Something interesting happened at the gun show today...

[BitterBeerFace]

So I was wandering around the gun show today, and noticed a nice little S&W 642 in a case. I ask if I can see it, the dealer pulls it out from under the glass and hands it to me. As always, I keep my finger well away from the trigger and take a closer look. I notice something that I shouldn't have seen... the butt-end of cartridges in the cylinders... I open it up, and no, they're not already fired (my first thought was potentially to allow dry firing). I drop 5 hollow points out of it, and the dealer says "holy ****".

Nothing bad happened, but I could certainly see someone a little too trusting or a less safety minded just assuming it's unloaded and potentially bad things happening from there.

I've been to a fair number of shows and never seen that before. This was a long-time and well known local dealer.

Have any of you had something similar happen at shows? Or even worse, accidental discharges?

 

[Bazooka Joe71]

Reason number 8,934 why you always treat a gun as if its loaded!

 

[Leanwolf]

BITTERBEERFACE - "Have any of you had something similar happen at shows? Or even worse, accidental discharges?"


Yep, surely have.

Except to make it clear, there is no such thing as an "accidental discharge." They are what I call in the truest sense of the word, "C.Ds.," or "Careless Discharges!"

That said, I've had a table several times at the Boise Gun Show. Abour eight months ago, while setting up on the morning of the g.s. opening, a guy who had a table two tables down the aisle from me, was putting a foreign semi-automatic .45 ACP on his table when BOOM!!

The 230 grains FMJ bullet hit the concrete floor about six feet from me and scattered concrete chips around like mini shrapnel. A piece hit my jeans covered leg but only stung. A friend of mine who had a table behind me got a blood blister from either a copper fragment or a concrete chip.

Fortunately, no one else was hit by the bullet.

Of course, the man was told to gather up his guns & stuff and leave immediately, which he did... embarrassed and apologetic as Hell and proclaiming, "I don't know how that cartridge got in that pistol!"

It got in his pistol because he was CARELESS!!! He didn't bother to check the pistol before leaving home.

About three years ago, another older man who had a table at every Boise gun show, had a Colt Govt. Model .45 ACP on his table. A guy asked to see it,. He handed it to him, the guy pointed it at the ceiling and pulled the trigger and BOOM!!!! SXT (same exact thing) as in the first episode, except no one was hit by fragments of a bullet. Table holder was told to pack up and leave then and there. Careless Discharge.

That's my story.

L.W.

 

[bogie]

Conversely, someone _could_ have loaded it - speedloader, whatever... There are folks out there who would like gun shows closed down, and they'd rationalize the death of a "gun nut" as being okay to do it...

 

[BitterBeerFace]

Leanwolf: Do you ask people to leave for something like what I encountered? A loaded weapon that wasn't carelessly discharged? Are there rules like "nothing except certain weapons by the 'guard guys' can ever be loaded"?

 

[Cannonball888]

Things like this just gives antis another reason to try to close gun shows.
IMO every pistol on display at a gun show should be disabled with a zip tie through the barrel and rifles by other means.

 

[sacp81170a]

That's why you check every gun if it's been out of your direct observation or possession at any time. I've heard of antis purposely putting rounds in the chambers of guns randomly at gun shows, like others have said. I wouldn't put it past some of them.

Rule #1: Treat every gun as if it were loaded until you confirm otherwise. (The italicized part is what extremists forget.)

 

[HardKnox]

now that sounds a little far fetched, someone who is anti gun going into a gun show with several bullets of whatever calibur, and sneaking the bullets into a gun in that specific calibur? i thought most antis couldnt even recognise the shoulder thing that goes up, and now someone is giving them credit for identifying and compromising specific guns at a gun show?

 

[El Tejon]

Hard, I don't put anything past the antis. Look at what the Enviromentalists are doing--shooting and poisoning cattle, arson of dwellings and motor vehicles, vandalism of property, etc.

All guns are always loaded. Sound familiar? Right, it's Rule #1.

All guns are always loaded. No, not "treat", they are loaded since if they were unloaded they would be worthless. All guns are always loaded. Does not matter if you "think" they are unloaded, as they are not, they are loaded.

Bitter, yes, it happens. People think that cable ties will somehow "disable" human stupidity.

Bitter, go to more shows and you will hear and see it more. It happened in Indianapolis a couple of times recently. Numbnuts are attracted to guns like moths to flame. Bravo to you for remembering that the Four Rules always apply even at a gun show were guard guys always check to see if the disabled guns are unloaded.

 

[RH822]

IMO every pistol on display at a gun show should be disabled with a zip tie through the barrel and rifles by other means.

At the the two shows I regularly attend in Indiana, every gun, long-gun or handgun is zip tied, customer ccw's included. I believe that may be a state requirement here in Indiana.

RH

 

[sacp81170a]

All guns are always loaded.

Not trying to be a jerk, but how do you check the bore for obstructions, cleanliness and condition, especially if you can't look down it from the breech? Do you point a "loaded" gun at your own head?

There are a few exceptions to rule #2. There is never an exception to rule #1. If you haven't checked it, it's loaded.

 

[BlindJustice]

USN - AD below decks during Security Alert was the last straw
for a Petty Officer 3rd Class... he went back to being an E-3 Able
Bodied Seaman in Deck Division.

 

[rdaines]

Last Fall at the Tulsa gun show a dealer was shot with a 410 shot gun. A case where the trigger guy thought it was unloaded, it wasn't.
And, yes, I've heard the possible urban legend of antis loading guns at shows. I'm sure anything is possible but hard to believe it is.

 

[Cannonball888]

People think that cable ties will somehow "disable" human stupidity.

No one is saying that. You can't disable stupidity. A zip tie just makes the gun safe. .

 

[Geronimo45]

I've heard the possible urban legend of antis loading guns at shows. I'm sure anything is possible but hard to believe it is.

I'm sure there's some real nutjobs in that movement that would consider it... but you'd think that the owner of the gun would be watching him to whom the gun has been momentarily given. After all, haven't we all seen The Terminator? Arnold picks up a few weapons, loads a shotgun he decided to purchase, and shoots the dealer. One would think that the gun folks would be on their guard against such things. But who knows?

 

[MKEITH]

Around here, all guns at the gunshows are disabled with a ziptie as soon as they are brought through the door.

 

[tinygnat219]

I beleive that some of the antis might do a little research. I wouldn't put it past them. That's why I always hand the cylinder back to the owner / dealer open, or the slide back with the magazine in my other hand.

 

[Cliff47]

I was at a gun show a few seeks back and as things were getting rolling about 9:00, there is a very loud "BANG". Heads swivelled in the direction of the noise, it got VERY quiet for about one minute. Turns out someone had dropped an ammo can that was loaded with ammunition on the concrete floor. It did reverberate.

One of the 'Rules of the road' at the show was that ALL actions would be tied with a zip-tie so that a round could not be inserted in the chamber. There have been members of Washington CeaseFire that have attended the shows and tried to insert a round in the firearm. It has gotten to where some of the vendors will pick up the pistol (rifle, shotgun), check the chamber, THEN hand someone the firearm for that 'closer look'. The firearm is then handed back to the seller, who then verifies the status of the chamber, prior to placing the firearm back on the table. May be extreme, but it works.

Good on 'ya for checking the chamber first. That must have raised the 'pucker factor' of the seller no end.

 

[sacp81170a]

It has gotten to where some of the vendors will pick up the pistol (rifle, shotgun), check the chamber, THEN hand someone the firearm for that 'closer look'. The firearm is then handed back to the seller, who then verifies the status of the chamber, prior to placing the firearm back on the table. May be extreme, but it works.

Extreme? I thought that was the basic procedure for any firearm. That's what I've always practiced and taught. It's a breech of safety rules and etiquette not to do it that way.

There have been members of Washington CeaseFire that have attended the shows and tried to insert a round in the firearm.

 

[Neo-Luddite]

The last couple of guns shows I've seen dealers just having weapons' triggers zip tied hard back in the 'fired' position of trigger travel and some actions similarly closed in the same manner.

 

[joplinsks]

Like another poster said, a discharge happened at the Tulsa Wanamacher show last fall. I walked by the aisle about an hour after it happened and there was glass everywhere and was a huge mess. Apparently the 410 shot went through a display case with a few people being hit by flying glass.

Another discharge happened at the last NW Arkansas show in Springdale about 6 weeks ago. A guy did what he thought was a dry fire and somehow lost a finger from it with the bullet eventually going into the ceiling.

They certainly happen despite all of the security, checks, and "four rules". Not that often, but they do happen.

 

[fishingjld]

i always wonder if i look like a big a**hole for checking the chamber everytime someone hands me a gun to look at. i just think it is the smartest thing you can do to avoid any kind of problems. YOUR SITUATION REINFORCES THIS THOUGHT! i did have a gentlemen at a local gun store hand me a pistol and not check it himself. when i did so he says very abruptly that its not loaded. i just thought wow but what if it was.

 

[Two Cold Soakers]

Quote:
It has gotten to where some of the vendors will pick up the pistol (rifle, shotgun), check the chamber, THEN hand someone the firearm for that 'closer look'. The firearm is then handed back to the seller, who then verifies the status of the chamber, prior to placing the firearm back on the table. May be extreme, but it works.

Extreme? I thought that was the basic procedure for any firearm. That's what I've always practiced and taught. It's a breech of safety rules and etiquette not to do it that way.

Same here.

ALWAYS check the chamber of EVERY gun before it leaves your hands and as it enters your hands.

 

[ArfinGreebly]

Rule #1

Reason number 8,934 why you always treat a gun as if its loaded!

Actually, this would be Reason #1 why you always treat a gun as though it's loaded.

At the very top of that list of reasons is the seeming tautology:

You always treat a gun as though it's loaded, because it's actually loaded.​

 

[Hoppy590]

the antis are not above doing it. after all. its for the children. and i read a story about one admiting to it. though it could have been anywhere from the front page of TIME magazine to the back page of STAR weekly.

i agree. dealers should make a habit of checking before and after showing a gun.

i do not think guns should be ziptied. i want to check bore and action. not have to ask politely while a dealer removes a zip tie for the 10,000th time that day because other people are too dumb/immoral to handle a firearm properly.