The Citizen's Rifle

[MyRoad]

I was after something similar, of course I was not building from the ground up so I had to start with an existing platform. I did not get the box magazine I would have preferred, and I did require a low-power (4x) scope that could be used in a addition to the iron sights, in this case a ghost ring rear.

Not a great picture, but you can get the idea. It started as a Yugo, so I had the grenade launcher and bayonet removed, then added the synthetic stock, the rear sight, had a Choate scope mount drilled and tapped, and added the short mag scope. Also had a trigger job done. Biggest pitfalls of this rifle IMO: not a chrome lined barrel, not box-magazine fed, and its heavier than it needs to be.

In the end I think it does accomplish the goal of being a rugged reliable sport rifle, good for hunting or personal defense.

It's not a complete match to your criteria, but similar enough in concept that I thought it might be interesting. Its basically a "de-militerized" rifle, or in other words, "sporterized" military rifle. For a ground up build, I go back and forth between x39 and .308. When pushed to choose an "if I could only have one" caliber, I lean towards .308, but if its not my only rifle and I were looking for a "handy versatile rifle" for my local woods, I would gravitate towards x39.

 

[gvnwst]

Nice looking rifle there MyRoad.

 

[Wolfgang2000]

MyRoad,
Can you still use stripper clips with the scope installed?

I've done something similar. I started with a Chi-Com SKS carbine (16"barrel) a Choate stock and a ATI scope mount that is drilled and tapped. I put a discontinued Simmons 1.5 to 5 scope on it. I fixed it so I could still use stripper clips even though the eye relief is a tad short.

The 16" barrel really makes it handy in the brush.

 

[ccsniper]

so is this rifle actually going to ever go into production? if so i want a rifle that can be easily changed into 7.62x51 and 7.62x39. i like the idea.

 

[JImbothefiveth]

A ban-proof semi-auto low cost rifle, that can transition between 7.62x51 and 7.62x39, with at least a 10-round magazine? That sounds pretty good to me! You might want to make sure it's modifiable to use en-bloc clips, instead of fixed magazines, for better reloading speed.

BTW what is with this "the citizen's" trend? We have the Citizen's rifle, the Citizen's machine gun, and I think the "Citizen's jetpack" thread was deleted.

 

[JImbothefiveth]

What about a hi-capacity variant of the Winchester 1895 in .308? Maybe with detachable 20-round mags? It's a lever-action, so it's PC, and with 5-round mags would look nonthreatening. I don't know if this would work, though. I don't know enough about the mechanics of the rifle.

EDIT: Heh, the lever would hit the mag, wouldn't it? :-S

What about a pump-action?

 

[Nolo]

BTW what is with this "the citizen's" trend? We have the Citizen's rifle, the Citizen's machine gun, and I think the "Citizen's jetpack" thread was deleted.

The "Citizens Jetpack" thread was making fun of the "Citizen's Machine Gun" thread, which may or may not have been making fun of this thread.
I am very confused by them as well.
Kinda immature to make fun of other people's ideas, especially if they aren't wildly impractical.
The "citizen's rifle" concept is interesting, but it may be moot. I honestly don't know whether it would do any good.
However, the aspect of incredible modularity is an interesting one, and that I am exploring pretty deeply. Even for standard military action, having common parts between ALL your small arms is attractive.

 

[MyRoad]

Can you still use stripper clips with the scope installed?

No, I lost that capability. There were going to be compromises, that's one I made.

It would be possible with a different optic - most likely a red dot - to retain the ability to use stripper clips.

 

[JImbothefiveth]

Too bad they got rid of the jetpack one, I thought it was pretty funny.

Kinda immature to make fun of other people's ideas, especially if they aren't wildly impractical.
The "citizen's rifle" concept is interesting, but it may be moot.

The rifle the OP of this thread described is very interesting, as I said earlier, and I wouldn't mind buying one myself, especially with all the modularity mentioned, if it was reasonably priced.
Has he considered an AR with wood furniture that does not have that really high aperture sight?
(I like it for civilian uses, however, and I think the OP intended it for militia use.)

 

[jordan1948]

There's a pump action rifle made right now that accepts AR-15 mags if only I could remember what company makes them.


Got it. It's the Remington 7615. It only comes chambered in .223 though but like most firearms you could just make a larger version that accepts AR-10 mags and chamber it in 7.62NATO.

 

[NonConformist]

Reminds me a German G43 rifle, and all the offspring and copies thereof-



Also looks like the later HK SL6/7

 

[gvnwst]

I like it for civilian uses, however, and I think the OP intended it for militia use

With this kind of modularity, it would kick butt at both.

 

[NonConformist]

(I like it for civilian uses, however, and I think the OP intended it for militia use.)

The 'civilian' populace IS the 'Militia'!

 

[Dr. Fresh]

Actually, the Remington 7615 would totally work.

 

[gvnwst]

Quote:
(I like it for civilian uses, however, and I think the OP intended it for militia use.)

The 'civilian' populace IS the 'Militia'!

I think he meant "sporting uses", i said about the same thing, thats what i ment...

 

[Nolo]

Actually, the Remington 7615 would totally work.

'Cept you can't change calibers, can't change configurations, can't make a machine gun out of it, etc.
I think I illustrated my OpCon pretty well earlier, but maybe not.
I may make a post outlining the role and requirements, here goes:

 

[Nolo]

Th Operational Concept for the Citizens' Rifle: Please Read

PLEASE READ THIS POST
Citizens' Rifle
Task: Provide modern military small arms weaponry to a civilian populace beset by classic "Assault Weapon" bans (esp. HR 1022) in a legal, or not overtly illegal manner.
Purpose: To ensure the survival of an effectively armed populace under the effective repeal of the 2nd Amendment
Requirements:
-Weapon must be sold as a bolt-action firearm
-Weapon must be sold at prices that make it the market leader. Profit loss is a non-issue.
-Weapon must be simple and cheap to manufacture. Machined parts are to be kept to a minimum.
-Weapon must be able to be converted into each of the following modes: Semi-automatic, fully automatic closed bolt, fully automatic open bolt, blowback.
-Weapon must be able to, with the proper parts set, chamber and fire the following cartridges: 5.56x45mm NATO/.223Remington, 7.62x51mm NATO/.308 Winchester, 9x19mm Parabellum NATO, .45 Automatic Colt Pistol, 7.62x39mm Soviet, .22 Long Rifle. Ability to chamber and fire other common cartridges is also preferred.
-Weapon must be able to exchange barrels instantaneously and without tools.
-Weapon must be able to accept different length and style stocks, and must have adaptors for both AR-15 stocks and AK-47 stocks.
-Weapon must LACK a bayonet lug on marketed barrels.
-Weapon must LACK a flash hider/compensator on marketed barrels.
-Weapon must be able to accept standard (20 or 30 rounds) and high (40+ rounds) magazines.
-Weapon must be be able to accept units that convert it to feed 5.56 NATO and 7.62 NATO standard ammunition belts.
Potential solutions:
Utilizing the a redesigned frame of the MAS-36 rifle as well as a significantly redesigned and modified Pedersen Device, a rifle could be built for optimum modularity and flexibility. Such a weapon could be continuously marketed as a standard bolt action rifle in the $300-$400 dollar range (2008 USD) with the ability to easily change calibers. Exchangeable parts should include magazine well, barrel, receiver plate, bolt, bolt head, and stocks.
Such a weapon would be highly resistant to anti-"Assault Weapon" bans and legislation.
In order to maintain the integrity of the plan, the extra parts necessary for conversion to a military weapon must be kept secret and private. THESE PARTS CANNOT BE PUT ON MARKET, EVEN IF ALLOWED BY LAW! The entire goal of the system is lost if legislators' attention is turned to this rifle.

 

[Dr. Fresh]

I wasn't saying it fit your requirements. Just saying it's PC enough to escape some bans, but still takes AR mags.

 

[jordan1948]

And like I suggested you could make one chambered in .308 and just use AR-10 mags, also even if you can't make a machine gun out of it you could still probably make it semi-auto which would give you a higher ROF than pump action

 

[NonConformist]

Dont let the naysayers keep you down, run w/ it!

 

[Nolo]

I wasn't saying it fit your requirements. Just saying it's PC enough to escape some bans, but still takes AR mags.

That post wasn't addressing you. I forgot to post earlier that I think that's neat. It's a good looking rifle.
The post was addressing people who were asking me why I copied the FN-49 and who were criticizing me for "giving in to the antis".
Right. I has provision for full-auto, and it's giving into the antis.
Seriously, good rifle.

 

[JShirley]

You're getting too complicated. A better solution than the ULTIMATE! Modular Action Rifle would be 2 or 3 rifles for the citizen to choose from. Making an inexpensive and reliable semi-auto would be simpler than making an inexpensive but dependable wonder-rifle that turns into a truck and a robot and Santa's sleigh.

I think a CZ-527, slightly redesigned to reduce complexity and cost, would be just about the perfect do-everything rifle (or, as close as we can come in the real world). In 6.5x39 or 6.8x43mm, it would work just fine for big game and medium-long shots, too.

John

 

[Nolo]

You're getting too complicated. A better solution than the ULTIMATE! Modular Action Rifle would be 2 or 3 rifles for the citizen to choose from. Making an inexpensive and reliable semi-auto would be simpler than making an inexpensive but dependable wonder-rifle that turns into a truck and a robot and Santa's sleigh.

I think a CZ-527, slightly redesigned to reduce complexity and cost, would be just about the perfect do-everything rifle. In 6.5x39 or 6.8x43mm, it would work just fine for big game and medium-long shots, too.

JShirley, who said anything about big game?
This is a military rifle. It is designed, in the event that such action is needed, to be able to combat a military force. Possibly our own military force.
While we could take the government with bolt action rifles, a weapon such as this would help improve our chances.

Task: Provide modern military small arms weaponry to a civilian populace beset by classic "Assault Weapon" bans (esp. HR 1022) in a legal, or not overtly illegal manner.
Purpose: To ensure the survival of an effectively armed populace under the effective repeal of the 2nd Amendment

 

[goon]

Questions:
If the necessary parts to convert these fictional bolt action rifles to semi-auto aren't ever to be placed on the market, even if they are legal, how is the civilian population supposed to acquire them?
If they're meant to be stored at distribution points and passed out in the event that things really deteriorate, who will be in charge of deciding when to pass them out?
Who will pay to make these conversion units?

Not trying to dissuade you and this may have been covered already - I didn't read the whole thread, but I'd think this is as important of a consideration as the actual design.

 

[Nolo]

Questions:

If the necessary parts to convert these fictional bolt action rifles to semi-auto aren't ever to be placed on the market, even if they are legal, how is the civilian population supposed to acquire them?

A devoted firearm company would hold them until needed, as you guessed below.

If they're meant to be stored at distribution points and passed out in the event that things really deteriorate, who will be in charge of deciding when to pass them out?

The aforementioned company would be in charge. Who would head that company? There are two likely candidates: no one, and me.

Who will pay to make these conversion units?

Again, no one, or me.

Not trying to dissuade you and this may have been covered already - I didn't read the whole thread, but I'd think this is as important of a consideration as the actual design.

You aren't. I am well aware of the financial implications. Which is why I intend to be fabulously wealthy when I am older. Should I not become wealthy, this, and many other projects, would become moot.