reloads for self defense

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gunguy0829

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Hi, getting into re loading and I keep on hearing not to use re loads for self defense. Aside from legal issues where the DA could say it was pre meditated cause you made your own ammo ( case here in Colorado on that ) is it safe to use re loads or are they just not reliable?
 
I have reloaded for 50 years.

I consider my reloads to be more reliable then factory ammo.

Through the years, I have had factory ammo with no flash hole drilled in the case, primers seated upside down, case mouths torn and rolled over, and more then one misfire.

As for legal?
Well, if the shoot is legal to start with, I fail to see how using a reload would be any different then using a hammer you just put a new handle in, or your wifes old cast iron skillet you just shined up on the wire wheel grinder.

rc
 
Here is a recent discussion thread that I believe has the most comprehensive and applicable discussion and information on reloading for self-defense - http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=634817

If anyone is interested in reloading their own defensive rounds, I would highly recommend you read the entire thread as most of questions asked in the past were answered by the thread.

Essentially, reloading your own defensive loads is OK but you may have your entire reloading equipment/components confiscated by the police/sheriff department along with the pistol used in the shooting while they conduct the investigation and court hearing if applicable.

If you used factory JHP, you may just need to hand over the remainder of the factory ammunition and the pistol involved in the shooting.

The choice is yours ... I carry factory JHP in my SD/HD pistols. ;)
 
I also trust my reloads over any factory ammo hands down. My ammo is the best ammo I can shoot.

As for all the legal stuff, I wouldn't begin to advise you on that. you have to make those decisions for yourself.
 
I use factory +P Gold Dot ammo. Although I've been reloading for twenty years, I don't attempt to make +P or +P+ ammunition.

Standard pressure for 9mm is 35,000 PSI
+P pressure is 38,500 PSI
+P+ pressure is 42,000 PSI
 
One of the primary reasons I reload is because I trust my loads more than factory. 30 + years of loading my own and I have yet to experience a single mis-fire or other failure.

Regarding the self defense issue, I would contact an expert in such law. here is a link that shoudl answer most of your concerns in this respect.
www.armedpersonaldefense.com Mr. Douglas Little is an expert in this area of law, and will give you only facts.
GS
 
sniper762 said:
I dont recall any litigation concerns ever pertaining to reloads
Click to expand...
Correct. As discussed in the thread link, justified shooting is a justified shooting, regardless of the ammunition used. I support this notion.

However, if reloaded defensive rounds are involved in a shooting and there are circumstantial issues/concerns, while the investigation is conducted by the PD/SD and/or during court case, your ENTIRE reloading equipment/components (and I mean everything down to individual bullet and primer) may be held as evidence for weeks/months/years. Not to mention the legal fees that you may incur defending your case that may run into tens of thousands of dollars (even though you may ultimately win the case).

I certainly feel that my reloads are more accurate than many factory ammunition, but I am not willing to part with ALL of my reloading equipment/components for any length of time. Of course, if I was reloading 200 gr 45ACP lead SWC and I HAD to defend my/family's lives, I would not hesitate to use whatever ammunition I had close by, even the target SWC loads (yes, we do carry inside the house with factory ammunition).

So if $11 - $12 spent on a box of premium factory JHP will prevent my reloading equipment/components from being held as evidence, I consider it money well spent.
 
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If I'm on trail I don't see me having time to reload any how. The expense of the trail & the lose of my gun would make the couple of thousand I have in reloading seem like nothing.

I've been wanting some other equipment. Might be a good time to buy a Load Master.

I actually carry some cheap Federal junk in my SD gun. It is rear to need to defend yourself. If you do it is going to only be feet away. It is rear to find a misfire. I would say the odds are in my favor.
 
I think some of you are missing a point. The factory "Personal Defence" loads that Hornady and all the other companies make for us are made with a low muzzle flash so we don't blind ourselves and no longer can protect ourselves, a lower report so we don't blow out our eardrums indoors, and premium bullets that will get the job done over what most of us use in our reloads for practice.

The powder that is available to us from retail doesn't take these things into consideration.

My 327 fed mag would with no doubt deften me beyond being able to protect myself if I fired it indoors because of being supersonic. My 9mm reloads would probably blind me because of the type of powder I use with it's halatious muzzle flash.
I do buy "personal defence loads" because of this reason and this reason alone.

I was also told in my self defence classes not to use my reloads for self defence because of the "mad sciencetist" scenario that could be used against me if I had to protect myself with my own loads. "I made them the way I did to specifically kill people".

I have no intention of killing anyone but this is just one more reason why I use factory defence loads.
 
tightgroup tiger, yes your question/comment were discussed in great detail in the thread link along with many other practical/legal issues regarding the use of reloaded defensive ammo.

The factory "Personal Defence" loads that Hornady and all the other companies make for us are made with a low muzzle flash so we don't blind ourselves and no longer can protect ourselves, a lower report so we don't blow out our eardrums indoors, and premium bullets that will get the job done over what most of us use in our reloads for practice.

The powder that is available to us from retail doesn't take these things into consideration.
Click to expand...
Hogwash!

I use the same bulk 40S&W 165 gr and 45ACP 185 gr Golden Saber JHP bullets to duplicate similar POA/POI practice rounds as factory JHP ammunition I carry using WSF and I am currently load testing AutoComp (which many claim is the same WSF but with flash suppressant). We have done night time range shooting with zero light and most of our loads produced minimal muzzle flash, certainly not enough to blind us. I guess if you are using PowerPistol, that would be an exception.

We haven't done decibel measurements of our loads, but without hearing protection, especially if shooting indoors/confined spaces, I don't think a nominal decrease in decibels will matter that much ... it will be loud no matter what. One time, I forgot to wear ear plugs during M60 full-auto fire exercise and I couldn't hear until the next day. :D
 
Otto said:
I use factory +P Gold Dot ammo. Although I've been reloading for twenty years, I don't attempt to make +P or +P+ ammunition.

Standard pressure for 9mm is 35,000 PSI
+P pressure is 38,500 PSI
+P+ pressure is 42,000 PSI
Click to expand...
Why won't you try to make +P ammo? I make .38 Special +P ammo all the time and there's really nothing different than standard ammo but for a little more powder. I do agree you shouldn't try making +P+ ammo because there are no SAAMI specs for that.
 
Generally speaking I don't carry nor condone carrying handloads. Not because of legal issues but rather that factory SD loads are so good.

I find myself not adhering to this policy in a couple instances.

First off is when I carry my 44special. Factory loads are way way too watered down. (675fps)

Second is when I'm out and about in the woods and I'm carrying a concealed revolver to double as anti 4 or 2 legged use.


I've got the aforementioned flashholeless case in the past. I choose to believe (unfounded most likely) that SD amma goes through a bit more qc

posted via mobile device.
 
I carry both

I am an enforcement officer and I will say in my autos I carry strictly factory ammo, and I have been reloading for over 30 years.That includes 9mm,.45acp and 40 S&W.However one of my favorite is my Taurus 85S .38 special snub. There I carry my reloads. I guess my feelings are that in autos they are more prone to have a problem. In a revolver they always work and if you ever have a mis-fire you can just keep pulling the trigger.
 
Standard pressure for 9mm is 35,000 PSI
+P pressure is 38,500 PSI
+P+ pressure is 42,000 PSI
Click to expand...

+P+ has no standardized pressure limit. It is just higher than +P and (hopefully) less than minimum proof at 52,000 PSI.
 
In my opinion, it depends on the political aspirations of the district attorney assigned the case.

I go through periods of carrying factory ammunition and some handloads depending on which way the wind is blowing. I really hope I do not have to test the system.
 
I am carrying +P+ 9mm right now. They are wimpy, but good enough.

For 380, for a long time my handloads were much more powerful than factory.
I have not tested them, but on paper, the Buffalobore +P 380 looks identical to my handloads; 1100 fps 90 gr JHP from a Kel-Tec P3AT or Ruger LCP.

Where I live there are 20,000 people, 30 cops, 3 on duty at a time. For crime, we have ~ 3 car prowls per week. But those car prowls are near the freeway. I am miles from there, where there is almost no crime.
So I carry a gun, but I will almost certainly never need one.
I just carry a gun because I like guns.
 
bds said:
Hogwash!
Click to expand...

I agree.

When the time comes your senses change. If you have never been there there is no way you can understand what I could tell you. You can see in almost no light, noise will not be over bearing, & every second will seem more like a minuet.

My company buys Hornady Tap & I can tell you it will ring your ears outside. I have a extra 20 my boss gave me that I could get by carrying it sets on the shelf.
 
Clark,

I to live in a small town, 7,000 people and i have already gotten shot at fishing with my wife and son, it was about 70 yards away so we hunkered down called 911, and they came out. They just distracted to perps while we left, Those guys are part of the "Brown Mofia" which is a Mexican derived mofia and nothing was done to them. I am not going to say the cops were scared or corupt, but with only a handful of cops I decided to start carrying all the time, I used to only carry in the wilderness to protect against critters. Weeks later a report came out and it said those guys were just shooting and had no idea I was there. That is bull cause I yelled at the one guy to stop and he just laughed. After that being fearful of retaliation my home defense picked up, wife got a gun and now I want to re load. I shoot at least once every two weeks.
 
I think that the situation varies from state to state.

Here in Utah, I don't think the question of what kind of ammunition you were using would even come up. Dead home invader? Well, good job then. Hope the carpet isn't ruined. You're immune to prosecution and immune to law suits by the survivors or their heirs under state law.

In California, the type of ammo used will be questioned during the discovery phase of the lawsuit that inevitably follows. If you use handloads, you will be portrayed as some kind of wacky survivalist nut job that creates monster ammo designed to be extra destructive.

I can see the wisdom of avoiding being painted that way. But, then, I never carry in California.
 
For those that did not get to read the other comprehensive discussion thread, here's a quick summary.

Use of reloaded ammunition for justified defensive shooting is fine.

The problem is that once the police discover/realize that reloaded ammunition was involved in the shooting, your ENTIRE reloading equipment/components can and will be taken in for evidence for the duration of the investigation and/or court trial :eek::eek::eek: while police/experts may try to replicate the load used for the shooting to determine distance, etc.

This one factor alone made me decide not to use reloaded ammunition for SD/HD purposes. If factory ammunition was used, police would take the remainder of the ammunition and the factory box (if available and based on the discussion, I would HIGHLY recommend that you keep the factory box with the lot number handy for the police) along with the pistol for evidence.

I don't know about you, but I do not want the police going through all of my "delicate" reloading equipment and the entire reloading component stash. You know, I just don't want our dedicated public servants hurting their backs lifting those heavy bullet boxes ... ;)

As to those whining about the high price of factory premium JHP ammunition, family owned and operated SGAmmo has them at very reasonable prices - http://www.sgammo.com/catalog/pistol-ammunition

9mm Remington Golden Saber 124 gr +P JHP - $12/25

40S&W Remington Golden Saber 165 gr JHP - $11/25

40S&W Reminton Golden Saber 180 gr JHP - $14/25

45ACP Remington Golden Saber 185 gr +P JHP - $14/25

45ACP Remington Golden Saber 230 gr JHP - $14/25
 
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