The 1st Amend here on THR.

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Here's a concept: If you don't like it here, don't come here. Find someplace you like and go there! Wasn't that simple?

Personally, I'm somewhat amazed by the tolerance shown by the moderators. Folks actually get away with quite a bit here, for a while.
 
Your title was "S(tuff) HAPPENS", except that "stuff" was misspelled and only contained 4 letters

Nuff said. That explains everything. Once again, there's more to the story than meets the eye.

I personally am glad when threads get closed but for the opposite reasons you mentioned. For instance, I recently saw a thread title about children learning to shoot, then read it only to find that some bozo had rabbit-holed the thread into home-schooling their child. Everyone's brother then wanted to talk about home-schooling their children. A couple of moderators said something to the effect of "lets get back on topic" in SEVERAL posts throughout that thread. I say "kudos" to the moderators. Sounds to me like they're doing their jobs--and doing quite well.

It wastes MY time to click on a thread about rifles only to find it should have been titled "Dear Abby." In much the same way, I clicked on your thread just now to read about someone making amends to The High Road, only to see that you were referring to the First Amendment but neglected to properly abbreviate/punctuate.

Take The High Road and you won't have any of these issues. :rolleyes:
 
I'm with the mods on this one. They're more than fair and very tolerant. I definitely think the 'free speech b/c the internet is government' argument is a stretch. If I don't like what happens here, I'll go somewhere else. It's a privilege not a right to be on this forum, just like a guest doesn't have the 'right' to be in your home. Thanks to all the mods for a great forum.
 
Hyperbole is all well and good to "hook" members into a thread, but being factually inaccurate on the basis of a topic is just misleading and unfair to the folks who don't have a lot of time in their day to check THR.

As has been pointed out, THR is a private website. Derek and Oleg pay for the place with a little help from contributions. There are no banner ads, no corporate support. No fees. Everyone here is playing for free (A HUGE thanks to the folks who contribute. Every penny helps.). Folks of all persuasion are allowed in (whether they get to stay only depends upon how they conduct themselves). And everyone that signs up has agreed to follow the Forum Rules. It's not a public square with soap boxes. So, there are no 1st Amendment issues in closing or editing or limiting threads. That issue was dealt with when you signed up and isn't available for debate.

Being vulgar or profane or insulting is inconsistent with the mission of THR. The place was opened to provide an RKBA website that was unlike others out there (otherwise why go to the trouble just to open another "me too" gun forum) where civil discussions on firearms and firearms rights were required. THR wants people that are undecided on firearms issues to be able to come here and be won over to our point of view without being turned off first by how some folks on gun boards tend to express themselves. Winning hearts and minds. Inevitably, some people's idea of what "civil" is can be very different with someone else's idea of what being "civil" is. Maintaining that standard can be difficult. We try, but we obviously can't accommodate everyone on this.

Since the place has a focus and is run on limited resources, threads that don't fit or have any further beneficial purpose get closed from time to time. L&P threads tend to be the worst about this. Non-firearms threads start there. Threads on topics that the posters are angry about start there. Threads where posters have forgotten, or just ignored, the rules of conduct get started there. They tend to get closed. General Gun Discussions tends to have it's share also. Topics on Airsoft or batteries or cameras or... are not usually related to firearms. The rare ones on airsoft being regulated like firearms or what brands of electronic sights use AAA instead of CR123 batteries are the exception. Threads just bashing one group or the other pop up. They're not the high road regardless, but people's prejudices and they're desire to scape-goat someone can't be resisted at times.

Threads that are a rehash of well covered topics are a different problem. I don't really have anything useful to say about them. New members shouldn't have to go through a training session on all the wisdom of the ages (on THR;)) to make a post and folks shouldn't beat up on them too hard for posting on a topic that was exhaustively discussed the previous Thursday. But, new posters should realize that everyone eventually gets tired of seeing a topic easily looked up brought back to the table (especially if it's been brought up every ten days) so a little reading and poking around in the archives is just good manners. If you see the issue discussed, but some detail is still puzzling you, bring that part back up. You never can tell how many people are wondering about that too.

Try to keep in mind that THR can't be all things to all people. It's not intended to be. That's why I'm a member on other forums, but THR is my "home base".

By agreeing to these rules, you warrant that you will not post any messages that are obscene, vulgar, sexually-oriented, hateful, threatening, or otherwise violative of any laws.

The owners of THR reserve the right to remove, edit, move or close any thread for any reason.
Perhaps folks would rather we expand this so folks could see more of what's expected before they sign in.
 
Dunno...I figure if I'm a guest in another man's house, I should respect his rules.
If he doesn't want me cussin' around his kids, I don't cuss. If he doesn't want me to smoke in his house, I don't smoke.
If I find the rules intolerable, I just leave. 'Course, I'm a simple kinda guy.

Biker:)
 
There are a lot of old threads that I would encourage new members to search out and read before posting on that particular subject. Some of the threads are quite long and most are very good reading. Many of those threads one will find to still be open. Once a new member reads through an old thread, if he or she feels they could add to the discussion they can revive the thread by adding a post.

Really quite simple.

The "SHTF" example mentioned above: There are presently 247 threads with "SHTF" in the title. I'm sure there are more that discuss the same topic but do not have "SHTF" in the title.

So there ya go. Get reading!
 
Priavtely owned board, private rules. Whats to stop them from refusing service to anyone based on whatever they feel like. Break the rules, get your thread locked. I've even done it on occassion.
 
well...

I feel a new member will get board quick with THR, When he or she cant ask a question in their own words and get the responses from the members of THR
because its a topic that has been discused before,

While I do happen to agree with you on this point, I do understand why it happens. If every time someone asked a common question and the thread was allowed to run we would have 10,000 threads on 45 vs 9mm, or ARs vs AKs.

I would like to see new b’s handled a little nicer some times, after all we all had to start some where, unless you are JMB, in which case you were born with all of the fire arms knowledge the ever existed or will exist in your cranium, but I digress. Any way, my point is that if some one has a low round count… oops, I mean post count, maybe instead of responding with “search function is your friend”, maybe take two minutes an look your self and post with the link and a note to look there for more info.

Keep in mind that a lot of folks who are “gun-curious” come here for info, and the impression that we leave can result in a new ally, or another person who is turned off my rude, macho, know-it-all attitude that is the stereotypical gunny that they see on TV.

Other than this small quam, I feel that the Mods do a great job, not that the mods are usually responsible for the above. Other that that, keep in mind that this is their site, and they can regulate it as they see fit, because if anyone is spouting nonsense about illegal activity, or the like, they will be the ones in hot water and we will all loose out on a good site that provides a lot of valuable info and brings together a large number of folks in the shooting community.

Just my $0.02

-Fred
 
Has a closed thread ever actually been re-opened? I don't think I remember ever seeing that.
I've PM'd mods and convinced them to have threads reopened. And those weren't even my threads.

If a topic gets a little off track, How about posting "Were getting a little off track here fellas" Instead of Locking it after three posts.
I've seen mods do this very often.

I think the mods here are very fair. I've seen them even prune a thread heavily to cut out all the annoying 'noise' and attempt to keep an interesting topic going. Sometimes there just isn't anything to salvage.
 
what gun related topic HASNT already been done to death on here?

Just because you've been here awhile and have seen and participated in these active discussions, doesnt mean that there is nothing else to be discussed on the topic.

Everyone is not as message board savy as the long timers here. People come here for discussion. I'm a person who makes use of the search feature, but i ALSO like to get current opinions on topics that have already been discussed.

Will people start getting their posts deleted for repeating the four rules of gun safety?

People like to actively discuss topics of interest and get varying, current day opinions. I dont understand why if someone has already seen it discussed before and is tired of it, they just cant stay out of the discussion this time and let those who wish to participate contribute to the discussion.


if things cant be discussed again that have been previously discussed in depth on the subject of guns, then we dont really have anything else to talk about. The site should be a FAQ and not an interactive discussion forum.
 
you could quite literally go through 75% of the topics on this forum active today and close them under the justification that its been already discussed in depth
 
you could quite literally go through 75% of the topics on this forum active today and close them under the justification that its been already discussed in depth
No doubt. But the mods' job isn't to ruthlessly kill all redundancy; it's to keep the forum interesting, lively and relevant. I think they do a pretty good job of it.

--Len.
 
Doc2005 said:
In addition, this forum in not only in a home, nor funded only with private funds. This forum operates on the internet, which is a government entity, funded by public taxes.

I think you would be well advised to study a little about the Internet. Post again after you've done some reading.

Mike
 
you could quite literally go through 75% of the topics on this forum active today and close them under the justification that its been already discussed in depth
It's not so much that it has been discussed in depth it is that it has been done so much there is no redeemable value in the discussion and that discussion will invariably fall to the lowest common denominator of name calling or juvenile one liners

9vs45 is a prime example, as are Taurus quality threads, 1911 vs Glock and SHTF vs Zombies

They all end with someone getting their feelings hurt
 
Biker said:
Dunno...I figure if I'm a guest in another man's house, I should respect his rules.
If he doesn't want me cussin' around his kids, I don't cuss. If he doesn't want me to smoke in his house, I don't smoke.
If I find the rules intolerable, I just leave. 'Course, I'm a simple kinda guy.

Biker
Very well said and I believe Biker's statement is the consensus opinion of THR users.

Still...
For a board that exists for the purpose of supporting the 2nd amendment there's something about that stance that - well - bothers me re: the first amendment. I can't quite put my finger on why but it is troubling none the less...
 
prince yamato said:
Is it just me or has anyone else noted a huge influx of new members to THR? I'm not saying it's a bad thing, but it seems like...........(edited by me)........NEW members who got caught up in the storm and didn't seem to have a clue what this forum was about and probably thought it was some sort of free-for-all.

hammer bite said:
Here's a concept: If you don't like it here, don't come here. Find someplace you like and go there! Wasn't that simple?

biker said:
Dunno...I figure if I'm a guest in another man's house, I should respect his rules. If he doesn't want me cussin' around his kids, I don't cuss. If he doesn't want me to smoke in his house, I don't smoke.
If I find the rules intolerable, I just leave. 'Course, I'm a simple kinda guy.

All are correct.
This is the best run forum I have found, and the one I keep coming back to. Why? I can count on reasoned debate, spirited discussion, (mostly) mature members treating one another as adults (or being shown the door:) ). The rules are clear.

If you prefer the company of dim-witted, vulgar loudmouths, there are many fora that encourage that behavior...you will be welcome there.

This one here is unique, and some of us like it just the way it is. :)
 
i still dont understand what the over moderation of discussable topics has to do with keeping the forums free from rude and abnoxious behavior?

its not the topic that causes the problems, its the individual members. Any discussion has the potential to deteriorate into a flame fest.

I have noticed that many of the problems that occur start with somewhat rude or condescending responses from regulars to newbies because they dont want to discuss a topic again. I'm just saying, why pick and chose which gun relatedtopics they think deserve discussion? Why do regulars even chime in on a discussion they are "tired of". I think thats the real disruption, but its always the new guy who comes out the villian when he takes offense and reacts.

I just dont like the thought police approach. You dont know what helpfull information will come out of a discussion. You dont know what a discussion will turn into before it is done. The forum has rules and i'm all for enforcing and respecting those rules, but at least have a rule be "broken" before you go into enforcement mode.

imagine if we apply the logic used here to real life. "You have guns, so i'm going to arrest you now so that you dont shoot anyone"
 
I am surprised at the complaints about this forum that have come up lately. Where is this coming from? This is the best gun board that I have experienced. That is true by a long shot! I have very rarely seen a closed thread that I felt had real merit. The Mods do a great job here!
 
i havent been here long, lurked for a pretty long while before registering, but i love this forum.

But it just seems that theres been a whole lot of unneccessary "Early action" taken recently.

Moderators do a great job, but taking obviously gun related threads and shutting them down will only rub good people wrong and turn them away from being positive contributors the community.

i dont think people have a problem with these forums, but i do think alot of folks want to be able to chat about guns with other gun owners without having to perform a search first, or without the speculative merits of the topic being reviewed and decided beforehand.
 
indie, three weeks' experience here isn't really enough to make such a judgement. You can think anything you want about any subject that wanders into your head. Nobody here cares.

As said many times above, what's controlled here is how you express yourself--and whether or not you're on topic with your thoughts and posts. Call me the "courtesy and politeness cop" if you like, but that's not subject to negotiation.

THR is a place for polite and mature adults. If I can fake it for years and years, so can you.

:D, Art
 
Ya know, I've seen this exact same discussion on several boards. Every time I see it, it takes the exact same path, brings up the exact same points, and is resolved the exact same way. So far, this discussion is included.


1. They always start because someone either believes that their First Amendment rights were violated, or to troll.
2. Next, someone points out how the rights weren't violated - it's private property, and private property rights.
3. The original poster usually tries to prove his/her claims with specious proof.
4. The specious proof is debunked
5. Several other members chime in, always with the same arguments.
5a. Infringement of freedom of speech (again)
5b. We cannot see the future
5c. I can't remember the others, but I'm sure we're about to see them
6. Someone invariably comes along and explains how the arguments are invalid
6a. Private property. Property owners may wash your words off their walls at their discretion, with or without good reason. See if the owner is open to changing their rules in private, or leave.
6b. Past performance is a good estimate of future results - particularly with people.
7. The argument runs in circles, and tempers begin to run.
8. The original poster usually ends up taking his* ball and going home. Sometimes, he starts his own forum. Usually, these forums are small, or don't last.
9. The thread gets locked, with a statement on the order of, "After much time, experience, and gnashing of teeth, we made our decision. We didn't like the decision, because we don't like the idea of controlling the conversations, and we don't like the extra work it creates for moderators, but we believe that the benefits are greater than the penatlies."
10. A new, almost duplicate thread, gets started within three weeks, by someone else, complaining that the mods didn't explain their reasons well enough.
11. The mods explain their reasons, the new thread runs the exact same course as the original thread, through being locked. Sometimes, another new thread gets opened, ad naseum.


I respectfully request that we shortcut to the end, where the thread is locked by the moderators. Of course, I have every right to stay the heck out of the thread, myself, and should probably just take my own advice instead of writing and posting this long message.
 
I'll get this in quick before the thread is locked.

Thanks Oleg and all of the Moderators. I can bring my family to this place to learn and gain insight. Sometimes I can show my 14 yr. old shootin' partner that others may have the same opinion that his Dad does(big grin).
I am grateful for this forum and all of the members and their opinions.
Wheeler44
relatively new member and resident smart aleck
 
10. A new, almost duplicate thread, gets started within three weeks, by someone else, complaining that the mods didn't explain their reasons well enough.
Three weeks? I give it less than 48 hours. That's about the average.
 
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
Note that the First Amendment proscriptions are directed toward the legislative branch of the federal government. Custom has come to extend these principles to the exectutive and judicial branches as well; also to the state legislatures.

The First Amendment does not say that people have to listen to what you have to say, provide a vehicle for you to say it or subsidize your efforts to say it.
 
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