Shot Fired at Gun Show

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Cactus Jack Arizona

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At Saturday's gun show in my area, there was the normal bustling around, the hall was alive with chatter, when suddenly a shot rang out. (I always wanted to use that tired old phrase). The hall went completely silent. People froze in the direction of the fired shot. Interestingly, the first thing I noticed was there was absolutely no panic amongst the crowd of men, women, and their children. Most people stayed where they were in order to let gun show security and local law enforcement get to the shooter without delay.

I've got to hand it to the gun show organizers, they announced the entire situation over the loud speakers once the facts had been learned. What happened was an exhibitor carried his CCW pistol into the hall. This is a contractual no-no that all the exhibitors sign. For some reason, this particular exhibitor felt it necessary to pull his personal firearm out to show a customer how to do something with it. This exhibitor assumed his CCW pistol was unloaded when he experienced the negligent discharge. :eek:

Fortunately, nobody was injured due to his stupidity. The exhibitor was visually shaken as a local Sheriff's deputy zip-tied the firearm slide open and put all his gun's ammo, including the spent casing into a zip-lock bag for evidence, and there were two hand written statements sitting on the table next to the firearm.

The party I was with left the gun show about 20 minutes later. However, I was completely amazed with how fast and professional the gun show security team and local LEO's handled the situation.
 
At Saturday's gun show in my area, there was the normal bustling around, the hall was alive with chatter, when suddenly a shot rang out. (I always wanted to use that tired old phrase). The hall went completely silent. People froze in the direction of the fired shot. Interestingly, the first thing I noticed was there was absolutely no panic amongst the crowd of men, women, and their children. Most people stayed where they were in order to let gun show security and local law enforcement get to the shooter without delay.
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I have experienced almost the exact same thing at a gun show and am bothered by the reaction (or lack thereof) of the crowd.

As gun people, we like to think that we are situationally aware, will know how to respond quickly to threats, etc. We often comment on those not as personal security oriented as being ill prepared, failing to recognize threats, etc.

If a gun shot rings out at a gun show where nobody is supposed to have loaded guns, then you know something bad is occurring. Either you have a careless idiot who both broke the rules and mishandled a gun and hence is a safety danger to everyone, or you have somebody who intentionally discharged a gun and hence is a danger to everyone. Either way, the standard response by most people is to stand and gauk like frogs staring into the light of a frog gigger, regardless of how well trained they are.

From a personal security standpoint, standing still usually isn't the most prudent response by folks who can't return fire if necessary. The most prudent action would be to start moving cover, toward an exit, or otherwise making oneself a less viable potential target. Given that one shot isn't enough to motivate the vast majority of people into some sort of action in this sort of situation, I have to wonder just how many shots it would take to finally drive people to react.
 
Negligence is way too kind a description for this kind of blatantly irresponsible action...
 
At a Gun Show one time, I was standing and admiring some old SAA Colts a seller had.

Guy walks up, picks up one of the old SAAs, then reaches over to the next Table, where the guy had all sorts of antique Cartridges, and, selects a few really old, live, .45 Colt rounds, and, he opens the Loading Gate, and is about to thumb one in, when I sort of put my hand over it and squeezed, making eye contact, where I said "Don't do that".


By then both Sellers were livid and coming around the Tables.


I have no idea what that guy would have done!!!


Maybe he wanted to see if it still worked???


Oye...
 
Double, you have an incredibly valid point. I myself just sat on the bench, like the others, waiting for news. To tell you the truth, I was a bit stunned. I believe it was the first time I've ever heard a gunshot away from a gun range. The more I've thought about it, the more I wish I would have been a bit more proactive in securing my own safety as well as the safety of my brother and friend.

If this ever happens again, and I hope it never does, I will react a bit more logical and proactive about my own security.

Honestly, it could have very well been someone's last day on earth had the barrel of the firearm been pointed just a few centimeters in a different direction than what it was. Besides the other exhibitors, there were also 200-300 of the general public in that area.

By the way, it was reportedly a .45ACP.
 
Most readers here can probably guage the "distance away" the shot was fired. In a crowd it may be hard to see the shooter but i would try to determine where it came from before i did anything. Not alot you can do if it's bang, and over, more than one shot and it's time to leave, you surely aren't considering, adding to the gunfight! If it were to be some kind of take over, multi person event, it could turn to a bloodbath in the next few seconds if everyone, or anyone rushed to help out. Let the police/security handle it. I usually wear my old cowboy rig, i might consider buying some 45 Colt, if it looked like a take over, then head out the door and find cover. As long as the rounds weren't getting too close, i been around gunfire before, no big deal.
 
Thank goodness no one was hurt!

This is firm confirmation of rules #1: All guns are always loaded
and #2: Don't point your firearm at ANYTHING you don't want to destroy.

-MW
 
And always carry a way to cut your guns zip ties if it all goes to hell ;-)

Of course that was sarcasm... But the more I think about it, not a totally bad idea.

Sent from my Droid using Tapatalk
 
I have experienced almost the exact same thing at a gun show and am bothered by the reaction (or lack thereof) of the crowd.
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I guess my question at this point would be what you would rather have as a response.

One would be that every single last one there runs and dives for cover, then "fights their way back to their car where they get their SKS" and come back just in case there is a bad guy?
On the other hand, everyone there could panic and well, panic. Run, scream and dive for cover, then wait around because nobody there wants to even remotely be around the guy with the ND in fear of losing their license.

I personally think the crowd as a whole made a very rational assessment. I think the crowd (in some sort of interlinked way) decided that the one shot, with no other violence of action, indicated an ND and well, went on their way after it was cleared.
Had there been something bad going on, it wouldn't have ended with one shot. There would have either been more shots, or shouting or *something.*
Let's face it, when a Platoon comes back from outside the wire and someone has an ND, they don't put the whole FOB on alert. Because when there are that many people handling that many guns ... and ND is likely, if not guaranteed. There simply is no reason to do anything other than further assess the situation until it either goes south or s a confirmed ND.
 
We had a person put a 7.62x54R round through the roof of one of our gun shows here. Heard there wasn't much reaction then either. I wouldn't react, and here is why.

I'll jump, just like I would to any loud noise. I'd recognize it as a shot milliseconds later.
1 shot - either its a ND, a suicide, the shooter has been physically restrained, or the shooters target has been eliminated.

2 or more shots - someone is going on a shooting spree and it's time to leave. My gun will be drawn while I leave. I won't be leaving by the main door if I can help it.
 
The good part was, no one was hurt. Most likely a very good hollow point round, once it hit the concrete, a flat disk.

What thoughts on a full magazine in a pocket, your pistol zip locked?

Me? No, Why? because we follow rules that make sense, if the ND firearm owner had done so, no ND. I take my unloaded pistol into the gun show, all live rounds in the vehicle, good place to steal a pistol, a gun show.
 
I don't know about your shows, but the one In Roanoke, Virginia is always packed, shoulder to shoulder and the entire room just sort of shuffles arond from table to table, no room to pass or move over at all. If a shot rang out and people started running for the exits about all you could do is duck under a table while the rest of the crowd tramples each other to death. Perhaps while there you could cut the zip-ties on your carry piece and load up just in case it was an attack of some sort rather than an AD so the perp won't find you just sitting under there waiting to be shot.

Interesting subject to consider for next time I go, hadn't really thought about that possibility before.
 
Double, you have an incredibly valid point. I myself just sat on the bench, like the others, waiting for news. To tell you the truth, I was a bit stunned. I believe it was the first time I've ever heard a gunshot away from a gun range. The more I've thought about it, the more I wish I would have been a bit more proactive in securing my own safety as well as the safety of my brother and friend.

If this ever happens again, and I hope it never does, I will react a bit more logical and proactive about my own security.
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I am in the same boat. About all I did was to hunker down and start looking for exits, not that I moved toward any. In fact, nobody seemed to move until the security folks came in from various doors several seconds after the shot. Then the voices of the crowd came back up to regular volume and people started moving anew. In our case, the ND was at the other end of the room. We got to see the vendor finish packing up his stuff and leaving with the cops. Neighboring vendors were quick to point out where he had shot the floor as there was a hole in the carpeting.

I wouldn't react, and here is why.

I'll jump, just like I would to any loud noise. I'd recognize it as a shot milliseconds later.
1 shot - either its a ND, a suicide, the shooter has been physically restrained, or the shooters target has been eliminated.
Click to expand...

Of course it could be that the shooter is looking for other particular targets (which does happen with some workplace shootings) and so people start to think that the shooter is done when he isn't.
 
I vote with those who say the crowd did admirably right
(reacting and responding are not synonyms)

about the worst case scenario in a crowded room with a ONE shot ND is "tactical-joe" going into his tactical hi-cap speed draw
and/or some wannabe idjit dropping yet another ND getting his safety off in a big hurry, or jamming a mag in

PS
so... if you whip it out... now.. where do you point it ???
(shoulder-to-shoulder people, wall-to-wall)
 
Double - the thought had crossed my mind, but I will put even money down that if the person looks like he's going to cause more trouble...there is a likely hood of a mob restraining him pretty quick. That or another shot will ring out, and possibly not by him. It's pretty stupid to go on a shooting spree where EVERYONE has access to guns and ammo.
 
The gun shows I go to must be the only ones where they make you clear and ziptie your CCW pieces.
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I think in this case the offending CCW belonged to a vendor. They often come in early before the gun check station is set up. The vendors usually sign a contract stating none of the firearms at their tables will be loaded. And you would think you could count on guys who attend gun shows almost every weekend... for a living... to be responsible. :scrutiny:

Anyway, had I been there that day I would probably have assumed it was an "approved" blank firing and gone about my business. After I climbed down from the ceiling.
 
I don't know why people are having a problem with the way the crowd reacted. The gun shows here are VERY crowded. If everyone panicked, someone would end up trampled. I guess it would depend on how close I was to the shot as to how I would react. Then again, I'm not exactly sure how I would, having not ever been in the situation.
 
Of course it could be that the shooter is looking for other particular targets (which does happen with some workplace shootings) and so people start to think that the shooter is done when he isn't.
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I doubt that even the most determined spree shooter would choose a gun show as a target. The object of spree shooting is to kill lots of unarmed, defenseless folks in a short time. That's pretty hard to do when most everyone in the building could produce a functioning firearm in less than 1 minute. It sorta takes all the fun right out of it for the spree shooter.

It's pretty stupid to go on a shooting spree where EVERYONE has access to guns and ammo.
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+1

I'd be puckered up tight enough to squeeze out a Tiffany's cuff link, but I don't believe I'd have panicked, dove for cover, or started trying to load one of my guns, unless there were more shots fired.

In short, I'd have gawked like every other "frog in the spotlight." The joy of that response is: 1. No one got trampled; 2. There were no wild "reaction" shots; and 3. Everything got back to normal pretty quickly.

KR
 
the whole CCW or not CCW into a gun show, goes round and round and round
but it does beg the question re: the relative risk factor

gun show, hundreds of strangers in a big crowded space, with hundreds of guns, lots of ammo, but all guns unloaded, zip tied (at least all visible guns)
vs. public gun range, dozens of strangers, all for certain loading and shooting

doubt any here would be real averse to a range day
all things considered, public gun show far safer than your average public range
nobody ducks, runs, or goes for their CCW defense gun at the sound of a shot, not even a kaboom, at range
and not even a good RO can eagle eye everybody at once
it is a risk you willingly accept (other than directly observed stupidity by others present)

me, if I am alone at range, I am far more likely to keep my CCW on me, than if range is well populated with shooters... I usually will take it off, clear it, lay it on table

mebbe that's just an 'odds' thing, the predator only gets to pick out one in the herd, before the herd reacts and responds, I dunno, but I never have worried about myself unarmed inside a gun show space


PS
at most gun shows, no matter the posted "rules" and/or "request" signs
they do not have Homeland Security scanners at door, they cannot even arrest you if you CCW in anyway, just tell you to leave if discovered
and some very reputable and very responsible people on this forum, will CCW into a gun show in such circumstance
it is naive to suppose otherwise
I don't, some do, not saying they should choose as I do, just saying zip ties you see at shows doesn't mean everything is zipped tied, you know
 
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