Pointed Bullets in 30-30

[brainwake]

Seems like a touchy subject every time it comes up. I have a contender with 16" barrel....rifle set up.

I opted to go with the Hornady Leverevolution set up, then bought components to reload for them. This way I can get lazy and just buy a box or get motivated and load some. I haven't taken a deer with it yet, but they shoot well at the range.

A couple of other reasons I opted for the Hornady Leverevolution was that my father-in-law and cousin both had 30-30 levers, I figured I could share with them as well. I got real close to going with MC's recipe, but at the time components were hard to come by and I just found the Hornady's first.

I personally like the idea of custom loading something and obsessing over it to make a special bullet. While some may think its not worth it...that is really just a matter of opinion on the value of the effort. If time and effort is not an issue....then why not try to figure out the best possible solution? Only you can judge whether or not the effort is worth it.

 

[MCgunner]

MCgunner...No hatred or vitriol here. I just get tired of people trying to improve what was designed for a particular purpose

Well, thank God not everyone has this attitude or I'd still be riding around on leaky British iron with tools and bailing wire in the saddle bags for when i couldn't get home because that damned zener diode vibrated off again. Honda came out with the CB750 and the Triumph is history.

Reloading is sometimes about improving things. The first rifle I ever reloaded, with my Grandpa's instruction at the age of 10, was for his .257 Roberts. Factory ammo has always sucked for that round. No reason to not push the pressure a bit in a Remington M722 over the standard SAAMI's pathetic limits, not when stuff like .308 is loaded in the same action. I load that gun, today, with H4831. My grandpa's loads used IMR4350, but I tend to look for something better and after reading an article in the American Rifleman, I tried H4831 and woke up the old round a little more, never looked back. I killed a deer with that rifle last season 50 seasons after the first deer I killed with it. It didn't die any deader, both were DRT, but I like the load I developed for it, just that little bit more to its exterior ballistics and it's more accurate, 1/2 MOA vs 1.5 MOA for the old load. Do I need that in the woods? No, but I appreciate the improvement anyway. i'm not just about killing deer. I reload as a hobby and, by GOD I have my fun!

One of the things I don't like about 7mm Rem Mag is that I've found I cannot improve on good factory loads by handloading. It's boring, and, well, overkill on deer.

Different strokes for different folks. There's lots of black powder shooters who have no use for this new fangled smokeless crap people keep talking about. I shoot black powder, too, just another way to have fun. I catch hell from the purists because I like 777. But, hey, I'm shooting a 209 primed inline percussion with a scope on it, too, so sue me.

In this vein, the .30-30 was the very first sporting cartridge in America to shoot smokeless. That was the innovation at the time. They combined the powder with expanding bullets. They could have just stuck with cast, I guess, the tradition. I could say the same, I suppose, about the 1886 Lebel or the 8x57J found in the 88 Commission rifle. What did the Germans do with that 8x57, sit on their hands and keep loading it with a round nose bullet? HELL no, they loaded a .323" spitzer for the 98 Mauser, dubbed it the 8x57S, and gained great battlefield effectiveness in the process. But, the Germans couldn't leave well enough alone.

 

[The Bushmaster]

.50 caliber TC Hawken. Definately not an inline.

 

[T.R.]

My long range antelope load consists of Sierra 125 grain spitzer. It shoots way flatter than standard blunt tip ammo. Rapid expansion delivers a lethal blow.

TR

 

[Patocazador]

If you reload, you ought to try Sierra 125 gr. HP bullets with IMR 3031 powder. Very accurate in my model 94 .. and nothing else is. I didn't shoot the gun for 15 years because factory ammo was so inaccurate.

That bullet anywhere in the chest cavity is lethal.

 

[Sunray]

The chances of getting more than two shots at Bambi are slim anyway. The .30-30 can really shine accuracy wise with a pointy bullet, but there isn't much advantage.
"...is with a 110 grain..." M1 Carbine bullet. Hodgdon shows 150's at close to or above 2400 with CFE223, H4895, Varget, BL-C2 and LVR. Operative words are 'close to'. A 150 at those speeds will do anyway. You don't need rocket speeds for expansion.

 

[Marlin 45 carbine]

I'm unsure about this but was'nt the 30-30 designed as a bush gun to begin with?
basically a limited range heavy hitter with quick follow up shot (s).
an interesting topic though. the 125gr may not be adequate for quartering shots on larger deer. at past say 100 yds in brush?

 

[MCgunner]

I'm unsure about this but was'nt the 30-30 designed as a bush gun to begin with?
basically a limited range heavy hitter with quick follow up shot (s).
an interesting topic though. the 125gr may not be adequate for quartering shots on larger deer. at past say 100 yds in brush?

Un, no, the .30-30 was designed to fire the brand new nitro powders of the time, the very first in an era when a .40 caliber bullet was small and the only thing you hunted with a .31 was squirrel. It was born into the world of single shot black powders like the .50-110 sharps. I'd say, almost ALL sporting cartridges of the time were bigger and slower. And "brush busting" is a myth at any rate. At the time of the .30-30's introduction, 1894, the only smokeless hunting rounds were black powder cartridges loaded with the new powders and virtually NONE used a spitzer bullet. The spitzer was first used, to my knowledge, by militaries in the form of the 1893 Spanish 7x57, the 1898 German 8x57S round, and such. It was after WW1 that bolt guns got real popular and soft point spitzers began to be used. Those dough boys kinda liked their 03s and wanted that sort of advantage for hunting.

There were some previous inroads into smokeless cartridge guns to the military bolt designs, the Savage 99 comes to mind. The .300 Savage, IMHO, was way ahead of the curve. The whole idea of the gun was the rotary magazine that eliminated the tube mag and need to load flat point bullets. IMHO, the Savage was kinda ugly, but it sure had advantages.

Trust me, the 150 Nosler BT will expand right down below 1800 fps. I know this, seen it with my own eyes, was the whole point of my post bringing up my .30-30 pistol. I used to shoot a 135 grain .30-30 Sierra pro hunter which was designed for .30-30 pistols. It worked well, but no better than the Nsoler, had a lower BC being a flat based bullet, and is no longer available. That bullet also worked for me at 2150 fps in an SKS in 7.62x39. Sad that Sierra doesn't see fit to offer it anymore. It was a good bullet. I've not tried the 125 spitzer, but if it works for you, go for it.

 

[Don McDowell]

One of the first "write ups" on the 30 wcf was from Teddy Roosevelt and his account of shooting an antelope at 186 paces and not having to hold over.
The 30-30 followed shortly by the 30-40 Krag were the major factors driving the demise of the big bore blackpowder rounds as hunters cartridges.

 

[GooseGestapo]

I first shot spitzers through my .30/30's back in the '70's. I had a Rem M788 that would shoot sub-moa with 130gr Speer HP's.

I agree that the spitzers offer little improvement. Heck, I even shoot the 63gr Sierra's through my .223's as they are a superior deer bullet, but I digress.

Use the two (3) Speer flat-nose bullets listed. (the 130 fn is the best )

I in fact easily see 2,400fps with 150's from my .30/30's. However, only 2 powders are capable. Reloader 15 (but not at most recent data maximums) and LeverEvolution aka LVR.

But, again the extra 100-150fps means little.

A well constructed bullet intended for the velocity's of the .30/30 is the key.

Secondly, PROPERLY sighting in the rifle is VERY IMPORTANT

The reason most consider the .30/30 a 100yd gun is because they are conditioned to 100yd zero. I use a +3" zero at 100yds, or a ~160yd zero. This gives the 150-170gr bullets a -4.5" at 200yds which is further than 90% of the 300+ deer I've killed including those shot at airports for population control under permits.

It's the Indian, not the arrow.

My favorite bullets for the .30/30 (aside from the cast bullets I mostly shoot) are the Remington 150 and 170gr CorLokts. They open reliably out to 300yds (with proper bullet placement!) and are usually quite accurate.

Practice, practice, practice. Bullet placement is key.

If you do INSIST on using spitzers, the 125gr Nosler B.T. 110gr Hornady V-max, and 125gr Sierra PtSpt have been the best for me.

Use 37.0gr of RL15 with the bullets seated deep enough to just clear the ejection the chamber on ejection and you're on your way.
Do realize that these are going to shoot ~ 10" differently at 100yds from previous sight-in (poa vs poi) because of different barrel harmonics.

Lately, I just shoot a 160gr FNGC at ~2,000fps. Does everything I need a .30/30 to do.

I read the piece by T.R. back many years ago. Interesting piece.
If you sight in your .30wcf like they did, it's easy!
If you are hitting just above the front bead at 100yd's, you are acutally +3". Hits to the bead at ~175, and at bottom of bead (large as a deer at 300yds) to bottom of the bead. With proper eye glasses (T.R. usually carried 3-4 "spares") you can see the front bead clearly (I use reciever sight).

And I shoot, a LOT...

 

[buckman11]

I shoot Hornady LeverEvolution in my Glenfield 30-30, they are fantastic! Ive also got a friend who shoots them in his 35 Remington, Total destruction.

 

[Berger.Fan222]

The 125 Ballistic tip would be my choice for deer and the 110 VMAX for varmints. The 110 VMAX is ok on deer.

There is some advantage for drop from the higher BC and more speed, but the bigger advantages in my opinion are less wind drift, greater downrange energy, and excellent terminal performance. The reduced recoil from the lighter bullets is nice too, especially when younger shooters are practicing.

 

[loose noose]

I've shot just about every load you can imagine in my Marlin, with micro-groove barrel, Winchester Model 94, and recently in my Marlin (not Remlin), with Ballard rifling. The best results as far as accuracy, bc, are my hand loads, using a hard cast 170grn. with a gas check, at slightly over 1900fps, in all of my 30-30's with the exception of the micro-grooved Marlin. JMHO.