The Conditions of Readiness: I Admit I was wrong

[Drgong]

For those who do not know, SAO guns, which include the classic guns like 1911s and Browning Hi Powers, and a type of gun that I enjoy shooting, have "Conditions of Readiness."

For those not knowing the SAO terms...

You have Condition Zero, which is Hammer Back, no safety, and bullet in the chamber. aka, ready to shoot.

Condition 1: "Cocked and locked" Hammer back, safety on. round in Chamber

Condition 2: Hammer down, Bullet in chamber. (Actually in many cases, not safe at all IMO)

Condition 3: Hammer down, no Bullet in Chamber, but loaded.

Condition 4: unloaded.

the big debate is Condition 1 vs. Condition 3, and each has its advantages and disadvantages. and there has been friendly debate on the which is better.

I have been a supporter of Condition 3 as a better carrying system.

I admit now, I WAS WRONG...

A good friend of mine was giving me pointers on how to shoot a handgun better, when she asked me the question on how I was going to carry it, needless to say, she was like and told me I was VERY wrong.

She gave me a challange, buy a new holster of a design of her choice, and carry my gun where legal all weekend, Unloaded but cocked and locked, and if I did not think that Condition 1 was best for me, then the holster was on her. How could one NOT agree with that?

Well less then six hours in, with me doing enough gymnastics that people are thinking I am being inspired by the Olympics, I am now going to eat some Crow.

Condition 1 is the best condition to carry SAO pistols, you just need to invest in a proper holster to secure your gun. Now if i could figure out how I am going to Conceal a Browning Hi Power in the summer, I might do the best thing, which is just do one gun very well.

Just as a note, I prefer my Crow with Hinze Ketchup and if your being fancy, with a side of Greens and some salted Cod.

 

[Dgreno]

Rather interesting confession... Enjoy that crow.

 

[The Lone Haranguer]

Just now figured it out, have you?

I've said for years that an unloaded gun is little more than a bludgeon or throwing object, and not very good at either.

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

Rounds in the magazine but none in the chamber does not = unloaded. Unready maybe, but not unloaded.

 

[Jim Watson]

As I recall, Jeff Cooper (who started the whole thing) also called Condition 3, magazine loaded, chamber empty "Half Loaded."

 

[SHOOT1SAM]

Confession is good for the soul, and it demonstrates humility to admit when one is wrong!

BTW, a Milt-Sparks Versa-Max II, with a gun belt should be the ticket to carrying the BHP. Of course, with Spark's backlog, you wouldn't really know until next summer, as they're running about a 6 month turnaround time.

Sam

 

[1911 guy]

Ditto on the gunbelt.

First of all, what holster did you get? Inquiring minds want to know!

Secondly, a honest-to-goodness gunbelt will make that holster even more comfortable to wear. Personally, I've surprised myself and found that the Wilderness Instructor Belt, 1.5", 5-stitch model is the best gunbelt I own.

 

[Guns and more]

What happened in that six hours that made you change your mind?
I don't understand how carrying in condition 1 made you a believer.

 

[Drgong]

The Holster is a simple "Uncle Mikes" OWB holster. Nothing fancy, as I am broke after bills this month.

As for the six hours that made me a believer, the design of the holster and how the gun matches up with it makes it that I feel 100% sure that the safety is not going to fall as I move around. Even then I cannot see how then the trigger is going to be pulled back. My main reason for not liking condition 1 is that I thought it was unsafe, but not anymore.

 

[dmazur]

I was also reluctant to carry in Condition 1. It wasn't the safety -- I knew that was OK. I was just a little nervous about the "clear at the end of the day" to store the gun in Condition 3, so I only put the pistol in Condition 1 if I thought it was warranted, like a "bad part of town".

(I just don't like to store guns in a safe with a round chambered.)

So, with a whole lot of practice with dummy rounds, I got over that. Now it's no big deal to do the change in Conditions.

I guess we all have our qualms, and it appears that practice and a reasoned approach will probably overcome them.

 

[Lonestar49]

You and a lot of others..

...

Too many people refuse to crawl, and just start running, only to fall and get hurt or hurt someone by "mistake.."

A man has got to know his limitations and not worry about what others think nor, put it on some kind of ego status..

Congrats: by crawling first, you, now, have a solid, 2-footed walking, foundation that will work for you up the road if, ever, the need comes to run away from a situation, or face it, with quick, en-grained, reflex's instead of "hard thinking" or "lack of thinking.."


Ls

 

[The Bushmaster]

You might put a bit of garlic powder on that crow...It might go down easier...And a woman is the one that corrected him...Well!!

You are "the man"...Well done and I don't mean the crow...

 

[Guns and more]

When I purchased a Don Hume holster for my Springfield Micro, I wanted it "hammer down" with thumb break. After I placed the order, they called to say they no longer made the "hammer down" version, would I like the "cocked and Locked"? I said yes, although I wasn't happy. When It arrived the thumb break strap was such that it goes between the hammer and the back of the slide. I don't see how you could have a A/D with that. Even if the hammer would drop, it just would hit the strap. Good solution.

 

[Drgong]

Indeed, After I take the CCW classes I will start looking closely at holsters more carefully, as I still have not decided what I will be carrying, and I might have a winter carry/summer carry with alternate guns..

And that holster sounds like it rather nice...

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

Honestly, I've never had a "gun belt" and never had any problems either. I don't see what the big deal is.

 

[Mad Magyar]

I admit now, I WAS WRONG...

Aw Shucks....I was on the other side for years and enjoyed the repartee.

 

[dmazur]

Problem with thumb-breaks

I don't see how you could have a A/D with that. Even if the hammer would drop, it just would hit the strap.

Well, I've heard of the thumb-break strap "curling in" if you re-holster without clicking the safety on, and finding the trigger guard. If you keep pushing, you can have a ND. (Including Series 80's) You are pushing on the grip safety, and the holster is doing a nice job of substituting for your finger.

I have one of these, and I use if very infrequently. When I re-holster, I double-check to make sure the safety is on.

This isn't a problem with open-top holsters, generally, as they don't have the long piece of leather.

 

[Hunter0924]

I had a little trouble with wrapping my brain around Condition 1 years back so don't feel like the Lone Ranger.
I was also lucky enough to have friends help me into Condition 1 and that is how I carry now.

 

[Dr. Fresh]

I was also reluctant to carry in Condition 1. It wasn't the safety -- I knew that was OK. I was just a little nervous about the "clear at the end of the day" to store the gun in Condition 3, so I only put the pistol in Condition 1 if I thought it was warranted, like a "bad part of town".

(I just don't like to store guns in a safe with a round chambered.)

So, with a whole lot of practice with dummy rounds, I got over that. Now it's no big deal to do the change in Conditions.

I guess we all have our qualms, and it appears that practice and a reasoned approach will probably overcome them.
__________________

I hope you realize that constantly switching conditions is much more likely to result in an ND than simply leaving the weapon in Condition 1.

 

[dmazur]

Condition changes

I hope you realize that constantly switching conditions is much more likely to result in an ND than simply leaving the weapon in Condition 1.

Well, yes. That's why I was reluctant to carry in Condition 1, because of this. Once I got really comfortable with "unload and show clear" (which is part of IDPA procedure), I have no problem with this.

My point was, people have problems with Condition 1 carry for different reasons. The most common seems to be the safety, and is it really safe. I had a problem with wanting to avoid the load/unload sequence.

I don't like leaving anything loaded in a safe. Just my preference. For a rapid-access safe, I believe Condition 3 is acceptable. Two pistols in that safe, both in Condition 3. If a 1911 is in our house, "nearby", it is in Condition 3. Carried, Condition 1.

How frequent is the changeover? No more often than daily.

I'm aware of the problem of constantly chambering the same round. I get enough range practice in that this isn't the same round getting chambered 300 times/year. (!)

Could I leave it in Condition 1 in the safe? Sure. I choose not to. Four Rules always apply.

 

[Fast Frank]

When I bought my first 1911, I didn't trust condition 1 either.

I grew up on revolvers. Sticking a revolver in your pants with the hammer cocked over a live round would be stupid to the point of suicidal.

It took me a little while to realize that the auto pistol works differently.

Right this instant, I have a Kimber .45 1911 in a Blade Tech IWB- cocked and locked and in my pants.

I've been doing that for quite a few years now and have not added any unnecessary holes to my body so far.

After a while you will become accustomed to it and do it without thinking.

 

[ColinthePilot]

I used to think the same way, only for me it was Condition 2 or 3 (DAO pistol; no condition 1). I refused to rely on the safety(good right?) and was terrified that the trigger would somehow get pulled in the holster and blow my foot off. I got over that, and carried for a year with one in the pipe and the safety on. Now I'm comfortable enough that the trigger won't magically get pulled that I've upgraded to a Sig (DA/SA) which has no manual safety. It stays Condition 2 since the first pull is DA. It has a firing pin block safety, and a 12-15lb DA trigger pull. If my skivvies can pull the trigger, I'll be mighty impressed.