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These pictures and tales of perfect shooting

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by woodstock72000@yahoo.com, Oct 21, 2007.

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  1. woodstock72000@yahoo.com

    woodstock72000@yahoo.com member

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    I`m having trouble believing some of these pics and tales of shooting accuracy here. I`m a member of a club here in my area and we have some superb gunners that are members. We shoot all around this area and it`s very seldom that at least 2 or 3 of our guys don`t walk away winners of any certain event. And I can`t remember when several of us didn`t at least earn the title of runner-up. On this sight there are always pics and statements made of some miraculous shooting and I`m not so sure that they`re ligitimate.

    Handgun shooting is a monster compared to rifle shooting and statements like "2 1/2 inch groups at 20+ yards with my S@W 1911 .45" are everywhere on the high road. Now this is possible to do, I`m not saying that it isn`t, but there are also statements like" 2 inch group at 25+ yards with my Glock 22 .40 S@W." and pictures of paper plates with a little orange dot in the middle as targets with the orange nearly gone from the tightly placed group with writing on the target stating things like "25 yards while using my Taurus 357.

    I`ve got the guys in the club to come to the high road and check it out and we`ve came to the conclusion that most of these pics and tales are false information. Now shooting a 2 inch group at 18-25 yards with open sights is possible but when I do i`m surprised. I`ve been to a lot of matches and I`ve seen many,many great shots in my life and I`ve also saw that a 2 inch group is almost a guaranteed trip into the next round accompanied by applause and many pats on the back; so how is it that so many people speak of this so commonly? I`m sorry but I just don`t believe it, not out of hand with no rest. I mean no offense but please:

    Give me your thoughts on this matter.
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2007
  2. woodstock72000@yahoo.com

    woodstock72000@yahoo.com member

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    guns

    I`m not really concerned with any specific gun and don`t want this to end up being a mine`s better, please fellows.:)
     
  3. CZF

    CZF Member

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    Shoot a Cz or SIG and see what accuracy is all about.
    9mms have decnt accuracy out of a CZ.
    The .40s are a cut above most .40s for shooting tight groups.

    The 97B is a tackdriver at 20 yards or closer.
     
  4. woodstock72000@yahoo.com

    woodstock72000@yahoo.com member

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    In the hands with no rest is how we do it and how most matches that are shown on espn and there are never consistant 2 inch groups beyond the 18 yard mark that are shot with higher caliber weapons, never.
     
  5. LarryS.

    LarryS. Member

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    My guess there's a fair chance some of the range yardage estimations could be a little off as could the group sizes if eyeballed rather than measured.
    Just my $0.02......
     
  6. igpoobah

    igpoobah Member

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    then

    Soooo, all the other Internet commando's are not to be believed.......unless it's you?

    I find this comically ironic. And there's no need to get bent out of shape; I'm not attacking you, just an interesting observation...:neener:
     
  7. woodstock72000@yahoo.com

    woodstock72000@yahoo.com member

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    igpoobah,
    you got me, is this better?
     
  8. Geno
    • Contributing Member

    Geno Member

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    Larry said:

    I also think it is because some people measure edge-to-edge versus others who measure center-to-center. Depending on what caliber one fires, that can make a big difference.

    Here's the solution...pictures or videos. They worth a 1,000 words. Better yet have it witnessed and signed by a range officer. That is what I did.
     
  9. woodstock72000@yahoo.com

    woodstock72000@yahoo.com member

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    Why didn`t you quote the complete sentence," but when I do I`m surprised"

    I thought it was funny, i was waiting on that one, man you`re quick. There`s one more that leaves me open for trash talk if you look hard enough.
     
  10. woodstock72000@yahoo.com

    woodstock72000@yahoo.com member

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    Pictures mean nothing because I could shoot a target at point blank range and write whatever I felt like writing as far as the yardage. I know that most of these eagle-eyed shooters are ,,,,exagerating, just thought I`d see what others thought about it.
     
  11. igpoobah

    igpoobah Member

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    I was just pulling out the pertinent info, I like to keep it simple.
     
  12. Geno
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    Geno Member

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    woodstock:

    I have a cousin (in-law) who shot competition for the Air Force (early 1980s). One day my uncle says to me, "What 'til you see Jim shoot that new Llama custom-built .45! He can keep 1" groups at 100 meters off the bench".

    So, I am standing there waiting for Jim to “choke” and make him out to be a liar...short of it, he held well under 1" at 100 meters, using target iron sights, hand-loaded hard cast lead, at about 600 FPS. If I had not seen it with my own eyes, I would say liar. But, how much practice did it take?

    For my part, I have purchased over 35, model 1911s in the past 3 years. I sold most because they would not shoot. I will not keep a 1911 that will not group or if it is unreliable. Too, I was shooting thousands of rounds per month. On average, I used to shoot 200 to 300 rounds each day that I drove to the office. Most weeks I drove in 5 to 6 days. That's a lot of practice. That’s a lot of expense.

    Now, following my neurosurgery I seriously struggle to keep 1" at 25 feet. That's all fine with me. I am still in recovery mode from my 35th surgery. As I see it, if someone lies about their firearms, or their firearms ability, they are the liar, not me, and if they can live with it, so be it.

    Doc2005
     
  13. Tom Servo

    Tom Servo Member

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    Actually, I've seen people shoot groups at 15 FEET and claim it was 15 yards. That's quite common--it may be a deficiency in our educational system.

    What you're describing, if true, is phenomenal shooting. Phenomenal, but not impossible. I've seen things like that done, and when I do, I make it a point to ask the shooter for advice :)

    My vision is pretty much useless past about 15 yards for pinpoint accuracy with a handgun, but up until then I can group pretty well with a handgun. On a good day, with a good gun and warmup time, 2" is no big problem.

    I have done better at longer ranges, but that's usually been either a stroke of divine providence, or just a situation where every factor has gone JUST right.
     
  14. tnieto2004

    tnieto2004 Member

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    1" group with a .45 at 100 meters?!?! I am WAYYYYY behind .. :banghead:
     
  15. Deer Hunter

    Deer Hunter Member

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    It's not too bad shooting at 50 feet, which is what Texas A&M's shooting team practices at. There are guys on the team that do so with great accuracy. As for me, I'm lucky to get all mine under the 7 ring. A couple 10s on a target is wonderful!
     
  16. armoredman

    armoredman Member

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    The pics I post are accurate and truthful. I am sorry if people don't believe, but hey, it's the Internet. Nobody has to believe.
    Here is one, yes this was shot at 25 yards, end of the indoor range, but you can see a worse group taped over. That was the best one, phenomenal, or I wouldn't have photographed it.

    [​IMG]

    This is a representative of a group on a not so good day.

    [​IMG]

    This was one of those "what the heck went wrong" days. But, it's the truth, and the writing on the target is correct, including the load.

    I can only hope that most others here do take the High Road, and post honest groups.
     
  17. atblis

    atblis Member

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    Why did you stop at 3?
     
  18. woodstock72000@yahoo.com

    woodstock72000@yahoo.com member

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    Like you said, you were a kid because this,my friend, is bull____
     
  19. Caimlas

    Caimlas Member

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    Inside or outside edge? Personally, I'm measuring the full spread (outside edge), and 2" at 25 yards on paper is something I have a difficult time doing with open sight rifle from a standing position, never mind with a pistol. I'm not a bad shot - I can group 1" pretty consistently with a rifle at 100 yards and good ammo, provided I have a low mag scope - but I do have fairly poor eye sight and vision problems.

    Still, 2" at 25 yards is a bit of a stretch. Once or twice, and on rare occasion, sure. With any sort of regularity, though, you're going to be a one-in-a-hundred-thousand. There are many a Master marksman who can not boast that kind of proficiency; heck, a handgun that can achieve 2" at 25 yards isn't all that common.
     
  20. Guns R Tools

    Guns R Tools Member

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    Here is mine.
    [​IMG]
    I just got my SW model 41. Used.

    It was my first time shooting it.

    Target was set at 30 feet. Shooting off hand with both hands.

    I tried 3 different brands of ammo.

    Federal bulk and Remington was from walmart value pack.
    CCI competition from local store (about $16 per box of 100).

    CCI does feel more consistent shot to shot in terms of recoil.

    Sorry for size of image. My shrinking skill is weak.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2007
  21. Guns R Tools

    Guns R Tools Member

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    sorry double post.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2007
  22. Blarelli

    Blarelli Member

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    I'll be honest. I'm not a great shot, but i'm not bad either. Shooting without a rest, with my old ruger p90 at 20 yards, I have had about a 3 inch group, but that doesn't happen very often. It's usually more like a 5 or 6 inch group. A 1.5 inch group from my 22/45 at the 50 foot range doesn't surprise me, but still doesn't happen terribly often.
     
  23. RyanM

    RyanM Member

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    Bad range estimation is probably a big part of it. Like here's the best group I've ever shot in my entire life.

    [​IMG]

    But I have to honestly say I cannot remember what the range was. I think it was around 10 yards, but it may have actually been 7 or even 5. All I know for certain is it was no closer than 5 yards, .22 LR Federal bulk pack, standing, Ruger Mk.II with 4" taper barrel. I also know that with my most recent range trip, I was doing about 2" groups at 10 yards with the same pistol and ammo, but that was definitely an off day. My hands were shaking like I'd just drank an entire carafe of coffee (exaggeration).
     

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  24. bigred82

    bigred82 Member

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    [​IMG]

    That's my best. Under 2" at 10yds. Give me enough practice and experience - and it will get smaller. ;)
     
  25. woodstock72000@yahoo.com

    woodstock72000@yahoo.com member

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    Right guys, 2 inches at ten yards is a completely different world than two inches at 20+ yards. You guys get the point, I can see that you know exactly what I`m talking about.

    Notice how this thread has had very limited response? That`s exactly what my gun club friends said would happen. It kinda scares those "experts" off if you know what I mean.

    I will say this to the guy with the .22. With a .22 you should shoot much better groups than with a higher caliber. The recoil and velocity play a big part in the great accuracy of the .22 and other small calibers.

    Did you know that the .22 was once and may still be the caliber of choice for mercs. I watched a special report several years ago that had an ex-merc. speaking about it. He spoke highly of the ricochet effect with a noggin shot. That`s about all I can remember.
     
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