Remington 1858 repros

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electricfactory

electricfactory

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I've been talking myself into getting one of the Remington 1858 clones out there but a while now. I think part of the reason is because of it's ease in conversion to cartridge firing, specifically trying one of the great conversion cylinders being manufactured.
Too, there are a number of really well made copies out there- Pietta, Uberti, Lyman, Santa Barbara, Armsport, Navy Arms- have I missed any ? The problem is spare parts and conversion cylinders. Will they fit the Santa Barbara or the Lyman guns ? Or are the 1858 conversion cylinders limited to Pietta and Uberti ?
I'm hoping to stumble across one on the used market, any advice would be most welcome.
 
I have Remmies in many different flavors; Santa Barbara, Lyman, ASM, ASP, and Pietta. Only one I don't have is Uberti. For the most part, cylinders are not interchangeable between brands. Even the older Pietta parts are not 'drop-in' for the newer CAM/CAD Piettas. I will say this much; the Santa Barbara is built like a tank, with the tightest lockup of all of them. In battery the cylinder feels like it's welded in place. The new Piettas are very well built like a precision machine and the parts from one will definitely drop right in to another including barrels, etc.
Many places selling conversions will fit the cylinder to your gun for a small fee.
 
arcticap said:
The Euro Arms Remingtons will swap with the Uberti Remington cylinders also .
Click to expand...
I can testify that this is mostly correct. I have a Euroarms (Armi San Paolo) Remmie, as well as an Uberti, and conversion cylinders made for Ubertis will work in either one. But I wouldn't swap a single conversion cylinder between guns of different brands, because minor adjustments might have to be made for each gun. Once adjusted, it's a good idea to keep each conversion cylinder with the gun to which it belongs.

Note also that the Euroarms (ASP) Remmie -- no longer made -- is somewhat lighter built than the Uberti. For example, the top strap is noticeably thinner. For that reason, although a conversion cylinder will work in an ASP, the Uberti is a better candidate for conversion.
 
The Lyman branded 1958s were made by either Uberti or ASP depending on the vintage.

Since you are looking on the used market, don't forget Armi San Marco.
They can be great buys because they got a bad reputation for quality problems at the end of their run around the turn of the millennium, but some of their earlier pieces were gorgeous and well made.
That said, it can be a bit of a crap shoot with ASM but most I've seen first hand have been nice.
 
Captain*kirk said:
I have Remmies in many different flavors; Santa Barbara, Lyman, ASM, ASP, and Pietta. Only one I don't have is Uberti. For the most part, cylinders are not interchangeable between brands. Even the older Pietta parts are not 'drop-in' for the newer CAM/CAD Piettas. I will say this much; the Santa Barbara is built like a tank, with the tightest lockup of all of them. In battery the cylinder feels like it's welded in place. The new Piettas are very well built like a precision machine and the parts from one will definitely drop right in to another including barrels, etc.
Many places selling conversions will fit the cylinder to your gun for a small fee.
Click to expand...
You're right: The Santa Barbara is built like a tank. I have one I bought used about 15 years ago for $99 (!). It's in perfect condition, including its finish. I personally wouldn't get a conversion cylinder for it, even if I could find one; just rubs me the wrong way.
 
I would recommend to buy a more recent production Uberti or Pietta for their first Remington, especially if they want to be able to get parts for a used gun and have a conversion cylinder.
And also for the easy availability of extra percussion cylinders.
Another factor is whether there's any future interest in buying an Uberti 1858 Revolving Carbine or not, since the revolver conversion and percussion cylinders interchange with it.

Uberti base model 1858's have long had a drift adjustable front sight, whereas Pietta only recently added that feature.
Pietta is the largest seller of target models that have a rear adjustable sight, and should be easier to find on the used market.
 
One other thing to bear in mind; the Piettas boast a slightly larger grip and frame than the older ASM/ASP and Uberti guns, which a lot of people dislike (as the latter are closer to the original Remington scale) but if you have larger hands and longer fingers, can give you a good knuckle-rapping especially with heavy loads. The Pietta models give slightly more clearance, at least for me.
 
I have my eye on two listed 1858's at another forum, both Pietta; one which comes with an already fitted 45lc conversion cylinder but no percussion cylinder. The other, a sheriffs model comes with a two extra cylinders.
 
Howdy

I bought my EuroArms Remmie brand-spanky new way back in 1975.

pmjkHCsvj.jpg




About 15 or 20 years ago I got interested in buying a conversion cylinder for it.

pnfrtVp2j.jpg



I chose the six shot 45 Colt cylinders that were being sold under the R&D name at the time. The reason I went with this style is absolutely no modification was necessary to the frame. It is so quick and easy to pop the cylinder out of the Remington for loading and popping it back in, that it was a no brainer for me.

I did not know which cylinder would fit my Remmie, they had two versions, one for Ubertis and one for Piettas.

Here is how I solved the question of which cylinder to buy: Taylors had a deal back then (they were the sole distributor for the R&D made cylinders). I shipped them my Remmie. Their gunsmith determined that the Pietta cylinder would be the best fit. HOWEVER, the cylinder needed a little bit of fitting. He used a raw Pietta cylinder that did not have the locking notches for the bolt cut into it yet. He mounted my revolver on a fixture which took note of the position of my bolt. Then he cut locking notches into the cylinder to match up with my bolt. The cylinder was a little bit too long for my revolver, so he chucked it into a lathe and trimmed it down a few thousandths to fit. Then he sent it out to have the raw steel at the front blued.

Now get this: All that custom fitting did not cost me anything. I shipped them the revolver on my dime, they did all the fitting, then they shipped the revolver back to me on their dime. All I paid was my shipping to them, and I paid for the cylinder. What a deal! I don't know if Taylors still does this, but it is worth looking into, particularly if you don't know which cylinder to buy. Even if they charge for fitting, it is worth it.

By the way, to be legal they shipped my Remington back to me with the percussion cylinder in place, so it was not a firearm. The new cylinder was in its own box inside the package.
 
arcticap said:
"The ASM Remingtons will also use the Pietta cylinders ...I swap them in mine all the time .
The Euro Arms Remingtons will swap with the Uberti Remington cylinders also .
Makes for good swaping out conversion cylinders ...."

I suppose that there could be differences based on when a gun was made.
Click to expand...

There are sometimes slight differences, but when dealing with conversion cylinders, I was lucky that somebody knew my Armi San Marko would work with something made for a Pietta Remington 1858. It's seems to be akin to going to the auto parts store, and not knowing what part cross indexes to ones original part... :confused:

LD
 
Having just purchased a Pietta cylinder for my Remmy Sheriff, I can offer the following:
The Taylor's website states that if you buy a firearm through them, they will fit the conversion at no charge. Not sure if that would include fitting one for free to a gun you didn't buy from them, but you could always ask.
Also, the Taylor's 6 shot .45 Colt cylinder for the '58 Remmy does not have any safety notches. This means load five and carry on an empty chamber unless loading at the firing line. The Howell's website mentions there is one safety slot cut, which means you could possibly load 6 safely if you are so inclined. The Taylor's is a little cheaper as well, not by much.
 
electricfactory said:
I have my eye on two listed 1858's at another forum, both Pietta; one which comes with an already fitted 45lc conversion cylinder but no percussion cylinder. The other, a sheriffs model comes with a two extra cylinders.
Click to expand...
If it's fitted for a conversion with no C&B cylinder, either the seller would have to ship the gun minus cylinder and cylinder separately (two different shipments) or if one, you would have to go through an FFL and pay their fees. Just so you're aware.
 
Captain*kirk said:
If it's fitted for a conversion with no C&B cylinder, either the seller would have to ship the gun minus cylinder and cylinder separately (two different shipments) or if one, you would have to go through an FFL and pay their fees. Just so you're aware.
Click to expand...

That is incorrect. Perfectly legal to do what Taylors did for me. The revolver was shipped with the Cap & Ball cylinder in place, thus it was technically not a firearm. The conversion cylinder was placed in a separate box, the box it is normally sold with, and the conversion cylinder inside its box was placed inside the same package as the C&B revolver. If the conversion cylinder is not in place in the revolver, it is only a part, and is not regulated. That is exactly what Taylors did for me all those years ago and the law has not changed. Taylors did not go through a dealer sending my Remmie back to me, the package with C&B cylinder in the revolver and the conversion cylinder in its own little box was shipped directly to the local UPS depot where I picked it up. I only did that because I did not want the package sitting on my doorstep waiting for me to come home.

Captain*kirk said:
The Howell's website mentions there is one safety slot cut, which means you could possibly load 6 safely if you are so inclined.
Click to expand...

You have to look very carefully at what Howell offers. He does not offer a six shot 45 Colt conversion cylinder for the 1858 Remington. He only offers five shot 45 Colt cylinders for the 1858 Remington. This is because he sold the rights to his patent for a six shot 45 Colt cylinder for the 1858 Remington (the one that angles the chambers ever so slightly so the rims will not overlap) to Taylors a number of years ago. Taylors now has another company making the six shot 45 Colt conversion cylinders for the 1858 Remington. Howell does offer a six shot 44 Colt conversion cylinder for the 1858 Remington. Not 45 Colt. He is forbidden by the patent he sold from making a six shot 45 Colt conversion cylinder for the 1858 Remington. Check his website:

https://www.howellarms.com/1858-remington

And before anyone asks, the chambers on the six shot 45 Colt conversion cylinder are angled less than 1/2 of one degree. This does not affect accuracy at all, my Remmie with its conversion cylinder is the most accurate 45 Colt revolver I own. More accurate than my Colts, Ubertis, and Rugers. The chambers on my six shot conversion cylinder are so accurately machined that I use it as a cartridge gauge for all my 45 Colt reloads. If a loaded round drops into the R&D chambers, it will drop into the more generous chambers of my Colts, Ubertis, and Rugers.
 
By the way, my old EuroArms Remmie was actually made by Armi San Paolo.

The marking DGG inside a circle, on the underside of the barrel, usually hidden by the loading lever, is the way Armi San Paolo identified their products.

pojQGDM8j.jpg
 
Better look again Driftwood,

Driftwood Johnson said:
You have to look very carefully at what Howell offers. He does not offer a six shot 45 Colt conversion cylinder for the 1858 Remington. He only offers five shot 45 Colt cylinders for the 1858 Remington. This is because he sold the rights to his patent for a six shot 45 Colt cylinder for the 1858 Remington (the one that angles the chambers ever so slightly so the rims will not overlap) to Taylors a number of years ago. Taylors now has another company making the six shot 45 Colt conversion cylinders for the 1858 Remington. Howell does offer a six shot 44 Colt conversion cylinder for the 1858 Remington. Not 45 Colt. He is forbidden by the patent he sold from making a six shot 45 Colt conversion cylinder for the 1858 Remington. Check his website:
Click to expand...

https://www.howellarms.com/1858-remington/gated-1858-pietta-45lc-conversion-kit-mezd7

AntiqueSledMan.
 
OK, I stand corrected.

But with his more conventional conversion cylinders, that have a cap with six separate firing pins he is not making any that are six shot for 45 Colt. I guess the design you are showing is different enough from the patented version that he is not restricted from making it.
 
DJ, if you go to the bottom of the "Remington conversion cyls" you'll see several 6 shot 45 C cyls to choose from. I think the Pat. has expired or Taylor's isn't enforcing it or whatever but Kenny is selling 6 shot 45 C cyls.

Mike
 
Without instigating controversy is there a reason to prefer the Pietta version over the Uberti, or vice versa ?
 
electricfactory said:
Without instigating controversy is there a reason to prefer the Pietta version over the Uberti, or vice versa ?
Click to expand...

The Pietta is a bit beefier and some folks think the larger grips fit larger hands better.
The Uberti is sized closer to the original.
I don't have any problem with the functionality of either
 
45 Dragoon said:
DJ, if you go to the bottom of the "Remington conversion cyls" you'll see several 6 shot 45 C cyls to choose from. I think the Pat. has expired or Taylor's isn't enforcing it or whatever but Kenny is selling 6 shot 45 C cyls.
Click to expand...

Right you are. Thanks for pointing that out to me. That must be a fairly recent development.
 
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