Short action vs Long Action

[Master of Arms]

When directly compared to conventional, long-action calibers, the 270 WSM, 7mm WSM and 300 WSM exceed (depending on bullet weight and type) the ballistics of the 270 Win., 7mm Rem. Mag. and 300 Win. Mag. but the power that can be achieved with the long action is greater than the short.

What do you think? This should be good.

 

[JesseL]

The answer really depends on what kind of target shooting you're doing or what game you're hunting.

For serious long range target shooting, I'd pick the 6.5-284 because of the availability of high quality, high BC .264" bullets, and good brass.

For all around use, the .308 would be nice. It's available everywhere and is a pretty good jack-of-all-trades.

If really big North American game hunting is intended, the .300 WSM might be a better choice than the others, simply due to being able to use heavier bullets.

 

[cracked butt]

I'm not 100% on this, but I would think that you'd want a long action for the 6.5x284 in order to take as much advantage of the case capacity as possible by not needing to seat the bullets so deep in order to work in the magazine.

If you want something in 6.5mm, a 6.5 creedmoor would fit in a short action and give you ballistics 100-200 fps slower than the 6.5x284.

If you can't kill something with a 6.5x284, a .260 remington, or a .308, you will certainly need more gun than a .300 WSM

 

[Master of Arms]

6.5 by .284 ammo seems a bit high and not so easy to find.

 

[Tarvis]

6.5-284 (norma, right?) is more of a long range bench rest cartridge, right?

 

[skinewmexico]

6.5x55, in a long action. The WSMs are notorious for not producing the velocities they are hyped as producing. The 6.5x284 eats barrels. And the gains you make with a short action over a long action, as far as weight and accuracy, are so small that they are more of an internet myth.

 

[Bearhands]

hunting what???????? buffalo or groundhogs? You're need to be clear on your desires..
It'd be very hard to vote on your poll without knowing your motives

 

[Bartkowski]

.308 would probably be your best choice. Plenty of rifles chambered for it, lots of ammo.

The .300 win mag will exceed the 300 wsm, especially if you handload. The 7mm rem mag is able to be bought at most stores that sell ammo and is pretty much the same ballistically as the 7mm wsm. The .270 wsm does offer an advantage, but I hardly ever see ammo for it.

 

[Master of Arms]

hunting what????????

What you would hunt with the calibers listed which I think would exclude a buffalo.

 

[Shawnee]

None of the above.
The two best - hands down - are the .243 and the 7mm/08.

 

[Regolith]

I'd have chosen the 6.5-284 if you had only asked about target shooting, but I'd say .308 is better if you're adding in hunting to the mix. It has a much wider variety of choices for ammo, and it's relatively common, which means if you're hunting in the middle of nowhere and find you've forgotten the ammo, the nearest place that sells gun stuff is far more likely to sell .308 than 6.5x284.

 

[IndianaBoy]

For serious long range target shooting, I'd pick the 6.5-284 because of the availability of high quality, low BC .264" bullets, and good brass.

I agree with the assertion but the terminology is just a tad wrong.

High BC/Ballistic Coefficient is better than Low BC.

 

[IndianaBoy]

An aside:

Just get a 30-06. Perfect compromise between a 308 and 300 Win Mag.

Sure it's a long action. So what? I've never seen anyone short stroke a bolt action. I simply do not understand the desire for a short action. I understand the theoretical benefits, aside from the extreme benchrest crowd, I find them academic at best.

 

[JesseL]

IndianaBoy, you're right. Somehow I was thinking low drag and high BC at the same time and got an inaccurate amalgam. Fixed now.

 

[Regolith]

Indiana: That's what I did, but my primary motivation was hunting, with target shooting (and not long range) a secondary consideration.

The .30-06 does seem to come in a wider range of factory loadings than the .308 (and is more common, having been around longer), but if you're going to be doing long range you're probably going to be hand loading anyway, at which point the only advantage the .30-06 has is velocity.

That said, if I were going to do it again, I'd get something in .308 or 7mm-08, mostly due to recoil reasons. Right now I'm contemplating filling the hollow synthetic stock with lead shot to reduce felt recoil during bench resting. I fired 32 rounds when I sighted it in last week (using 165 grain rounds at 2800fps), and my shoulders hurt like hell for the next couple of days, despite alternating between left-hand and right-hand to even out the punishment.

 

[Master of Arms]

Just get a 30-06

C`mon everyone, lets all go buy a 30-06

I`m not shallow but I`m never buying a 30-06 because everybody and their mama has one. Yeah it`s a great caliber but there are many others that are just as good if not better. Short vs Long

 

[Regolith]

And everyone and their mother doesn't have a .308? That's a very strange reason to buy or not buy a gun. It's probably one of the best all-around cartridges out there.

 

[Master of Arms]

Regolith, Just foolin around, no biggie. Oh, I don`t have a .308------yet.

 

[sarduy]

i voted .308... but a 30-06 with a light bullet (125gr-150gr)is my favorite for small animals and a heavy bullet (180gr-225gr)for everything alse...
hell, you can kill anything with a 30-06

 

[skinewmexico]

I`m not shallow but I`m never buying a 30-06 because everybody and their mama has one. Yeah it`s a great caliber but there are many others that are just as good if not better. Short vs Long

I'm the same way about the 308.

 

[Shawnee]

"...buying a 30-06 because everybody and their mama has one."


LOLOLOL ! That's the only reason to buy a .308 or .30/06.

 

[USSR]

6.5x55, in a long action. The WSMs are notorious for not producing the velocities they are hyped as producing. The 6.5x284 eats barrels. And the gains you make with a short action over a long action, as far as weight and accuracy, are so small that they are more of an internet myth.

+1. If you're trying to get one rifle for both hunting and target shooting, you're barking up the wrong tree.

Don

 

[ArmedBear]

I see no reason for getting a WSM in a heavy gun with a 26" barrel.

I see a reason to get a .308-series round (e.g. 7mm-08) in a lighter gun. But if I want a big magnum, having a shorter case does what for me, really?

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

This is a seriously jacked up question. In all honesty, not to be rude, but several facets of the question make NO sense. You're asking about short mags vs. long mags. Which is slightly different from asking short action vs. long action, in a vacuum. Then you're asking about what caliber for hunting AND target shooting. Two different questions. And then you don't include very many choices at all, and one of your choices (.308) is not really a magnum in any sense of the word, either long or short. Plus, I disagree with the oft-claimed allegation you repeat here that the 7mmWSM and .300 WSM beat the Remmags - I don't believe they do. They can match or almost match the traditional long mags in light bullet weights with the advanced powders they use, but on the whole, they are well behind the traditional mags in ballistics. Now the .270 WSM does indeed best the .270 win by a little bit, without question.

I'm afraid we need to kill this thread and start over with a new poll, by asking a question with a more narrow focus, so that it can be answered/addressed.

What are you trying to do? Hunting? Hunting what? I try to go with the smallest caliber that will work extremely effectively for the game in question, so as not to overkill on recoil, noise, ammo cost, and barrel life. Target shooting? In that case, the answer is going to be 6.5-284, since there are (a) several accurate platforms and custom barrels for the caliber, and (b) very good quality brass and bullets available from Norma, Lapua, Sierra, and others.

A good case can be made that the .270 WSM is the ultimate long range hunter round, arguably, since it's somewhat light recoiling, yet uses a large enough bullet to take down largish game such as moose, and it's about as laser-like of a trajectory as you're going to find. You can extend your PBR out to 250 or even 300 yards, depending upon game vital zone size. But I still wouldn't get one over the .270 win because the ammo is much more expensive, and it's gonna be more of a barrel-burner, and the .270 win will EASILY do everything I want it to do and more. I just cannot imagine ethically taking a shot past 250 yards - too much risk of missing - I'm gonna wait and get closer or let the game come closer to me. Well, the .270 win is very laser like to that distance anyway, so why go any bigger/ faster? The 7mm maggies are also a nice class of large game, long range rounds, but (a) they start to beat you up a bit more, and (b) I'd go with the traditional 7mm Remmag any day over the 7mm WSM. As for .300 mags, man that's just way overkill AFAI am concerned, unless maybe hunting goats out in the some high barren mountains where you cannot get any closer than 350 yards without the goat seeing you.

Reminds me of a few years ago, was hunting with this guy who was using a .300 Weatherby mag turnbolt (Weatherby of course). We did a drive, and jumped this tiny little mountain-country doe (couldn't have weighed 70 lbs), and he's shooting at it - twice - on the run. He misses - I couldn't help but think of the absurdity of the overkill there. Don't matter how big the caliber is - it ain't gonna help you make a hit.

 

[freakshow10mm]

7mm-08