Slide release vs. racking the slide back
- Thread starter TheProf
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John Holbrook
Member
To reduce wear on the slide notch and the slide lock, it is reccomended that you pull back on the slide, which will drop the lock then release the slide.. That is the way the Army taught it.......
kk0g
Member
Releasing a slide lock is a fine motor skill that can become extremely difficult to do under the stress of a dynamic critical incident. Hand over the top of the slide is an easier gross motor skill so that's what I practice.
bigfatdave
Member
I use overhand, which works for every pistol I own except my Ruger mkIIIs (they have an internal bolt that requires a slingshot grip).
It works on almost any gun, doesn't wear down the slide latch, doesn't take me off target the way fumbling for the latch can, and only requires a grab and yank.
Corneredcat has a really good page on this subject for further reading:
http://www.corneredcat.com/RunGun/rack.aspx
It works on almost any gun, doesn't wear down the slide latch, doesn't take me off target the way fumbling for the latch can, and only requires a grab and yank.
Corneredcat has a really good page on this subject for further reading:
http://www.corneredcat.com/RunGun/rack.aspx
Boris bush
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- Jul 30, 2010
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Overhand is easier and is more of a gross motor skill. I have seen a couple times where a person tried the pinch with 2 fingers slingshot have a sweaty hand slip and not charge the pistol. Handover will be best.
I have a Springfield Micro Compact 1911. When I reloaded and hit the release it would jam, not always but still.
So i contacted the factory and they said it was designed to be done by sling shot method.
Since I started doing this I havent had a problem.
Think about how the gun works, after each shot the slide goes all the way back, it is designed to operate that way.
Also...
http://www.shootingusa.com/PRO_TIPS/JARRETT2-7/jarrett2-7.html
So i contacted the factory and they said it was designed to be done by sling shot method.
Since I started doing this I havent had a problem.
Think about how the gun works, after each shot the slide goes all the way back, it is designed to operate that way.
Also...
http://www.shootingusa.com/PRO_TIPS/JARRETT2-7/jarrett2-7.html
mljdeckard
Member
I don't think that the slingshot is as good because you don't have as good of a grip as you do with the overhand, and also it's done from a position weaker than the overhand grip. (You can pull it in tight with the overhand grip.)
Having said that, I don't think it's WRONG to use the slide release. It's another way to do it, and part of the manual of arms for the gun. If it were wrong, then we would create a market demand for slide stops with no bump or contour to do it manually, wouldn't we? Have you ever seen a flush-fitting 1911 slide stop with no bump?
Having said that, I don't think it's WRONG to use the slide release. It's another way to do it, and part of the manual of arms for the gun. If it were wrong, then we would create a market demand for slide stops with no bump or contour to do it manually, wouldn't we? Have you ever seen a flush-fitting 1911 slide stop with no bump?
ny32182
Member
I give the slide a yank with my thumb and forefinger; I think this is slightly faster than an overhand grip, but overhand should work fine as well, especially for those with less hand strength.
I'm a lefty, so depending on the exact pistol I might have a hard time hitting the slide catch even if I wanted to, but as with many controls on the "wrong" side I find there is actually some non-negligible advantages (some already mentioned):
1) "Slingshoting" works the same on all pistols; where as slide catches can be located in different places on different guns.
2) Requires a lesser degree of motor skill, which can be good under stress or in the cold where you may not be able to feel your fingertips well, or be wearing gloves.
3) No matter what I do with my grip, I can't ride the slide catch with my thumb, pushing it up or down and causing undesired operation as a result. I've seen many right handed people, including experienced shooters, do this at one time or another.
I'm a lefty, so depending on the exact pistol I might have a hard time hitting the slide catch even if I wanted to, but as with many controls on the "wrong" side I find there is actually some non-negligible advantages (some already mentioned):
1) "Slingshoting" works the same on all pistols; where as slide catches can be located in different places on different guns.
2) Requires a lesser degree of motor skill, which can be good under stress or in the cold where you may not be able to feel your fingertips well, or be wearing gloves.
3) No matter what I do with my grip, I can't ride the slide catch with my thumb, pushing it up or down and causing undesired operation as a result. I've seen many right handed people, including experienced shooters, do this at one time or another.
bigfatdave
Member
mljdeckard, there are a number of guns out there with internal slide latches. And my CZ52 has an external one that has no way to work it because it is a flat piece of metal with no bump.
While knowing how to use the lever is a good thing, pulling back and letting the slide move forward works every time. While I'm not about to remove the feature from any of my guns, I'm not going to add a bigger slide latch either, in fact for a carry gun I want the smallest one possible to decrease width/snags and to be harder to accidentally manipulate while firing.
While knowing how to use the lever is a good thing, pulling back and letting the slide move forward works every time. While I'm not about to remove the feature from any of my guns, I'm not going to add a bigger slide latch either, in fact for a carry gun I want the smallest one possible to decrease width/snags and to be harder to accidentally manipulate while firing.
I think it is not safe to assume you will have full use of both hands in a life-threatening defensive scenario.
Slingshotting the slide is great -- if you have the full use of both hands. What if one hand is hurt or restrained? What if you are in an awkward position and need that hand to support your body weight?
Isosceles is accurate and fast -- if you can safely stand in an ideal shooting position. I use it for accuracy competition, but I'd be stupid to think I could count on shooting in that position if I'm carjacked or mugged.
I'm not sure I'd carry a gun that MUST be slingshotted to chamber a round reliably. I draw some distinct lines between what I use for matches, and what I want to carry.
Semiautos offer a lot, and I put a lot of rounds through them for competition, but I find myself CCWing a small revolver, most of the time. One reason is that they still work the same when everything isn't "just so". It's a bummer they don't hold 15 rounds, but c'est la vie.
When I carry a defensive semiauto, it's an XD. It will chamber reliably using any technique I want, and it is less finicky than most semis IMO.
Slingshotting the slide is great -- if you have the full use of both hands. What if one hand is hurt or restrained? What if you are in an awkward position and need that hand to support your body weight?
Isosceles is accurate and fast -- if you can safely stand in an ideal shooting position. I use it for accuracy competition, but I'd be stupid to think I could count on shooting in that position if I'm carjacked or mugged.
I'm not sure I'd carry a gun that MUST be slingshotted to chamber a round reliably. I draw some distinct lines between what I use for matches, and what I want to carry.
Semiautos offer a lot, and I put a lot of rounds through them for competition, but I find myself CCWing a small revolver, most of the time. One reason is that they still work the same when everything isn't "just so". It's a bummer they don't hold 15 rounds, but c'est la vie.
When I carry a defensive semiauto, it's an XD. It will chamber reliably using any technique I want, and it is less finicky than most semis IMO.
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ny32182
Member
If your other hand is out of action, you are going to have a bit of a problem inserting a new magazine in the first place.
bigfatdave
Member
ArmedBear, that's a good point, and I agree that anything that requires two hands to operate is a losing plan ... but overhand still works best, particularly for malfunction clearing.
But you're right, I probably should practice running my carry guns one-handed more often, all I do is one-hand draw+fire, left and right hand alone at close range, and slow fire with right hand. I don't do ball&dummy/malfunction drills one-handed, and I should.
But how are you reloading one-handed anyway?
But you're right, I probably should practice running my carry guns one-handed more often, all I do is one-hand draw+fire, left and right hand alone at close range, and slow fire with right hand. I don't do ball&dummy/malfunction drills one-handed, and I should.
But how are you reloading one-handed anyway?
Especially with a gun that has an ambidextrous release and a magazine that either drops free or part of the way out of the gun, one-handed reloading is awkward, but doable. Two-handed reloading, where one hand inserts the magazine, and the other hand releases the slide immediately, is about the fastest way to have a gun reloaded and ready to fire, though, too. And it doesn't require FULL use of both hands. A .45 generally requires a reasonably strong grip for slingshotting.
It's true that clearing a malfunction is a two-handed move. That's another argument for a defensive revolver, at least when we're talking about pocketable or "backup" guns. Most modern semiautos are pretty reliable. Many are extremely reliable. I still don't trust the tiniest of them, though.
Everything is a tradeoff. You pays your money, you takes your chances.
It's true that clearing a malfunction is a two-handed move. That's another argument for a defensive revolver, at least when we're talking about pocketable or "backup" guns. Most modern semiautos are pretty reliable. Many are extremely reliable. I still don't trust the tiniest of them, though.
Everything is a tradeoff. You pays your money, you takes your chances.
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easyg
Member
I rack the slide, always.
If finding and tripping a slide stop is a fine motor skill then so is trigger control and sight alignment. I would love to meet the psycho who came up with the whole gross motor skill garbage. :banghead:
Slingshotting the slide will not work on every gun. The slide stop will.
Slingshotting the slide will not work on every gun. The slide stop will.
KBintheSLC
Member
The weak-hand method works fine for general use or defensive reloads. However, for pistol races, I doubt you will see anyone good doing it like that. It is much faster to use the slide release just after the fresh mag goes "click".
ny32182
Member
Yes they are, which is probably why hit percentages are so bad in defensive shootings. It sure isn't because they would have been hard shots to make on a static range at a paper target.
bigfatdave
Member
Drail, the finer points of trigger control and sight alignment will be hampered in a high-stress situation. Ever wonder why the hit percentage is so abysmally low in LEO shootings?
And I challenge you to make the slide stop work on my CZ52 or my KelTec P32 ... first find it (I can't) and then show us how to activate it.
And I challenge you to make the slide stop work on my CZ52 or my KelTec P32 ... first find it (I can't) and then show us how to activate it.
easyg
Member
I'm just curious, but exactly which guns have you shot that you could not rack the slide but had to use the slide-stop/release.
Personally, I've never seen any autoloader with a slide that couldn't be racked with either the sling-shot method or the overhand grasp method.
I've never seen one that you had to use the slide-stop/release.
Boris bush
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How comical. I was going to say the same thing!! I own both and would be allday trying to load from slide lock when the slide stop ALWAYS works. Besides I have no clue how a slide fully cycled back will somehow not work all the time.......
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