357wheelgunner
Member
My foil hat will save me
The End of America: May 10, 2005
- Thread starter rick_reno
- Start date
- Status
P-32
Member
I think it's a good idea. Before you all get your flame throwers out, let me explain. I'm a full time LEO in Washington State. I pulled a guy over the other night and wrote him a ticket for driving without a driver's license. He was a friend from south of the border living in Nevada. He was in my state to get a driver's license as currently we don't require proof of citizenship. I view this as abuse of the system.
Medical expenses....why do you think the cost for medical is going up for you and me? We are required to provide medical to those in need, even if they can't or won't pay.
I fully support knowing just who is in my country. I'm not against people trying to make life better for them which many of our friends from south of the border are trying to do. I know there are many farm worker jobs, like picking apples, that needs large amounts of manpower which we, the white american male won't do. I don't have a problem with people coming in to do this. A very large number of the farmer workers are hard working and work to pay their bills. Many are like the rest of us, trying to make life good for our children. I have no problem with that idea. What I do have a problem with is just who is walking across the border, or driving across from our border in the North. Just how many come across the border to escape from being arrested for crimes they committed back home? I have seen criminals we want go back south and come back with a new name and fake ID. Then they continue with what they were doing here to start with. Many have a real name and a work name.
I know of some who want to be deported just so they don't have to pay for the bus ticket. I have seen many deported back within 2 weeks or less. The idea of a green card is moot as many have fake ones. (The new ones are not easy to fake but are far a few in between as the old ones faze out.)
I have no plans on ever coming to anyones home and taking their firearms. (all though I have in cases of safe keeping and they all have been returned to the owner) I have a love of the shooting sports and own some nice pieces. I would not be willing to just turn them. Hopefully I will be long gone before the US over turns the USC.
By the way I read the ststes are not happy as there was no funding for this new ID system requirement.
Medical expenses....why do you think the cost for medical is going up for you and me? We are required to provide medical to those in need, even if they can't or won't pay.
I fully support knowing just who is in my country. I'm not against people trying to make life better for them which many of our friends from south of the border are trying to do. I know there are many farm worker jobs, like picking apples, that needs large amounts of manpower which we, the white american male won't do. I don't have a problem with people coming in to do this. A very large number of the farmer workers are hard working and work to pay their bills. Many are like the rest of us, trying to make life good for our children. I have no problem with that idea. What I do have a problem with is just who is walking across the border, or driving across from our border in the North. Just how many come across the border to escape from being arrested for crimes they committed back home? I have seen criminals we want go back south and come back with a new name and fake ID. Then they continue with what they were doing here to start with. Many have a real name and a work name.
I know of some who want to be deported just so they don't have to pay for the bus ticket. I have seen many deported back within 2 weeks or less. The idea of a green card is moot as many have fake ones. (The new ones are not easy to fake but are far a few in between as the old ones faze out.)
I have no plans on ever coming to anyones home and taking their firearms. (all though I have in cases of safe keeping and they all have been returned to the owner) I have a love of the shooting sports and own some nice pieces. I would not be willing to just turn them. Hopefully I will be long gone before the US over turns the USC.
By the way I read the ststes are not happy as there was no funding for this new ID system requirement.
Joejojoba111
Member
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2005
- Messages
- 1,056
Know who should really be worried? Other countries! Damn, if history is to be believed, after domestic control is secured, well, adventures begin.
Gung-Ho
member
Well......there is Ron Paul.
Definitely. There's really not much that can be done, within the bounds of the constitution, about illegals who are already here. What can be done is to secure the border so it stops leaking like a sieve.itgoesboom said:
What, you're going to deport someone because they refuse to get a new realID-compliant driver's license? I'd guess that a few members of this board, and certainly some of the more libertarian-minded in the rkba community, will do whatever they can to avoid getting stuck with one of these new IDs. You want to deport them as well?
Lone_Gunman
Member
I think this is a good point to ponder. Republics don't take over the world, empires do.
Standing Wolf
Member in memoriam
I doubt it, but it'll keep assault lawyers in pay checks for a long time.
gc70
Member
I took a look at my driver's license and it already meets the information requirements of the new law. When I renewed my license a couple of years ago there were new requirements for proof of identity that I believe meet the requirements of the new law. And I am fairly sure that the state's computer systems are already linked to the federal systems. So, I don't see any change in my state.
If you are worried about government knowledge and control of your activities, then never, ever accept a "smart card" from your bank or financial institution. I sat through a sobering "smart card" demonstration in 1997. (Yes, that was 8 years ago, so you can imagine that the technology has improved). Besides the normal stuff visible on the surface, the card had a surprisingly large data storage capacity. It could store data about, and mimic the functions of, dozens of credit cards, debit cards, cash cards, insurance cards, etc., as well as storing little tihings like your entire medical history. The card was touted as a single-card replacement for all of the plastic that a normal person would carry in their wallet. Of course, what would happen if your "smart card" was shut off was not discussed.
If you are worried about government knowledge and control of your activities, then never, ever accept a "smart card" from your bank or financial institution. I sat through a sobering "smart card" demonstration in 1997. (Yes, that was 8 years ago, so you can imagine that the technology has improved). Besides the normal stuff visible on the surface, the card had a surprisingly large data storage capacity. It could store data about, and mimic the functions of, dozens of credit cards, debit cards, cash cards, insurance cards, etc., as well as storing little tihings like your entire medical history. The card was touted as a single-card replacement for all of the plastic that a normal person would carry in their wallet. Of course, what would happen if your "smart card" was shut off was not discussed.
Warren
Member
I like to imagine a country where no one has government issued ID. The only IDs would be whatever a company issues to determine who can be on company property.
But we are probably to far gone for people to be able to even imagine that possibility.
But we are probably to far gone for people to be able to even imagine that possibility.
cropcirclewalker
member
I said it before, I'll say it again.
We're screwed.
Hey, but we don't have Kerry.
We're screwed.
Hey, but we don't have Kerry.
Add me to the list of feckless complainers and handwringers. None of us is gonna do a damn thing about it. We're way to fat dumb and happy, watching ESPN and buying crap from Walmart, to even notice the water is getting hotter by the day.
jefnvk
Member
Unless I am mising a lot, this is what I see being done. The feds are saying that now, we accept driver's licenses as ID. We want all states to have the same basic information on their license, and ensure the person's information is correct. Also, make it harder to counterfiet the license.
I don't see where it is requiring anyone to get an ID, or have an ID when outside their home. Again, if I am wrong, tell me, but all I see is the Feds saying that if they are accepting driver's licenses as valid ID, the state has to do certain things to ensure that only actual citizens are getting driver's licenses.
I don't see where it is requiring anyone to get an ID, or have an ID when outside their home. Again, if I am wrong, tell me, but all I see is the Feds saying that if they are accepting driver's licenses as valid ID, the state has to do certain things to ensure that only actual citizens are getting driver's licenses.
VARifleman
Member
Looks to me like you've failed in your duties to protect and serve by supporting such unconstitutional legislation...
Flyboy
Member
And what, exactly, would you consider "[doing] a damn thing about it?" Our respective politicians have proven themselves immune to letters. Controversial or unpopular ideas are attached to popular bills (like, for example, Funding for The Troops) so they're immune to criticism or veto. The people, who elected these clowns, have proven themselves immune to explanation, history, logic, example, or any other form of rational thought.
Short of applying a Great Foam Cluebat to the heads of everybody involved, what, exactly, do you think ought to be done about it?
beerslurpy
member
This doesnt create any new capabilities. The government already knows where to find you, and thanks to the financial services industry, already knows everything you have ever done, in much greater detail than a trail of 4473s could provide.
What national ID does is make it harder for mexicans and other non-legits to have fake identities.
I dont think it will be abused as long as citizens stay vigilant and expose abuses as soon as they happen. Remember, we're winning the gun battle.
What national ID does is make it harder for mexicans and other non-legits to have fake identities.
I dont think it will be abused as long as citizens stay vigilant and expose abuses as soon as they happen. Remember, we're winning the gun battle.
Joejojoba111
Member
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2005
- Messages
- 1,056
Jefynk:"Unless I am mising a lot, this is what I see being done. The feds are saying that now, we accept driver's licenses as ID. We want all states to have the same basic information on their license, and ensure the person's information is correct. Also, make it harder to counterfiet the license.
I don't see where it is requiring anyone to get an ID, or have an ID when outside their home. Again, if I am wrong, tell me, but all I see is the Feds saying that if they are accepting driver's licenses as valid ID"
No, no realy problems. All in all pretty mundane and routine, just that there's a lot more people saying 'Papiere bitte!'.
Oh yea, and the granting of dictatorial powers for the monumental purpose of building roads, that's completely normal. And the absolute removal of any possibility of an educated and capable court ruling on the legality of the document. Nothing wierd at all when the government is passing legislation that says in BIG BOLD LETTERS "THIS CAN NEVER BE REVIEWED BY A COURT OF LAW, BECAUSE WE SAY SO, BITCH."
"EC. 102. WAIVER OF LAWS NECESSARY FOR IMPROVEMENT OF BARRIERS AT BORDERS.
...(1) IN GENERAL- Notwithstanding any other provision of law, the Secretary of Homeland Security shall have the authority to waive, and shall waive, all laws such Secretary, in such Secretary's sole discretion, determines necessary to ensure expeditious construction of the barriers and roads under this section.
"SEC. 202. MINIMUM DOCUMENT REQUIREMENTS AND ISSUANCE STANDARDS FOR FEDERAL RECOGNITION.
(a) Minimum Standards for Federal Use-
(1) IN GENERAL- Beginning 3 years after the date of the enactment of this Act, a Federal agency may not accept, for any official purpose, a driver's license or identification card issued by a State to any person unless the State is meeting the requirements of this section."
`(2) NO JUDICIAL REVIEW- Notwithstanding any other provision of law (statutory or nonstatutory), no court, administrative agency, or other entity shall have jurisdiction--"
Seriously, why the hell would you be concerned with dicatorial powers and the deletion of judicial review. Tin-foil hat brigade, wooo-wooo-woooo. LOl crazy asshats.
I don't see where it is requiring anyone to get an ID, or have an ID when outside their home. Again, if I am wrong, tell me, but all I see is the Feds saying that if they are accepting driver's licenses as valid ID"
No, no realy problems. All in all pretty mundane and routine, just that there's a lot more people saying 'Papiere bitte!'.
Oh yea, and the granting of dictatorial powers for the monumental purpose of building roads, that's completely normal. And the absolute removal of any possibility of an educated and capable court ruling on the legality of the document. Nothing wierd at all when the government is passing legislation that says in BIG BOLD LETTERS "THIS CAN NEVER BE REVIEWED BY A COURT OF LAW, BECAUSE WE SAY SO, BITCH."
"EC. 102. WAIVER OF LAWS NECESSARY FOR IMPROVEMENT OF BARRIERS AT BORDERS.
...(1) IN GENERAL- Notwithstanding any other provision of law, the Secretary of Homeland Security shall have the authority to waive, and shall waive, all laws such Secretary, in such Secretary's sole discretion, determines necessary to ensure expeditious construction of the barriers and roads under this section.
"SEC. 202. MINIMUM DOCUMENT REQUIREMENTS AND ISSUANCE STANDARDS FOR FEDERAL RECOGNITION.
(a) Minimum Standards for Federal Use-
(1) IN GENERAL- Beginning 3 years after the date of the enactment of this Act, a Federal agency may not accept, for any official purpose, a driver's license or identification card issued by a State to any person unless the State is meeting the requirements of this section."
`(2) NO JUDICIAL REVIEW- Notwithstanding any other provision of law (statutory or nonstatutory), no court, administrative agency, or other entity shall have jurisdiction--"
Seriously, why the hell would you be concerned with dicatorial powers and the deletion of judicial review. Tin-foil hat brigade, wooo-wooo-woooo. LOl crazy asshats.
Joejojoba111
Member
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2005
- Messages
- 1,056
Oh yea, one more thing, those who suggest that new powers will be abused should be flogged. IF that were true then you'd have thousands of otherwise illegal Federal laws and dozens of agencies (each with thosands of troops) operating under the loophole of 'Inter-State Commerce'.
Seriously, look what they did with the IFFY use of 'interstate commerce'. Now they are granting dictators dictatorial powers, and deleting the power of independent judiciary. If they push this a fraction as much as they did interstate commerce, it'll make Il Duce look like Kofi Annan.
Seriously, look what they did with the IFFY use of 'interstate commerce'. Now they are granting dictators dictatorial powers, and deleting the power of independent judiciary. If they push this a fraction as much as they did interstate commerce, it'll make Il Duce look like Kofi Annan.
Last edited by a moderator:
Ridge
Member
Well call me crazy but....
I could see this starting another civil war (If any of you feel the same way)
Because if anybody in this country has any brains left can see that this will cause all freedoms to become conditionary meaning that if the government doesn't want you to say or do something it doesn't like then you are a criminal, which is pretty much the way things are now only it would be more extreme if "Big brother" got his way.
We may be "Winng the gun battle" but we are losing the true war on terrorism on all fronts,the true terrorists don't wear turbins but nicely pressed suits,they are the ones that pose the worst threat.
Now they are just showing us a small portion of what they can really do,I think it's time we all stood up and started kicking some ass.
I could see this starting another civil war (If any of you feel the same way)
Because if anybody in this country has any brains left can see that this will cause all freedoms to become conditionary meaning that if the government doesn't want you to say or do something it doesn't like then you are a criminal, which is pretty much the way things are now only it would be more extreme if "Big brother" got his way.
We may be "Winng the gun battle" but we are losing the true war on terrorism on all fronts,the true terrorists don't wear turbins but nicely pressed suits,they are the ones that pose the worst threat.
Now they are just showing us a small portion of what they can really do,I think it's time we all stood up and started kicking some ass.
possenti
Member
I agree. The illegal aliens and terrorists will find a simple way around the national ID.
Just like gun control:
Criminals use firearms to commit violent felonies. The .gov's solution? Place strict limitations on guns that only the law-abiding will follow.
Just another feel-good band-aid solution.
jefnvk
Member
Joejabba, the bill DOES NOT read how you posted it. Either you miscopied it, which I can forgive, else you are trying to mislead me, which I am not too appreciative of.
Here is the ENTIRE 102. Funny, the part which you convienently put under 202 really goes under 102:
SEC. 102. WAIVER OF LAWS NECESSARY FOR IMPROVEMENT OF BARRIERS AT BORDERS.
Section 102(c) of the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act of 1996 (8 U.S.C. 1103 note) is amended to read as follows:
`(c) Waiver-
`(1) IN GENERAL- Notwithstanding any other provision of law, the Secretary of Homeland Security shall have the authority to waive, and shall waive, all laws such Secretary, in such Secretary's sole discretion, determines necessary to ensure expeditious construction of the barriers and roads under this section.
`(2) NO JUDICIAL REVIEW- Notwithstanding any other provision of law (statutory or nonstatutory), no court, administrative agency, or other entity shall have jurisdiction--
`(A) to hear any cause or claim arising from any action undertaken, or any decision made, by the Secretary of Homeland Security pursuant to paragraph (1); or
`(B) to order compensatory, declaratory, injunctive, equitable, or any other relief for damage alleged to arise from any such action or decision.'.
You want to know what that is amending? Here it is:
``(c) Waiver.--The provisions of the Endangered Species Act of 1973
[16 U.S.C. 1531 et seq.] and the National Environmental Policy Act of
1969 [42 U.S.C. 4321 et seq.] are waived to the extent the Attorney
General determines necessary to ensure expeditious construction of the
barriers and roads under this section [amending this section].''
A section talking about the Endagered Species Act, and environmental policies. (stolen from here: http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=browse_usc&docid=Cite:+8USC1103)
Now here is the ENTIRE 202:
SEC. 202. MINIMUM DOCUMENT REQUIREMENTS AND ISSUANCE STANDARDS FOR FEDERAL RECOGNITION.
(a) Minimum Standards for Federal Use-
(1) IN GENERAL- Beginning 3 years after the date of the enactment of this Act, a Federal agency may not accept, for any official purpose, a driver's license or identification card issued by a State to any person unless the State is meeting the requirements of this section.
(2) STATE CERTIFICATIONS- The Secretary shall determine whether a State is meeting the requirements of this section based on certifications made by the State to the Secretary of Transportation. Such certifications shall be made at such times and in such manner as the Secretary of Transportation, in consultation with the Secretary of Homeland Security, may prescribe by regulation.
(b) Minimum Document Requirements- To meet the requirements of this section, a State shall include, at a minimum, the following information and features on each driver's license and identification card issued to a person by the State:
(1) The person's full legal name.
(2) The person's date of birth.
(3) The person's gender.
(4) The person's driver's license or identification card number.
(5) A digital photograph of the person.
(6) The person's address of principle residence.
(7) The person's signature.
(8) Physical security features designed to prevent tampering, counterfeiting, or duplication of the document for fraudulent purposes.
(9) A common machine-readable technology, with defined minimum data elements.
(c) Minimum Issuance Standards-
(1) IN GENERAL- To meet the requirements of this section, a State shall require, at a minimum, presentation and verification of the following information before issuing a driver's license or identification card to a person:
(A) A photo identity document, except that a non-photo identity document is acceptable if it includes both the person's full legal name and date of birth.
(B) Documentation showing the person's date of birth.
(C) Proof of the person's social security account number or verification that the person is not eligible for a social security account number.
(D) Documentation showing the person's name and address of principal residence.
(2) SPECIAL REQUIREMENTS-
(A) IN GENERAL- To meet the requirements of this section, a State shall comply with the minimum standards of this paragraph.
(B) EVIDENCE OF LAWFUL STATUS- A State shall require, before issuing a driver's license or identification card to a person, valid documentary evidence that the person--
(i) is a citizen of the United States;
(ii) is an alien lawfully admitted for permanent or temporary residence in the United States;
(iii) has conditional permanent resident status in the United States;
(iv) has an approved application for asylum in the United States or has entered into the United States in refugee status;
(v) has a valid, unexpired nonimmigrant visa or nonimmigrant visa status for entry into the United States;
(vi) has a pending application for asylum in the United States;
(vii) has a pending or approved application for temporary protected status in the United States;
(viii) has approved deferred action status; or
(ix) has a pending application for adjustment of status to that of an alien lawfully admitted for permanent residence in the United States or conditional permanent resident status in the United States.
(C) TEMPORARY DRIVERS' LICENSES AND IDENTIFICATION CARDS-
(i) IN GENERAL- If a person presents evidence under any of clauses (v) through (ix) of subparagraph (B), the State may only issue a temporary driver's license or temporary identification card to the person.
(ii) EXPIRATION DATE- A temporary driver's license or temporary identification card issued pursuant to this subparagraph shall be valid only during the period of time of the applicant's authorized stay in the United States or, if there is no definite end to the period of authorized stay, a period of one year.
(iii) DISPLAY OF EXPIRATION DATE- A temporary driver's license or temporary identification card issued pursuant to this subparagraph shall clearly indicate that it is temporary and shall state the date on which it expires.
(iv) RENEWAL- A temporary driver's license or temporary identification card issued pursuant to this subparagraph may be renewed only upon presentation of valid documentary evidence that the status by which the applicant qualified for the temporary driver's license or temporary identification card has been extended by the Secretary of Homeland Security.
(3) VERIFICATION OF DOCUMENTS- To meet the requirements of this section, a State shall implement the following procedures:
(A) Before issuing a driver's license or identification card to a person, the State shall verify, with the issuing agency, the issuance, validity, and completeness of each document required to be presented by the person under paragraph (1) or (2).
(B) The State shall not accept any foreign document, other than an official passport, to satisfy a requirement of paragraph (1) or (2).
(C) Not later than September 11, 2005, the State shall enter into a memorandum of understanding with the Secretary of Homeland Security to routinely utilize the automated system known as Systematic Alien Verification for Entitlements, as provided for by section 404 of the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act of 1996 (110 Stat. 3009-664), to verify the legal presence status of a person, other than a United States citizen, applying for a driver's license or identification card.
(d) Other Requirements- To meet the requirements of this section, a State shall adopt the following practices in the issuance of drivers' licenses and identification cards:
(1) Employ technology to capture digital images of identity source documents so that the images can be retained in electronic storage in a transferable format.
(2) Retain paper copies of source documents for a minimum of 7 years or images of source documents presented for a minimum of 10 years.
(3) Subject each person applying for a driver's license or identification card to mandatory facial image capture.
(4) Establish an effective procedure to confirm or verify a renewing applicant's information.
(5) Confirm with the Social Security Administration a social security account number presented by a person using the full social security account number. In the event that a social security account number is already registered to or associated with another person to which any State has issued a driver's license or identification card, the State shall resolve the discrepancy and take appropriate action.
(6) Refuse to issue a driver's license or identification card to a person holding a driver's license issued by another State without confirmation that the person is terminating or has terminated the driver's license.
(7) Ensure the physical security of locations where drivers' licenses and identification cards are produced and the security of document materials and papers from which drivers' licenses and identification cards are produced.
(8) Subject all persons authorized to manufacture or produce drivers' licenses and identification cards to appropriate security clearance requirements.
(9) Establish fraudulent document recognition training programs for appropriate employees engaged in the issuance of drivers' licenses and identification cards.
(10) Limit the period of validity of all driver's licenses and identification cards that are not temporary to a period that does not exceed 8 years.
Funny, it is missing that whole
I genuinely ask where the dangers are, because I wanted to know, and I get half-truths. And I wonder why I am paranoid of some beliefs that pop up here.
Here is the ENTIRE 102. Funny, the part which you convienently put under 202 really goes under 102:
SEC. 102. WAIVER OF LAWS NECESSARY FOR IMPROVEMENT OF BARRIERS AT BORDERS.
Section 102(c) of the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act of 1996 (8 U.S.C. 1103 note) is amended to read as follows:
`(c) Waiver-
`(1) IN GENERAL- Notwithstanding any other provision of law, the Secretary of Homeland Security shall have the authority to waive, and shall waive, all laws such Secretary, in such Secretary's sole discretion, determines necessary to ensure expeditious construction of the barriers and roads under this section.
`(2) NO JUDICIAL REVIEW- Notwithstanding any other provision of law (statutory or nonstatutory), no court, administrative agency, or other entity shall have jurisdiction--
`(A) to hear any cause or claim arising from any action undertaken, or any decision made, by the Secretary of Homeland Security pursuant to paragraph (1); or
`(B) to order compensatory, declaratory, injunctive, equitable, or any other relief for damage alleged to arise from any such action or decision.'.
You want to know what that is amending? Here it is:
``(c) Waiver.--The provisions of the Endangered Species Act of 1973
[16 U.S.C. 1531 et seq.] and the National Environmental Policy Act of
1969 [42 U.S.C. 4321 et seq.] are waived to the extent the Attorney
General determines necessary to ensure expeditious construction of the
barriers and roads under this section [amending this section].''
A section talking about the Endagered Species Act, and environmental policies. (stolen from here: http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=browse_usc&docid=Cite:+8USC1103)
Now here is the ENTIRE 202:
SEC. 202. MINIMUM DOCUMENT REQUIREMENTS AND ISSUANCE STANDARDS FOR FEDERAL RECOGNITION.
(a) Minimum Standards for Federal Use-
(1) IN GENERAL- Beginning 3 years after the date of the enactment of this Act, a Federal agency may not accept, for any official purpose, a driver's license or identification card issued by a State to any person unless the State is meeting the requirements of this section.
(2) STATE CERTIFICATIONS- The Secretary shall determine whether a State is meeting the requirements of this section based on certifications made by the State to the Secretary of Transportation. Such certifications shall be made at such times and in such manner as the Secretary of Transportation, in consultation with the Secretary of Homeland Security, may prescribe by regulation.
(b) Minimum Document Requirements- To meet the requirements of this section, a State shall include, at a minimum, the following information and features on each driver's license and identification card issued to a person by the State:
(1) The person's full legal name.
(2) The person's date of birth.
(3) The person's gender.
(4) The person's driver's license or identification card number.
(5) A digital photograph of the person.
(6) The person's address of principle residence.
(7) The person's signature.
(8) Physical security features designed to prevent tampering, counterfeiting, or duplication of the document for fraudulent purposes.
(9) A common machine-readable technology, with defined minimum data elements.
(c) Minimum Issuance Standards-
(1) IN GENERAL- To meet the requirements of this section, a State shall require, at a minimum, presentation and verification of the following information before issuing a driver's license or identification card to a person:
(A) A photo identity document, except that a non-photo identity document is acceptable if it includes both the person's full legal name and date of birth.
(B) Documentation showing the person's date of birth.
(C) Proof of the person's social security account number or verification that the person is not eligible for a social security account number.
(D) Documentation showing the person's name and address of principal residence.
(2) SPECIAL REQUIREMENTS-
(A) IN GENERAL- To meet the requirements of this section, a State shall comply with the minimum standards of this paragraph.
(B) EVIDENCE OF LAWFUL STATUS- A State shall require, before issuing a driver's license or identification card to a person, valid documentary evidence that the person--
(i) is a citizen of the United States;
(ii) is an alien lawfully admitted for permanent or temporary residence in the United States;
(iii) has conditional permanent resident status in the United States;
(iv) has an approved application for asylum in the United States or has entered into the United States in refugee status;
(v) has a valid, unexpired nonimmigrant visa or nonimmigrant visa status for entry into the United States;
(vi) has a pending application for asylum in the United States;
(vii) has a pending or approved application for temporary protected status in the United States;
(viii) has approved deferred action status; or
(ix) has a pending application for adjustment of status to that of an alien lawfully admitted for permanent residence in the United States or conditional permanent resident status in the United States.
(C) TEMPORARY DRIVERS' LICENSES AND IDENTIFICATION CARDS-
(i) IN GENERAL- If a person presents evidence under any of clauses (v) through (ix) of subparagraph (B), the State may only issue a temporary driver's license or temporary identification card to the person.
(ii) EXPIRATION DATE- A temporary driver's license or temporary identification card issued pursuant to this subparagraph shall be valid only during the period of time of the applicant's authorized stay in the United States or, if there is no definite end to the period of authorized stay, a period of one year.
(iii) DISPLAY OF EXPIRATION DATE- A temporary driver's license or temporary identification card issued pursuant to this subparagraph shall clearly indicate that it is temporary and shall state the date on which it expires.
(iv) RENEWAL- A temporary driver's license or temporary identification card issued pursuant to this subparagraph may be renewed only upon presentation of valid documentary evidence that the status by which the applicant qualified for the temporary driver's license or temporary identification card has been extended by the Secretary of Homeland Security.
(3) VERIFICATION OF DOCUMENTS- To meet the requirements of this section, a State shall implement the following procedures:
(A) Before issuing a driver's license or identification card to a person, the State shall verify, with the issuing agency, the issuance, validity, and completeness of each document required to be presented by the person under paragraph (1) or (2).
(B) The State shall not accept any foreign document, other than an official passport, to satisfy a requirement of paragraph (1) or (2).
(C) Not later than September 11, 2005, the State shall enter into a memorandum of understanding with the Secretary of Homeland Security to routinely utilize the automated system known as Systematic Alien Verification for Entitlements, as provided for by section 404 of the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act of 1996 (110 Stat. 3009-664), to verify the legal presence status of a person, other than a United States citizen, applying for a driver's license or identification card.
(d) Other Requirements- To meet the requirements of this section, a State shall adopt the following practices in the issuance of drivers' licenses and identification cards:
(1) Employ technology to capture digital images of identity source documents so that the images can be retained in electronic storage in a transferable format.
(2) Retain paper copies of source documents for a minimum of 7 years or images of source documents presented for a minimum of 10 years.
(3) Subject each person applying for a driver's license or identification card to mandatory facial image capture.
(4) Establish an effective procedure to confirm or verify a renewing applicant's information.
(5) Confirm with the Social Security Administration a social security account number presented by a person using the full social security account number. In the event that a social security account number is already registered to or associated with another person to which any State has issued a driver's license or identification card, the State shall resolve the discrepancy and take appropriate action.
(6) Refuse to issue a driver's license or identification card to a person holding a driver's license issued by another State without confirmation that the person is terminating or has terminated the driver's license.
(7) Ensure the physical security of locations where drivers' licenses and identification cards are produced and the security of document materials and papers from which drivers' licenses and identification cards are produced.
(8) Subject all persons authorized to manufacture or produce drivers' licenses and identification cards to appropriate security clearance requirements.
(9) Establish fraudulent document recognition training programs for appropriate employees engaged in the issuance of drivers' licenses and identification cards.
(10) Limit the period of validity of all driver's licenses and identification cards that are not temporary to a period that does not exceed 8 years.
Funny, it is missing that whole
bit
I genuinely ask where the dangers are, because I wanted to know, and I get half-truths. And I wonder why I am paranoid of some beliefs that pop up here.
rock jock
Member
If it as bad as some are claiming, there will be a challenge in court.
Lone_Gunman
Member
Right, like campaign finance reform
jefnvk, it requires database sharing between the states, and requires some data elements that some states do not currently require. I suspect eventually this will lead to a uniform numbering system. My DL in California had one letter plus 7 digits, my TX one has 8 digits. Uniform numbering means we'll eventually keep the same number when we move between states, which means corporations will have another tool to track people. Social security numbers are supposed to be subject to strict privacy requirements, but there are no such limitations on driver's license numbers. Social security numbers (and passport numbers, but they aren't required of anyone) are currently the only single items that allows nation-wide tracking of most people.
LiquidTension
Member
Awww...this just HAD to happen as I start my third read of Unintended Consequences. Who's got pigs?
Not that I'd ever do anything to protect freedom, lord no
Not that I'd ever do anything to protect freedom, lord no
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