Ten round limit law question

[Kali Endgame]

Greetings all,

I did a search and only found diatribes against the law. I am wondering if there is some kind of research that is behind the law or if it is a arbitrary number. The Brady Bunch push the limited capacity magazines, but they got their foot in door because of a revolver not an auto loader. So, why ten round limits? Is it because most bolt action's are five to six round flush mount magazines and ten gives the protruding magazine usefulness? I really want to know the reason/logic/data behind this. Any links, info, or direction is greatly appreciated.

Regards,
Jon

 

[Onmilo]

I think that 10 shots maximum has something to do with the Ruger 10/22 rifle and terms like "sporting applications",,,,

 

[Thain]

My concern has always been about weapons where no 10 round or under magazines are available... For example, my S&W Model 59 accepts a 15-round magazine and thats it.

The model was discontinued ages ago, and was never terribly popular (or so I'm told) and no one makes magazines for it. If the Brady Bunch comes to power agian, I'm really worried that my old reliable autoloader will morph into an evil assault pistol, possess me body and soul, and make me go on a killing spree... if only a ten round magazine was available!

I think "ten" was settled on because it seems the upper limit of "sporting purposes" firearms, and many popular (but not evil) military surplus weapons all fall under the limit... the M1911A1, M1 Garand, et cetra.

Although, I'm sure Handgun Control Inc's playbook was to get a ten-round limit, then an eight, then six... four... two.. one...

 

[Amish_Bill]

Besides being a nice even number, I can't think of a single good reason for that cutoff.

I'm not aware of any any gun where 10 was the natural mag capacity. As I recall, most of the 10 round semi auto pistols came about in an effor tto make a 10 round system as compact as possible or to see how big a round you needed that 10 of them would use up most or all of the available mag volume. Lets see...

Revolvers - 5 or 6 (or 9 for some .22s)
1911s - 7 ( or 6 for compacts)
doublestack 1911s - 12, 14 or more
AR15s - 20 or 30 gi surplus
M14 - 20
M1 Garand - 8
M1 Carbine - 15(?)
Mini 14 - 5, 20?
92f - 15
96f - 11
HighPower - 13
tubefed .22 rifles seemed to have a nice over-10 capacity
10/22 - ok, maybe this one. The OEM rotary mags ARE 10, right?
Were the original Ruger mkII mags bigger than 10?

Hmmm... .I'd hate to think that Ruger pushed that number to protect the existing mag designs for two of their cash cows... :banghead:

 

[Nil]

Were the original Ruger mkII mags bigger than 10?

I've always wondered why all .22 pistols have only 10 round magazines. I imagine it has to do with the 10 round limits in various locales throughout the country and minimizing production costs with only one type of magazine, but goddamn, a double stack mag would be so much fun.

 

[Amish_Bill]

When did local 10 round limit laws hit the books? I'm not sure anyone even contemplated such silliness until after the 94 AWB.

 

[thumbody]

Were the original Ruger mkII mags bigger than 10?

Early model Ruger semi-auto .22s (Standard model and I believe also the MK1) had 9 shot magazines

I don't believe there were any factory magazines for the Ruger .22s that held more than 19 rounds.

 

[Ian Sean]

When did local 10 round limit laws hit the books? I'm not sure anyone even contemplated such silliness until after the 94 AWB.

Especially considering Jim Brady was shot with a Rohm 6 shot revolver.

 

[bogie]

Fun part is that after the normal capacity magazine ban passed, people stepped away from the double-stack 9mms, and started looking at the .45ACP again... They put their ARs in the closet, and started researching highly accurate scoped bolt actions...

Heh, heh, heh... Unintended Consequences...

 

[M2 Carbine]

really want to know the reason/logic/data behind this.

Like 99% of the gun laws, it is arbitrary, stupid and useless, introduced and approved by people that are also mostly arbitrary, stupid and useless. Like most gun laws it does nothing to prevent or control crime.

It's sole purpose is to put restrictions on legal gun owners.

 

[Working Man]

Early model Ruger semi-auto .22s (Standard model and I believe also the MK1) had 9 shot magazines

My dad's came with 2 mags, one is a 9 shot the other an 11. I always thought
that was kinda odd.

 

[fattsgalore]

Realisticly speaking, they don't want you to have fire power equal or greater then most police departments. Thats the truth.

 

[B.D. Turner]

The ten round limit brought us some real small autos. Without the ban we may not have had such neat compact pistols so perfect for CCW.

 

[rxraptor02]

sorry is this runs a little off topic:

In reguards to the post about 10 round limit and having to do with not having more firepower than the local PD's. Is there a limit on how many mag you can have? I know most people will not carry that many extra mags due to weight and ease of carry. But why not just carry two extra mags of 10?

 

[B.D. Turner]

Realisticly speaking, they don't want you to have fire power equal or greater then most police departments. Thats the truth.

Great point. If crime was reduced in an area would the police choose to go back to revolvers because the need of a semi auto is reduced?
Hasn't happened anywhere I know of. "SWAT team disolved due to lack of crime in city" is one headline you will never see. "City refurbs tank to take on drug dealers" would be a more likely headline. The whole "police are outgunned wail and cry was a lie from the gun grabbers. I believe many have too quickly forgotten the Janet Reno mentality of our elected.

 

[Professor K]

I dont think there's any limit, but then again, it might look odd to walk around with a huge cargo pocket full of extra mags, or a belt rig or something.

 

[bogie]

Realisticly speaking, they don't want you to have fire power equal or greater then most police departments. Thats the truth.

Sigh... I think I've got more rifles than my city's whole department...

 

[Scoupe]

I thought everyone just knew that the 11th bullet is always the deadly one.

 

[AlaskaErik]

Besides being a nice even number, I can't think of a single good reason for that cutoff.

My guess is that it was a start. Next would have come 5 round mags and then, eventually, confiscation. Incrementalism is the hallmark of the gun grabbers.

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

I did a speech on the RKBA in college and in my reasearch found that even congress admitted the number was totally arbitrary and wasn't based on any scientific evidence. I'll see if I can find the source again. It was from some .gov paper.

 

[perpster]

Maybe they thought us gun-toting knuckle-draggers can't count higher than 10 anyway (not enough fingers to go higher).

 

[.cheese.]

Actually, if anybody finds a good source for how this law came to be (ie: legal opinions, etc.), please PM me - I'm doing a paper right now on the Economics of Gun Control (or possibly just a more generic paper on Economics of Gun Ownership) and would like to have a portion covering current gun-control measures and their effects (cost vs benefit (if any)). I have been wondering this same question for some time now.

Thanks.

 

[Amish_Bill]

Don't forget the artificial constraint on the market for FA guns. Paying over $10k for an old off-brand AR15 rifle worth $650 that had about $100 of parts substitutions and machine work or well over $15k for an actual M16 that sells new today (to gov/le only) for under $1k...

THAT is economic impact via gun control!

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

http://www.nraila.org/Issues/FactSheets/Read.aspx?id=158&issue=019

The ban`s 10-round magazine limit limits your ability to defend yourself. Police officers and military personnel use standard magazines42 for good reason--their protection. Private citizens should have the same ability to defend themselves. The study for Congress and a follow-up study (see p. 1) found no justification for a limit on the number of rounds in new magazines, let alone the arbitrary number "10."

I'm not sure what study they are referring to when they say page 1, but check out that link, it's probably cited in the sources at the bottom of the page if it's available online.

 

[Jorg Nysgerrig]

If you look at S.1878/H.R.3932 as they were introduced to the senate/house in 1994, the limit was original 6 rounds.