small 380/9mm ccw pistol

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moooose102

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i have just come into a small winfall of money, and i want to buy a small ccw pistol. i have been looking at the kel-tec 380 and ruger lcp, and am going out tomorrow to look at a 9mm kel-tec. i am a little iffy on a 380, it just doesnt seem like it has much power. but i want to be able to carry this thing ANYWHERE, WITH ANY CLOTHING. i just can not afford a colt, smith, or glock (i have never really like the looks of them anyways). so i am limited to lower end pistols. are there any d.a. or d.a./s.a. small pistols out there in the 250-300 dollar price range?
 
I have carried ince 1968 almost daily. I own both a P3AT, and a P-11 from Keltec,...both have over 1500 rounds ran through them. I carry the .380 most as it virtually dissappears, and I have all the confidence in the world in the .380 as an up close defensive round. You hear a lot of negative about the Keltecs. But keep them clean,..break them in, and they work. I am not afraid to get a little sweaty or wet,...or possibly scratch my Keltecs up. It's almost like they work better when they've been worked??? I have had Colts, Beretta's, Walthers, Ruger's and a lot of S&W's over the years. Still do. Still,....my Keltec has it's place. So does my S&W Model 36 3 incher......
 
Go full size

I guess I'm just old fashioned, but I like firepower if I'm having to jerk out my piece for self defense. I carry full size pistols concealed, and it only takes a little thought to be able to do that... inside the pants holsters, etc. to snug them up to your body.

I'm usually armed with a Ruger SR-9 (17+1) and two spare clips. Now, if we get into a "situation", I'm betting on my 9mm and 52 rounds, as opposed to your .380 and it's 7 or 8 rounds. I carry one of those "nearby" for backup.

If you're looking at .380's, I'd recommend a Walther PPK, PPKS or a Beretta. Their pistols are solid and easily concealable.

If you're new to concealed carry, you might want to invest some of that new cash in a few extra clips so you can carry enough ammo to finish a fight. As an ex-LEO, I firmly believe that extended shootouts go to the guy with the most ammo, and it's not uncommon for the first six or seven shots to go all over the place if you're not used to shooting under stress... like being shot at.

Depending on where I'm going and how I'm dressed, I often carry a Smith 4006 (11+1) and a couple of clips. That's a .40 caliber, and what I call a "big, ugly gun" for concealed carry. Looking down the barrel of that thing is like looking down a stovepipe... so it has a "fear factor" as well as firepower.

All of the weapons can be "helped" if you find ammo that's marked on the box either "Ultra shok", "for personal protection" or +P (just make sure your firearm will handle them).

If you're not a collector or have very many guns, your best bet would be to get both a concealed carry gun and a target pistol to help you practice shooting. There are a ton of .22 pistols out there that are also good back-up guns. I have a Walther P-22 and have run thousands of rounds through it, and if I'm just going out around the house, I'll stick that or my Beretta Bobcat in my pocket (another .22LR).

Concealed carry isn't just playing "hide a gun" with your clothes... it's a mindset you have to have. You need to practice, not only your shooting, but the different scenarios you might find yourself in where you need to use your hide-away. Shoot every week if you can.

What gun you carry will reflect your own experience in firearms and their use. Chasing fugitives and working undercover give you different ideas about how much you need to carry, and while I'm not a gun nut, I'm well armed and know how to use what I've got. You never want to come in 2nd in a gunfight... so make sure you've got enough gun to get the job done, and something light enough that you'll get off more than one shot.

Sorry to ramble, but I'm sleepy...:D

WT
 
I used to carry an XD-9 subcompact with 10+1 in IWB holster. As you can see...I'm in Las Vegas and with light closing, it's very difficult even to carry a subcompact.

I've had my P3AT for several weeks and LOVE it, absolutely love it. It's much better to have a 380 with 6+1 ON YOU, than have 45ACP or 9mm in your car, closet, etc.

I have no worries about 380 in federal hydrashock or other top-notch hollow points. It's not a feeble caliber as some portray it to be. Nobody, NOBODY wants to be shot with 380 JHP, and, double tap to center mass will stop anyone at close range. Don't listen to all these yahoo's who carry 1911's everywhere. For some of us with normal work/dress clothing, it is not feasible. And for a weapon that you NEVER (hope to) use, I prefer to keep it light and availabe, most imortantly.
 
Sure the .380 is not near as strong as a 9mm its still a solid defence load in my opinion. Its a whole lot better than nothing when someone is trying to kill you, unless its an angry chimp. I would hate to have to shoot an angry chimp with a .380.

Look for a nice used Sig P232. I got mine for around $450 if I remember correctly. It came with a nice Mitch Rosen Holster and a DeSantis Slide which coneals under a T-shirt with very minimal printing.
 
I'm not so well versed in 200-300 dollar guns... And you don't want to hear what I think of the ones I am familiar with. I'm not gonna say anything about Kel-Tec, but I did own one for about a week. My CW-9 is about the least expensive gun I've ever owned, other than mil-surp guns, and I think it's just about my favorite pistol. But I think they run for a bit over 400 dollars? Maybe a good used Glock, Kahr, Springfield XD, or maybe even a Sig... I'd trust a well made used gun way before a brand new "El-Cheapo" gun. If you plan on "enjoying" your shooting experience, the PF9 should not even be considered, IMO. I know this is the autoloading realm, but have you considered a little .38 special snubbie?
 
A couple things I've experienced. The PPK/S was the most comfortable carry for me, but wasn't 100% reliable. The .380 round FMJ had good penetration at 20', but the ammo is twice as high as my 9mm. I'm waiting on my IWB holster to start carring the XD9SC. Here in Texas, it may hit a problem in the summertime.
 
The Kel-Tec P-3AT is the smallest and most concealable (in a caliber I'm comfortable with) gun that I've seen. I carry it almost everywhere I go and my wife and kids, who know I CCW, can't even notice it's there 90% of the time.
 
either

Either would be a good choice. I carry a Keltec, they work, and are a good value.
It doesn't get any more concealable, with the possible exception of the Keltec P32.
The Ruger is a shameless copy of the Keltec. If it's not licensed by Keltec, I'm hesitant to support it. But it does appear to be better finished.
Right now Ruger is still trying to fill the pipeline, and price gouging is pretty common. I'll keep my Keltec, but I'll keep an eye on the Ruger situation.

I also. have quite a few other pistols, including 5 other .380s, a P11 and an Astra A75L which is almost the same size and weight as the P11.

The only other gun I routinely carry is my NAA Black Widow in .22 Magnum. that is the ultimate pocket pistol, and the .22 mag doesn't give up much to .380 IMHO.

I occasionally carry a .380 Llama, which is probably the same size as a PPK, but more slim. But you can't buy those anymore except used.

At any rate, I'm confident the .380 will do what needs doing. I very rarely find myself in places or situations where I felt I needed more.
 
Kel-Tec P3AT for me.

The Kel-Tec P3AT is an excellent little gun that is easy to carry, easy to hide and is powerful enough to get the job done if you do your part. I have carried one for serveral years and practice with it regularly. I have yet to experience any failures of any kind.

I know that there are a lot of folks who subscribe to the "bigger is better" philosophy and I agree that a hit from a .45 is a lot more effective than a hit from a 380, but I believe that the best CCW gun for you is the one that you will carry each and every time you leave the house. If you can do that with a full size 1911 .45 ACP, more power to you. I cannot, but I can carry the Kel-Tec with me and conceal it in any clothing I am wearing.
 
romma

That kahr P380 is one awsome little 380. Smaller than the kt or the Ruger and just eaks in quality. They spared nothing. Not cheap either but neither is life. My dealer priced me $550 out the door. I can certainly live with that, as it is everything that I ever wanted out of a ccw pocket gun. I try not to compare other guns with the price range of the kt's . for the money the kt's are OK, just not my cup of tea..
 
i have been carrying a taurus 24/7 45acp this past fall and winter. no problem in cold weather concealing it iwb. but with summer coming. it is going to be very dificult at best to cover up a full size auto, especially because i do not like to get hot and sweaty. most of the summer its shorts and a t-shirt for me. less if i can get away with it. i really do not want a revolver. i got stung pretty bad on a used revolver many years ago, so i am pretty much a new pistol buyer. that way, i know what i am getting is not somebody elses problems. didnt make it out to look at the 9mm today, i went shooting this morning, and my dog ran off, had to hunt all over to find her. tommorow 4 sure!
 
The tiny Ruger LCP is within your price range. It is a .380. For a few dollars less you can get the KelTec in .380. But it is a crap shoot. You may get a winner, you may not.

If you want a 9mm, look at the Kahr CW9 which goes for $379. in these parts. It gives you eight rounds of 9mm in a small 19 oz. package that is very easy to shoot well.
 
It's likely more than you want to spend, but I have a Beretta 85 BB that I love. It's a little big to be considered a "small" gun but its still very concealable, is a dream to shoot and has been very reliable.
 
If you truly want a gun you can carry anywhere/anytime, and cost is not a consideration, then personally, I would choose the guns in this order:
1. Rohrbaugh R9S 9mm
2. Ruger LCP .380
3. Kel-Tec P3-AT .380
4. Seecamp .380
5. NAA Guardian .380

They are all very good guns;
The Rohrbaugh is 9mm, but very expensive.
The Ruger is new and maybe a bit unproven, but so far has seemed to be a bit nicer than the almost identical Kel-Tec, but costs a bit more.
The Kel-Tec is the best compromise between weight, size, power, and cost.
The Seecamp is the smallest of all, but is heavy compared to the Ruger and Kel-Tec, a bit expensive, and hard to find new.
The Guardian is the heaviest, slightly larger than the Seecamp, but costs less.

You mentioned looking in the $250 - 300 range. If this is the case then your choice would be between the Ruger LCP and Kel-Tec P3-AT.
 
For your price range I would suggest......
CW9copy.jpg
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I'm a VERY skinny guy and I can conceal this gun IWB in any cloathing.
And Kahr offers tons of customer support if you want to upgrade the gun at a financially more convenient time, go for it!
 
Moooose,
If you want something with some firepower, try one of the Makarov's in 9X18. I shoot all kinds of weapons all the time, and that one is impressive. It's a $200 gun (which is in your price range) and it was the preferred weapon of every soviet bloc police force before the CZ's came on the scene. You can't do better than a gun that was field tested by the KGB.

The FEG PA63 in 9x18 is a Hungarian Makarov clone (blowback action), and I've heard that they are also excellent guns in that caliber. I haven't owned one of them, but my understanding is that they are excellent weapons (cost about $150-$175) when you can find them.

WT
 
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