joint stopped it cold, no breakage and a cratering wound"

Was the bulllet that hit the smaller bones deflected to the the hip joint? If not then why not just shoot at the area with smaller bones. If you shoot a 357 at the smaller bones would it not just pass through, instead of deflecting toward the hip bone like the 380 would?
 
Well when the animal in question doesn't want to get shot and is jumping around and running away... well it's a little different.

The gist of the story is this.. I was hunting antelope and walked up to one I thought was dead with my rifle slung over my shoulder unloaded. I had unsnapped the holster for my .380 in case I had to offer up a coup de grace.

As it turns out at 5-10 feet away the animal jumped up as if unwounded.

I drew and fired three times scoring three hits all with a 90 gr hydra shock at a moving target. 2 were not lethal, one was.

Through the smaller bones, like ribs the bullet penetrated well. Through the thicker bones it stopped cold. Antelope have quite delicate bones compared to a deer or pig.

Shot #1 hit the right rear hip as it tried to run. Result was a cratering wound 1/2 deep with little to no effect on the bones. Hurt like hell i'd imagine as the animal turned completely around. The bullet did not deflect or ricochet it was all there, though it was in peices.

Shot #2 hit the opposite side, lower down on the left rear leg that broke the bone but did not exit, but slowed the animal enough for me to fire a fatal shot. the bullet expenaded to the size of a nickel (fragmented) and small splinters of it in a circle were sticking through the hide on the inside of the leg.

Shot #3 went through a rib penetrated 7 inches or so and stopped in the heart, that was the killing shot. Bullet was mostly intact.

Point of this is, in my experience, a hard impact (like bone) will shatter this bullet, and it will not penetrate, or under penetrate.

This is a one off shooting experience, and not meant to be indicative of all shooting with this load.

This shooting led me to practice a lot more with a handgun, and retire my .380 from nightstand duty.
 
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