Spanish defacto US second official language

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Harve Curry: Cuchulainn, does that mean knife or cut or something like?
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It means the hound of chulainn. Cuchulain is an Irish myth, sort of a Hercules figure. He was born named Setanta, and he accidentally killed the guard dog of Chulainn (Cullan), and in payment took on the duties of the guard dog. Do a google search for cuchulainn or cu chulainn.

Harve Curry: Now we have schools teaching in foriegn language, metric system, anything to get away from traditional America seems to be the case.
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We had plenty of schools teaching in a non-English language then, too.

Metrification has nothing to do with taking America away from its roots. No offense, but that's absurd.

RileyMC: cuculainn: ‘Bilingual’ is the colloquial pc reference for ‘Spanish-speaking’ Did you not know that or or you still parsing words?
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Oh! You were being PC. Good for you. :rolleyes:

You're really undermining your credibility lashing out at me, by the way.
 
English *should be* made the official language of the US, because the status quo is GREATLY injurious to the economic hopes of legal immigrants who are hispanic-americans. By not taking measures to encourage the learning of English (by refusing to print anything issued by the government in Spanish), we relegate them to a subculture of discrimination and being on the fringe of economic society, because they are unable to get good jobs in the *traditional* sector, and unable to excel in school due to the language barrier, and thus get poorer grades and do worse on standardized tests - this keeps them out of the good colleges, by and large. If Hispanic-Americans were to do what was good for them, they'd be wholeheartedly in support of making English the official language. They are shooting themselves in the foot. Of course, it makes perfect sense that Bu$hco doesn't want to give them a helping hand up through such measures, because his fatcat friends need those unskilled low-wage workers in order to maximize profits. If you're racist, you undoubtedly *secretly* love the status quo, if you are insightful enough to see the *real deal* that is going on.
 
I suppose it's a fair inference that if all you had was something petty, then you have nothing of substance to refute the absolute truth I posted? :) Or were you responding to Riley?
 
My neice just finished the first grade. The school she attends has a spanish imulsion (sp?) theme to the first grade where mostly spanish and some english is taught to the students. By the end of the year all classes were taught in spanish only. She's practically fluent when speaking the language.

I guess in the big scheme of things, she will have an advantage over others who don't speak the language. Like it or not, Spanish speaking folks are a huge part of our population. Adapt or get left behind. I guess this school is helping the kids adapt.
 
I think I'm a biggot?

Hoo Hoo!

I for one am very irritated evry time I have to "press 1 for English". As a matter of fact, it used to be when you got that message, the english speaking person was first and then the spanish...now I find it is the other way around, and hell yes it pisses me off.

In Alabama (which some people consider to be a foreign country anyway :D ), it is increasingly difficult to order anything at a McDonalds without being able to speak Spanish. And 90% of the time those taking your order on't understand and either get your order wrong or have to get a translater involved. amd hell yes that opisses me off, too. I hate when they put all that crap on my friggin dogburger.

Also in Alabama, there is increasing MS-13 gang related violence that is escolating daily. That is not the point of this thread, but it is a factor in why a majority of the people I know who are upset about illegal immigration and its half brother biliguallism.

In addition, I used to own a Ford F350 Super Duty Crew Cab. My 4 year old son would often comment about those spanish men waving at us as we drove by...what he didn't understand was that those spanish men were day laborers, whom I would not hire because they would not or could not speak english, were flipping me off (my truck was VERY distinctive and they recognized me).

So when you add it all up, hell yes, I am an American and proud of it. I was blessed to be born into this great country and it angers me when people try to come here illegally or who refuse to 'Americanize" once they do get here. If that makes me a biggot, o.k. by me. If some think I'm suffering from inferiority, as one poster suggested, your dead wrong...I suffer from Pride in my Country.
 
GunsGoBoom,

My petty statement wasn't directed at you. :)

As for what you wrote, you make some valid points. But, I'm not ready to make English the official language -- mostly because that opens the door to forcing people to speak a particular language, and such forcing is a bit too un-American for my taste (I'm not saying you're advocating that; I'm just saying that I see that as a result).

As for it hurting them economically, you might have a point. On the other hand, I'll note that for the German speaking people -- for nearly a century -- a large number of local and state government catered to them, providing education in German. They didn't suffer economically as far as I can tell.

However, your argument makes more sense than this silliness about balkanization -- it's simply not true that this nation cannot survive a huge portion of the people not speaking English as their primary language.
 
"I guess in the big scheme of things, she will have an advantage over others who don't speak the language. Like it or not, Spanish speaking folks are a huge part of our population. Adapt or get left behind. I guess this school is helping the kids adapt."

The question is: adapt to what?

And why do we have to adapt?
 
The real issue is that certain types of people--teachers are one--are all too ready to "adapt" to anything. PC emanates from an amorphous identity, from passivity, from confiusion, from self-dislike, and, yes, sometimes from cowardice. The more aggressive will triumph--in this as in everything else.

The meek have inherited the earth--or at least good chunks of the United States of America.
 
No.

It is one thing to learn how to market to Latin America, another to become Latin American.

Bureaucracies "adapt" because they fear law suits (aggression). Businesses "adapt" because they fear losing market share. Teachers adapt because they fear not getting permanent status or getting mugged in the parking lot.

The issue is to adapt to what furthers your own strength, power, and security. We don't have to adapt to requests to do business in someone else's tongue. Strong societies "adapt" by absorbing what they need, no more, no less. Cultural openness, in today's PC world, is based on fear--fear of "making trouble." Successful cultures make trouble. Lots of it.
 
If that makes me a biggot, o.k. by me.
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This is America, sir, you can be whatever you want. :barf:

I was blessed to be born into this great country
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No doubt about that. Paging Dr. Darwin, Dr. Charles Darwin...

and it angers me when people try to come here illegally
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You mean like 98% of the descendent population? Man, I LOVE it when folks whip out "I'ze burne herr, so I gots rites", which is always the unspoken flip side of the "They were not born in America, so they don't" argument. (Isn't this what someone suffering from inferiority issues might drag out? Oh, wait, look below.)

If some think I'm suffering from inferiority, as one poster suggested, your dead wrong...I suffer from Pride in my Country.
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My diagnosis: "Fear of what you do not understand" and "isolationism". I support your "pride", but pride in a country as defined by one person [you] seems inherently dangerous. Unnatural fear almost always derives from inferiority specific "personal issues"...

With this, I shall bow out of this thread. Why? Because I am just noticing some "issues" of mine own as well as a personal inability to look at this particular topic with any hint of fairness. There, I call "bull????" on myself! :neener:
 
thereisnospoon,

There's MS-13 activity in my state too. But there's also English-speaking Crips, Bloods and so on. Gang activity is not driven by language. If all the MS-13s suddenly adopted English, they'd still be a bunch of murderous scum.
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Okay. So your point is?

I was trying to point out why I thought people like me were very upset by the bilingual thing.

(BTW, I just reread my last post, can anyone tell me howto spell check here at THR?....LOL)
 
Ezekiel,

I apologize if my isolationist fears hurts your feelings, that was not my intent.
(I always thought Pat Buchanon would have made a great President)

However,

I was born here and that does give me rights that others, such as illegal aliens, do not have, wether someone likes it or not.

I am not opposed to someone coming here legally and becoming American. I am opposed to those people expceting America to cater to them as opposed to them becoming a part of our great country.
 
Ezekiel- You are confusing controlled legal immigration with uncontrolled illegal immigration. The former is a necessary and healthy part of any society. I am first generation American. My own father immigrated here legally and became an American. The latter is no more than an unarmed invasion of our country. La Mecha boasts they will retake this land, which they call Aztlan, without firing a shot. The invaders know what they're doing, and our government is complicit.

Maybe you would care to explain how uncontrolled immigration across open borders is a good thing, especially during wartime?
 
thereisnospoon: I was trying to point out why I thought people like me were very upset by the bilingual thing.
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Yes, I understood that. My point: You're taking your correct anger about MS-13 and misapplying it to language. You're taking your correct anger about illegal immigrants and misapplying it to language.

The fact that MS-13s speak Spanish does not mean that it's a bad thing for there to be a lot of people speaking Spanish. The fact that most illegal immigrants speak Spanish does not mean that it's a bad thing for there to be a lot of people speaking Spanish.

I think you might be confusing correlation with causation.

As for the bit about McDonald's, it bugs me too. However, buck up and get over it.
 
As for the bit about McDonald's, it bugs me too. However, buck up and get over it.
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NO! You can't make me....I won't do it...........

I think this is the essence of our problem, American citizens (and I mean ALL legal American citizens regardless of race, color, creed or place of origin) should not bend for outsiders who are coming here to enjoy the freedom and prosperity of America. It should be the other way around.
 
Speaking of hijacking a thread -- and strawmen -- has anyone noticed how the thread is drifting towards an attack on illegal immigration.

With the possible exception of Ezekiel (sorry, if I'm wrong) -- everyone in this thread defending bilingualism is nonetheless opposed to illegal immigration, me included. Yet, some of the anti-Spanish-language people seem intent on making this about illegal immigration.

Yes, I understand there is a correlation between illegal immigration and the Spanish language. However, if all the Spanish speaking people were here legally, you all still could make your balkanization argument and your economic-harm arguments. Your arguments are not dependent on the illegal immigration issue. You're simply distracting from your arguments.

So why don't you all drop it? Illegal immigration is a valid topic. But it's really not rellevant to whether the USA can survive having two competing languages.
 
Flyboy , Quote:
got sent back because he didn't lie about his age (15), got sent back to Sicily then worked to earn enough and return 11 months later at 18yrs old.

That's the New Math, right?

No, that's learning from the school of hard knocks, the hard way.

Good thing they didn't have computor book keeping at Ellis Island in 1912 & 1913 or I might be in a different place and speaking a different language :what:
 
"I think this is the essence of our problem, American citizens (and I mean ALL legal American citizens regardless of race, color, creed or place of origin) should not bend for outsiders who are coming here to enjoy the freedom and prosperity of America."

What we need to look at, hard, is why so many Americans are willing to bend over. It's not because Americans are "adaptive." Maybe brainwashed? Or just too many people who have gotten way too soft for their own good?
 
I said I would comment no more and, apparently, did not speak the truth.

"You both make fabulous points. Thanks for the input."

Ezekiel- You are confusing controlled legal immigration with uncontrolled illegal immigration. The former is a necessary and healthy part of any society. I am first generation American. My own father immigrated here legally and became an American. The latter is no more than an unarmed invasion of our country. La Mecha boasts they will retake this land, which they call Aztlan, without firing a shot. The invaders know what they're doing, and our government is complicit.

Maybe you would care to explain how uncontrolled immigration across open borders is a good thing, especially during wartime?
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Um, "I can't." Has Congress declared war? Is this relevant, yet? Still, I admit you scored here.

Ezekiel,

I apologize if my isolationist fears hurts your feelings, that was not my intent.
(I always thought Pat Buchanon would have made a great President)

However,

I was born here and that does give me rights that others, such as illegal aliens, do not have, wether someone likes it or not.

I am not opposed to someone coming here legally and becoming American. I am opposed to those people expceting America to cater to them as opposed to them becoming a part of our great country.
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And to do so they must "conform"? I don't like that. Eventually, we'll ask if they are "American enough". Then, we'll ask if citizens are "American enough". Then -- well -- you get the idea. Hey, isn't this what our great Homeland Security thugs are already doing? (Sorry, I just cannot help myself.)

I'll try to go away now. ;)
 
The fact that most illegal immigrants speak Spanish does not mean that it's a bad thing for there to be a lot of people speaking Spanish.
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Au contraire (you don't mind French do you?) Widespread use of Spanish is emblematic of the illegal immigration problem-it's a symptom of systemic disease.

The question was not whether Spanish speaking was ok with you, but whether the promotion of Spanish speaking in the U.S. is good public policy.
 
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