Thoughts on joining the Marines...

[cousinelmer1]

Sheepskin is a good thing!

Military is a good thing and I recommend it. You are so close to a degree that will open other doors with the military that is worth a long thought. In 20 years if the military works out to be your thing you could be retire as an O6 or higher will make it all worth while! Maybe you could get the Marines to agree to pay the rest of your schooling and bring you in as an officer after you graduate, you owe it to yourself to ask this question with them and all the other branches. Good Luck and Merry Christmas to you.

 

[BADUNAME4]

Finish college and go to OCS. If you make it you'll be a much improved version of your current self. Not different - better.

 

[Winger Ed.]

2. Could Winger please explain this (From previous thread): It is kind of disturbing. Is he merely suggesting that if one isn't commited in mind and spirit, and willing to give 100%, that they will likely fail and face the difficulty presented by a dishonorable discharge for the rest of their life? Or is it saying something else? .

Basic training is tough, no doubt about it. But it is survivable, and most of getting through it is mental. There are folks who are darn near Olympic atheletes who don't complete the training and washout simply because they can't deal with the harshness and stress. And other, normal, regular every day people, that will just keep putting one foot in front of the other as long as it takes to get where they're going and finish the job at hand,,,,,,,,, they are the true warriors, and where heroes come from.

And there is a reason for doing this. I heard it explained once, "If you can't take getting yelled at a little, or forcing yourself to work and keep going because you're tired, or hungry, how the heck are you going to handle being out in the Fleet, or on a combat patrol, a survival situation, or maybe being a POW? The Corps needs to find out this sort of thing as soon as possible".

As far as the physical part, pretty much anybody in decent shape can do it, if they want to bad enough. And many people don't. Any of the more intense miiitary training, finishing college, becoming a Doctor, building your own house, all sorts of things in life are like that. Most people can acheive these things, but don't want to reach a goal bad enough to finish it or do what it takes to complete getting what they want.

////////

Does washing out always lead to a Dishonorable Discharge and having to go through life like a former fellon? No, of course not. But then again, a General Discharge or being discharged 'at the convience of the govt.' will put the bug in your head of being a failure at something that will never go away. People holding them are always making excuses for getting one, trying to justify them, denying their importance, or even that they have one.

Less than honorable discharges will haunt you too. What do ya think will happen when you apply for a job, maybe with the govt. and among the applicants, it comes down to you and a few other persons, maybe one or two with a Honorable Discharge? Some day you might need to get a high level security clearance, they don't look good, or help you in the least. And right, wrong, or indifferent---Those investigators and the powers that be see those discharges as a sign of imaturity, or irresponsibility.

/////////////

Along the lines of 'wanting something is often better than having it':
I've also seen guys that were just absolutely miserable for the remaining time on their contracts too. They finished them, got Honorable Discharges, and moved on, but also had very few fond memories to look back on for the slice of time it cost them.

I thouroughly enjoyed my years in the Service, and perhaps had the best tour of duty that any human ever had. I wouldn't want to discourage you or anyone else from joining the military. It greatly helped make me what I am, and has opened many doors since then too.

However;
It ain't a rose garden either. And I hate seeing young folks going into, or getting into something they know little about that is so life changing and important of a decision. I don't want to sound discouraging, but this is something you should think through very carefully.

To answer your question, yes. The key to a great experiance and getting all you can from your tour of duty is putting body and soul into it. Any branch of the US military is one of the ultimate 'you will get out of it, more than you put in' sort of things a young American can do.

I enjoy helping young people, sharing my experiances, and perspectives on things. I wouldn't want to discourage or scare you about this matter. I only wish to express the importance of this decision you're about to make.

I believe that whatever you decide to do, I'm sure you will do well.

Good luck.

 

[medmo]

If you do decide to go see a recruiter be honest and up front about your knee. You might need a waiver and they will probably have to review it with a doctor. If you were to have a problem and couldn't complete recruit training you would be "seperated at entry" and there would be no negative implications when you rejoin the civilian world.

I can't tell you what to do as far as your decision. Here is my father's advice when I asked him what I should do: "Son, I wouldn't take a million dollars for the experiences I gained from being a U.S. Marine. You also couldn't pay me a million dollars to do it over again."

I would recommend that you go see a recruiter. I would also recommend that you evaluate how bad you want to do it. You have to be committed 100% because the only way you get the title of Marine is earning it.

Every Marine is a "Lifer" if you serve for 4 years or 40. It is that much of a life changing experience. Once a Marine, Always a Marine.

 

[MTMilitiaman]

Winger, thank you so much for that reply. It was far more than I expected but very much appreciated. My brother didn't think his decision to join the Army through at all. It was a spontaneous decision he made with little or no thought given to its implications. He is now in Iraq and hates everything about his current situation. But he has always butted heads with authority figures. He's always had to be the center of attention, an individual, and has always prided himself with being a non-conformist. We can all tell that the Army has done good things for him, but he's hated every minute of it. That is what I want to avoid.

I can remember playing with my brother and cousin on my grandpa's property. We were always Marines then. That has stuck with me. I've wanted to be a Marine since I was a child. My cousin went Air Force and my brother joined my dad and grandpa as members of our family to carry on the Army tradition--my grandpa having served in Korea in 53 and my dad having been part of an artillery crew in the 80s. I have breifly considered the Army but in the end, I could never picture myself as anything other than a Marine.

Graduating high school I was 4th in a class of 59 right behind two people tied with 4.0s and a girl that beat my 3.86 by 2/100 of a point. I took advanced classes and did well on my ACTs, so it seemed only natural for me to go to college. But in college, I found I didn't have the motivation to study and hit the books. I hated high school and with it out of the way, I wanted to have my fun. Now I have 9 semesters of college behind me without a degree, I am thousands of dollars in debt, and I am 23. The fun is over for me and I have been thinking long and hard about what I want from life and what I want from myself.

I've seen from my brother's experience that it isn't a garden of roses. And I know from five summers with the Forest Service that the government can be Charlie Foxtrot and there are moments I will hate it. I have always been the quiet, thoughtful type. I do a lot of thinking--at times, too much. And knowing that commiting has always been the hardest part for me, I know I will do a lot of thinking before I sign anything, if for no other reason than that I owe it to my brother to learn from his mistakes. But I very much think there is a world of difference in motivation and expectation between my brother and I.

I also very much want and need to achieve this dream. I need to be proud of something in my life, to see something in myself that makes me feel I am a part of something. I want to hold my head high and know that I have accomplished something that few, including myself at times, thought I could do. I realized within these last months that before I can expect others to respect me, I have to respect myself. That is why I am considering the Marines despite being told I could get bigger sign on bonuses or more benfits elsewhere. I've been sweaty, dirty, and tired. I've come home from work exhausted with my back tight, arms and legs sore, and blood stains in my socks from the holes worn in my feet from new boots and 14 miles of hiking. I have had my hands numb from 12 hours of sawing in 120 degree heat and went to bed knowing I had more of the same the next day. And I have waded across a creek, humped my gear up a mountain to a fire, only to have the chopper bail before dropping the rest of our gear at the sight. I slept under a peice of plastic at the base of a tree as it rained on me knowing that I would dig line and pack hose for 14 hours the next day. In the end, I am not afraid of earning something. Work doesn't scare me. Seeing myself as a poor 23 year-old college drop out who is still single and living with his parents with nothing to show for it, does.

 

[medmo]

"I need to be proud of something in my life, to see something in myself that makes me feel I am a part of something. I want to hold my head high and know that I have accomplished something that few, including myself at times, thought I could do. I realized within these last months that before I can expect others to respect me, I have to respect myself."

'nuff said. I enisted after three semesters of college at the age of 19. I had my 20th B-day at Parris Island. College was a breeze and more meaningful after I returned to it about 4 years later. I stayed in the active reserves for another four years. You might also discuss USMCR options with your recruiter. Good luck with the decision.

 

[Shadizar]

This is one of the few posts I will comment on without reading the rest...

As a Marine I can say you will not regret it. Are there choices that will meke your life as fulfilling? YES. Will you regret being a Marine? NO. Regardless of where you go or what you do you will always have that. I have never regretten being a Marine.

Make your choice carefully. It WILL stay with my own choice forever, be a Marine. Good or bad, it will shape your life. Being a Marine will make you a part of a brotherhood. Some believe this, and some do not. In the end it is your choice and like no other will shape YOUR like. It will give you confindence in what whatever you wish to accomplish.

The other services can do the same. I am biased. I can tell you with certaintly that the Marine Corps WILL challenge you. Best of luck to you. My personal motto is, "if you're going to do it, go with the best." The Marine Corps will offer you that. If you want to be enmeshed in a warrior culture it is the place for you.

I loved the Marine Corps and still do, they are warriors, there are others, but my vote if for them.

-Shadizar

 

[All-Around-Shooter]

If you go the enlisted route...

Your recruiter will lie to you.

If you make it past MEPS and go to boot camp:

Your drill instructor will tell you the truth.

You will love it.

You will hate it.

Late at night, while walking firewatch.You will walk into the head and look at yourself in the mirror and call yourself an idiot.

You will never forget graduation day. (should you make it.)

You will be treated like a boot untill you become a lance corporal.
(unless your school is long and you hit the fleet as a Lcpl. Then,
you will be treated like a boot until some new boots show up.)

You will lose your girlfriend back home. (most likely.)

You stand a good chance of serving in a combat zone.(regardless of MOS, CRC anyone?)

You won't have much of a personal life.

You will make lifetime friends.

They are going to get their moneys worth out of you.
Get yours too.
Get as much schooling and training as you can.
Get as much college as possible out of the way while on active duty.

There are many more, these just popped into my head.

One more, After you get out You will wish you stayed in. (sometimes.)

 

[Kurt_M]

I've just got to second everything that All-Around-Shooter said. Your motivation for joining sounds very similar to mine. I did well in high school and could have gone to college on scholarships. I had no real desire to do so, since I had no idea what I wanted out of school. So I joined the Army instead. It wasn't fun, but it was probably the best thing I could have done. Now I'm done with my tour of duty and I've just finished my first semester of college. I've gotten much more out of my classes than I ever did in high school, I've never regretted signing up, even when I hated what I was doing and where I was at. If you maintain the outlook you've shown in this thread, you should do great.

 

[Winger Ed.]

I can remember playing with my brother and cousin on my grandpa's property. We were always Marines then. That has stuck with me. I've wanted to be a Marine since I was a child.

I also very much want and need to achieve this dream. I need to be proud of something in my life, to see something in myself that makes me feel I am a part of something. .

Sounds like me in the early 70's.

Whatever you do, the more higher education you have will pay off many times over. As near as you are to finishing, I'd encourage ya to to stick it out and finish your BA degree.

Talk to a recruiter about College ROTC. They'll pay ya a few bucks to stay in school, which sounds like it'd help ya right now. At OCS, they're looking for leadership in addition to the other aspects of the training. If you can think on your feet, take charge of a group, are good at public speaking, keep your wits about you under stress, that's what they'll be looking for in an Officer Candidate.

If you decide to enlist, with the 'smarts' you already have, you'll probably end up in Avaition Maintenance, or some of the Electronic 'Twidgit' fields. Get ahold of a recruiter, take the tests, and see what you qualify for. If its something you're interested in, get a guarantee in writting,,,,,, you may end up in the same place anyway going in with a 'open contract', but there's no need to gamble with your career field choice. In the Marine Corps, its not real hard to move around from one field to another, especially if the educational requirements for the new MOS (job) are higher than the one you're already in.

And the Marine Corps is the one that does 'Embassy Duty', After you get out in the Fleet, request it, do the interviews, get to MSG school, and see where that takes ya....... There's all sorts of 2 year details available for the asking. Heck, you might even find yourself as a Recruiter in 'Who Knows Where', USA.

Anyway,
It sounds like ya got your head screwed on straight, and will do well at whatever you choose to do.

Good luck.

 

[medmo]

"You will lose your girlfriend back home. (most likely.)"

Damn that Jody and Suzy! Curse of the Corps!

"If you decide to enlist, with the 'smarts' you already have, you'll probably end up in Avaition Maintenance, or some of the Electronic 'Twidgit' fields."

"Smarts" and "Aviation/Electronics"? I thought they made all of us geniuses 0311's?

 

[TOADMAN]

Finish College First!!!

 

[coylh]

Killing your way to self respect is a strange proposition.

 

[Ezekiel]

I recommend the book, "Making the Corps", by Thomas E. Ricks.

It is only a single view -- and I am not a proponent of the sort of indoctrination that takes place -- but it is somewhere to start.

Quite honestly, it is self-evident that I was not born for such a life of indentured servitude. (The mere book made me think these guys were brainwashed into becoming elitist stormtroopers and that any values outside the Corps are to be disdained.) The real question, however, is what sort of life you were born to lead.

One way, or the other, I cannot help but imagine a military hitch will help you decide.

Oh yeah, "finish college" if at all possible.

Good luck!

 

[Tejas Gunwerks]

Go enlist in an combat arms in the Marine Corps. Put off college for now. You can always come back to it later, heck, you can even get the Marine Corps to pay for it. If you want to be an officer, be enlisted first. Marines need experienced officers, not snot nosed, wet behind the ears momma boys right out of college. There are several way to get your commission. You are only young once, so do the high speed, low drag, fun stuff while you can. The experience will be uniquely yours, there is not a damn person on this board that can tell you how it will work out for you. As Mr. Nike said "Just do it!"

Semper Fi.

 

[Wllm. Legrand]

1) Don't believe the recruiters. They are salesmen, period.

2) If you get injured in the Corps (as my son) you better play hardball with regards to their giving you all the help benefits they can to get you back to the way you were. It's a bureaucracy, first and foremost.

3) You are a "human resource", in any government employ. Get used to it.

4. Don't sign on the dotted line for benefits and discharge until you speak to an attorney.

This is on the advice of a former Master Sgt., (not me), but one who was in for 20 and gave my son that advice after it became obvious that he was given the runaround...

He still can't do a pull-up or a push-up, but because of his background and the stop-loss program they won't let him go.

No, he is not a field marine (they don't get many that have been through calculus), but because of his training and specialty, his health seems only important if he can't do his job...no matter how much pain he is in.

That's a fact, Jack..

 

[MTMilitiaman]

Killing your way to self respect is a strange proposition.

I am a strange guy in a strange world. Sounds like strange fits right in. One of Murphy's Laws is that if it sounds strange but works, it isn't strange.

 

[6inch]

1) Don't believe the recruiters. They are salesmen, period.

2) If you get injured in the Corps (as my son) you better play hardball with regards to their giving you all the help benefits they can to get you back to the way you were. It's a bureaucracy, first and foremost.

3) You are a "human resource", in any government employ. Get used to it.

4. Don't sign on the dotted line for benefits and discharge until you speak to an attorney.

This is on the advice of a former Master Sgt., (not me), but one who was in for 20 and gave my son that advice after it became obvious that he was given the runaround...

He still can't do a pull-up or a push-up, but because of his background and the stop-loss program they won't let him go.

No, he is not a field marine (they don't get many that have been through calculus), but because of his training and specialty, his health seems only important if he can't do his job...no matter how much pain he is in.

That's a fact, Jack..

I'm sorry you think your son got a bad deal but as a 100% permanent/total, service connected, Marine Corps veteran I take great exception to your list of "Facts".

BTW. Your post should have ended with That's a fact as told to me, Jack.

 

[shane justice]

Lives turn out different than we thought they would...all for the good I expect...

If I could do it all again...

I would join the Corps...

something I will always regret not doing....

Shane

 

[Stainless0ne]

Nuts!

I know im going to to get hate mail because of this, but, i just gotta. I have many relatives and a few friends that have been in the marines. Some were lifers, some not. All of them came out screwed up mentally in some way or another, and should be (and usually are) on anti-depressants, and nerve medication. Do what you must, but talk with some people who have been there first (not recruiters). "I can replace you easier than i can your boots!"- general eisenhower to his troops, WWII.

 

[USMCRotrHed]

My 2 cents

My recruiter did not lie to me, but some of them do. Even after I walked in with long hair and an ear ring and told him what job I wanted and that I wouldn't join unless I got it (I got it). Ask every question you can think of. Then research what the recruiter said. As far as OCS goes, Officers get treated better, plain and simple. If you decide to make a career of it, become an officer. Staff NCOs aren't treated bad, but officers are just treated better.

Keep in mind that most everyone in their first enlistment wants to get out ASAP. That's the way it goes. I spent 5 years on Active Duty and have been out for 10 years. I sure wish I could get back in. The pay's not great, but they give you free ammo and pick up the gunsmith tab, then feed you and give you a place to sleep.

When I was in, if you joined with 60 hours of college, it was an automatic promotion to PFC in boot camp. That puts you 6 months ahead of the rest of the recruits in your platoon. Seniority is everything!

Good luck and Semper Fi!!

PS That ethos you are talking about is Esprit de Corps. It's what makes the Corps work.

 

[spaceCADETzoom]

I know im going to to get hate mail because of this, but, i just gotta. I have many relatives and a few friends that have been in the marines. Some were lifers, some not. All of them came out screwed up mentally in some way or another, and should be (and usually are) on anti-depressants, and nerve medication. Do what you must, but talk with some people who have been there first (not recruiters). "I can replace you easier than i can your boots!"- general eisenhower to his troops, WWII.

maybe it's not that the Marines made them nuts...but that they were nuts and then joined the Marines. It takes a special soul to be lured by commercials (they have swords!), and not pay much attention to battle history outside of select movies...

i kid. not about the "if they're nutty going in, they're nutty coming out" part, though...

 

[medmo]

"I know im going to to get hate mail because of this, but, i just gotta. I have many relatives and a few friends that have been in the marines. Some were lifers, some not. All of them came out screwed up mentally in some way or another, and should be (and usually are) on anti-depressants, and nerve medication. Do what you must, but talk with some people who have been there first (not recruiters). "I can replace you easier than i can your boots!"- general eisenhower to his troops, WWII."

Which Marines are you talking about? Screwed up mentally is a subjective term.... are you writing their medical scripts?

"My recruiter did not lie to me, but some of them do."

Recruiters tend to keep blatant mistruths to a minimum. Potential recruits tend to hear what they want to hear regardless. It isn't possible for a recruiter to convey the experience of the making of a Marine with 100% accuracy and clarity.

"Quite honestly, it is self-evident that I was not born for such a life of indentured servitude. (The mere book made me think these guys were brainwashed into becoming elitist stormtroopers and that any values outside the Corps are to be disdained.) The real question, however, is what sort of life you were born to lead."

Serving your God, Country and Corps in a selfless manner is "indentured servitude"? Son, I think you might know about Brain Washing and it only took a few suds with a very little brush. Stormtrooper = Nazis, I can't respond to your comment in a socially acceptable manner so I'll just note it and move on.

"1) Don't believe the recruiters. They are salesmen, period.

2) If you get injured in the Corps (as my son) you better play hardball with regards to their giving you all the help benefits they can to get you back to the way you were. It's a bureaucracy, first and foremost.

3) You are a "human resource", in any government employ. Get used to it.

4. Don't sign on the dotted line for benefits and discharge until you speak to an attorney.

This is on the advice of a former Master Sgt., (not me), but one who was in for 20 and gave my son that advice after it became obvious that he was given the runaround...

He still can't do a pull-up or a push-up, but because of his background and the stop-loss program they won't let him go.

No, he is not a field marine (they don't get many that have been through calculus), but because of his training and specialty, his health seems only important if he can't do his job...no matter how much pain he is in.

That's a fact, Jack.."

Interesting comments..... You stated "That's a fact, Jack." but either you do or don't know that there are more facts out there that are not in your post. There is definitely more going on here then is being represented. The Corps does everthing possible to assist it's wounded warriors and there are plenty of other groups that go even further with assistance like the VFW, The American Legion, The Marine Corps League, etc. C'mon post all of it if you know it. The USMC is not made up of academic rejects and mouth breathers. I knew a few Marines that did very well in Calculus and just for the record if you aren't a "field marine" then you are not a US Marine.

 

[KC&97TA]

Being a Marine ain't a rose garden, there's a war going on, world wide war. There's also alot of transfering to/from units is going on, some times you're happy with these transfers, some times you aren't, regaurdless these transfers result in more deployments. Since you are already on your way to a degree, I sugest you join the Marine Reserve, find things out from the enlisted mans perspective, after you have gotten your degree, then come to active duty as an officer, don't forget the aggony of being enlisted, ever! The worst part about the military is you spend the first 3-4 years takeing out the trash and scrubbing toilets, over populated barraks, someone always knocking on your door wanting you to pick up trash on the front lawn on a sunday morning. Being enlisted ain't no joke and I have alot of respect for the grief I went through and for my men underneith me going through it right now.

Medical in the Marine Corps is hit or miss, I'll tell you I'm 24, have bad knees now, acheing back & nerve damage in my arm and neck. My body has taken a beating, but for some reason, it really doesn't matter any more. Get used to Motrin and Water being a cure for everything. I have a few medical problems, Post Tramatic Stress Disorder, but through it all, I'm not crazy, I'm not brain washed, it all just adds to the jouney.

Always remember: Sgt's run the Corps.

Those with Combat Experiance don't want to here the opinions of others that don't, on topics they learned from a book and not from lessons learned after being shot at or bleeding or seeing thier buddys die. Purple Hearts aren't "enemy marksmanship badges".

Stay away from the USMC Air Wing, they're a bunch of PIGS. sorry air wingers but you are.

Division or Regiment is a boys club, were the 'Big Green Gun Club' expression comes from. No girls allowed in this part of the gun club & the most fun and best storys you'll ever have to tell, or not tell, will come from this area of the Corps. If you like to pee in the dirt, sleep in the dirt, be covered in dirt, shave in a hummer mirror, then a Regiment is the place to be.

It takes 5 Person Other than Combat arms MOS to support every 1 person who is Combat Arms, so be nice to the POGs when you come in from outside the wire, but don't be afraid to tell them thier per-puse and who is and isn't pulling triggers everyday.

If you want to make a career out of it, I sugest you stay away from the GI Joe MOS's, they'll get you killed & mamed. If you want to do 4-6 years and go on your way, There's alot of highly rewarding places to gain experience to take with you back to the civilian world.

The military isn't for everyone, usually when an Officer makes a big mistake they loose thier commision, when an Enlisted man makes a mistake it's NJP or Courts Martial - there's alot of rules, but they're for the better of this Country, the Corps and yourself. Don't worry about makeing mistakes and a bad discharge. Medical Discharges are not looked down apon.

BTW: I don't hate all officers, just a select few.

 

[All-Around-Shooter]

Stay away from the USMC Air Wing, they're a bunch of PIGS. sorry air wingers but you are.

In your seemingly vast experience as a combat Marine, have these "pigs"
ever provided you CAS?

Remember, if necessary an air winger can serve as a rifleman. Can you wrench
on an F-18? Air wingers are definitley lax when it comes to uniforms, haircuts and sometimes even weight standards.But you won't see a harder working bunch of Marines.They endure extremely long hours, workups, deployments, inspections, rifle range and all the other annual Marine Corps requirements.


The Marine Corps has many different roles. To suggest that any one is better/more important is wrong.

To call a fellow Marine a "pig" is very "boot camp".