Seismic Ammo’s Extremely Heavy Projectiles in 9mm, .45 ACP, and 12 Gauge

[mcb]

185 gr 9mm, 325gr 45 ACP, and 2.5 oz 12 gauge slugs. He will probably put me on his ignore list but the first user I though of when I saw the advertising for this new ammo was @Varminterror p=mv right in the advertising.



https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2...heavy-projectiles-in-9mm-45-acp-and-12-gauge/

Not sure it will replace the tried and true 9mm and 45 ACP self defense selections out there but it certainly would be interesting ammo to try in a suppressed 9mm and 45 ACP. Assuming it expands reliably it would be an interesting way to increase your kinetic energy AND momentum in both cartridges while retaining good suppressor performance.

The 9mm is using Shell Shocks two piece 9mm case. No picture of the 45 ACP yet. It will follow shortly probably waiting on Shell Shock to tool up for the 45 ACP version of the case, just a guess.

I wonder if the apparent new propellant they are using will eventually be available to re-loaders, only available to the bigger ammo manufactures or kept propitiatory?

The 2.5 oz slug makes my shoulder ache just thinking about it. I have shot a few 2.25 oz turkey loads in my day and even if that 2.5 oz slug is only doing 1000 fps its going to get your attention when it goes bang.

 

[IlikeSA]

Well they do say mass is a constant and velocity is variable. I would love to see the speeds some of these are going. I'm going to guess 500 fps for the 9mm and 45 ACP. Im not familiar with shotgun slugs so no guesses there.

 

[mcb]

Well they do say mass is a constant and velocity is variable. I would love to see the speeds some of these are going. I'm going to guess 500 fps for the 9mm and 45 ACP. Im not familiar with shotgun slugs so no guesses there.

The article claims a muzzle velocity of 950 feet for the 9mm but does not say barrel length. Assuming that velocity is true, even from a 5 or 6 inch barrel, that would be impressive.

 

[LRDGCO]

So, interesting.

Questions arise: Will very, very long bullets stabilize at the twist rates for 9mm and 45acp? How will the nifty-doodle, plastic fantastic pistols with their polygamy (yes, I know polygonal) rifling respond to these lead bullets? Is anyone else amused by the fact that 135 years after the creation of smokeless powder and the ushering in of the high velocity era, "technological advancement" means a smokeless powder that can deliver large chunks of soft lead at relatively low velocities? Will the world be able to resist 45acp ammo at 325 grs and 600 fps?

 

[JohnKSa]

They don't have to be very long, depending on how they are made. Unless I'm running the numbers wrong, if they are using a frangible core based primarily on tungsten they should be able to make a bullet that is 185gr in weight and still about the same length as a lead core 9mm bullet.

 

[mcb]

Re-ead the article, it says they are simple HP lead bullets, no exotic materials used.

"I know what you’re thinking, and the answer is “no.” These aren’t compressed tungsten or anything exotic; they’re just lead and they’re just large bullets."

 

[Deus Machina]

I can see the ideas behind the pistol rounds. Done right, you may have more inertia, which can lead to being able to expand more or penetrate deeper. I'd have to see some results on that, because traditionally the easiest way to get more energy is with more speed.
The shotgun rounds sound like an answer without a question. I've never heard complaints about 1oz or 7/8oz slugs' performance. Even downloaded, mini shells, and 'controlled recoil' do plenty of damage in appropriate range, and non-sabot slugs aren't often expected or designed for expansion. Not much need for it when a .7" hole penetrates a lot of important stuff. Pushing one twice as heavy just sounds like it would go through all of the important stuff, plus some stuff behind it.

 

[lemaymiami]

This reminds me a bit of the old Kinetic ammo - that was guaranteed to penetrate standard soft body armor... the secret (if there was one...) was simply a very hard round that was in fact a very good penetrator... Since I was in police training at the time I remember sending out an alert to other outfits to be on the look out for these kind of rounds..

 

[Varminterror]

If only the market were ready to discuss ammunition measured in slugs...

 

[ATLDave]

"...less felt recoil, due to slower burn of the powder, which spreads the recoil impulse over time."

Fake news. In semi-auto handgun with a reciprocating slide, there is no way for people to "feel" the burn rate of the powder. And slower powders generally create more gasses and more recoil than faster ones in pistol applications.

 

[jmorris]

Factory major 9.

 

[mcb]

If only the market were ready to discuss ammunition measured in slugs...

Maybe we need to create the kilo-slug or even a mega-slug. That poor 185 gr 9mm bullet only masses .000821 slugs. 821 M-slug might have more market appeal.

 

[Varminterror]

Except slugs aren’t metric! USC units prefer to make some new random name for new magnitude orders, rather than the metric, base 10 prefix system.

 

[mcb]

True we would have to use the mass of the King in slugs to create a new larger unit of mass.

 

[Zaydok Allen]

I wonder if the apparent new propellant they are using will eventually be available to re-loaders, only available to the bigger ammo manufactures or kept propitiatory?

I would think given the special nature of the ammo they are trying to sell that hey would keep it proprietary.

The article claims a muzzle velocity of 950 feet for the 9mm but does not say barrel length. Assuming that velocity is true, even from a 5 or 6 inch barrel, that would be impressive.

Indeed it would be impressive, and the propellant capable of doing that out of a 9mm case must be impressive! There aren't too many 5" barrel 9mms out there though that anyone is going to carry. Seems they are all competition guns.

I guess it I was going to carry a gun with that length barrel, I'd just carry my 5" 10mm.

I imagine on a fixed sight gun these heavy projectiles are going to hit quite high. Going to take some serious adjustment.

 

[Speedo66]

A .357 on that scale, perhaps 250g, might be an impressive short range game load out of a carbine.

 

[ATLDave]

Indeed it would be impressive, and the propellant capable of doing that out of a 9mm case must be impressive! There aren't too many 5" barrel 9mms out there though that anyone is going to carry.

A regular, full-sized 1911 has a 5" barrel.

 

[ATLDave]

Except slugs aren’t metric! USC units prefer to make some new random name for new magnitude orders, rather than the metric, base 10 prefix system.

 

[TomJ]

How much different is this than a 180 grain 40 caliber bullet?

 

[ATLDave]

The 9mm is slightly slower than a full-power 40 180 grain projectile.

 

[jmorris]

How much different is this than a 180 grain 40 caliber bullet?

5 grains heavier, .045” smaller diameter and around 40 FPS slower.

 

[TomJ]

Am I wrong in thinking that this may be useful if you ony have 9mm guns, but offers no real benefit to those of us with 40's?

 

[ATLDave]

I wonder if the apparent new propellant they are using will eventually be available to re-loaders, only available to the bigger ammo manufactures or kept propitiatory?

They may be using a proprietary blend, but what makes you think they'd need something radically different than a slow pistol powder? As you increase projectile weight, the speed of the powder generally goes down (the projectile's inertia helps create the conditions for more complete burn of a slower powder). My guess is that something in the burn rate of AA#9 would work fine, and probably give a 100% fill.

 

[Walkalong]

Fake news. In semi-auto handgun with a reciprocating slide, there is no way for people to "feel" the burn rate of the powder

I disagree with certain loads. That said, it is definitely BS for this application, just marketing. Maybe not as sharp, but still heavy. They try to give the impression of low recoil for the caliber, which is BS.

 

[Zaydok Allen]

A regular, full-sized 1911 has a 5" barrel.

Oh right, that's true, and lots of folks carry 1911s.