UPS refuses to send firearms from non-FFL to FFL! New Regulations?

[GunNut]

UPS SUCKS!!!!!!!!! New Regulations???

Tried to ship a rifle to an FFL in another state today.

Clerk says: Are you an FFL? No.

Are you shipping to a manufacture? No..

I then explain to him that I am shipping to a FFL in another state. He then informs me UPS clarified the situation to him this morning, and they will only take FFL to FFL shipments, unless you are sending it in for repair work.

I called UPS' 800 number and what this clerk said was confirmed.


Also, called Fedex, and they now say all firearms must go overnight.


UPS sucks, Fedex sucks, and the only way to get the rifle delivered was by good old USPS(but they won't take evil handguns).


Steve

 

[Standing Wolf]

UPS has practiced anti-Second Amendment bigotry a long time. It's my carrier of last choice.

 

[UberPhLuBB]

I've always had a problem with UPS, but it wasn't gun related. They ALWAYS punch holes in my boxes. In the past 15 years, I've lived in 3 houses and recieved packages from UPS in each house, so it's not a local hub thing, it's clearly common practice.

In two instances, there were BROOMSTICK sized holes (HoleS! Plural!) in my packages. In another, three corners were bashed in (REALLY bashed in, the box inside the UPS package was mangled beyond repair) and it had scratches and puncture marks all over it, like they smeared the package in meat juice and threw it in a cage with a pack of wild Timberwolves.

I made this about a year ago to explain the broom stick holes. I'm sure most of you fellows have seen the old American Airlines commercials, with the gorilla jumping on and trashing suitcases, working for "the competitor?" Well this here is a troop of Package Gorillas. UPS employs and houses them in a room. All packages shipped by UPS go through this Package Gorilla room. They have broomsticks, knives, and other impliments of destruction specifically for the purpose of mangling UPS packages, simply out of spite to willing customers.

I don't know why it took me so long, but I finally decided that I will not order from companies that ship only by UPS anymore. If they offer no other shipping options, they don't get my business.

 

[buy guns]

what about airborne express or some smaller company?

 

[BowStreetRunner]

there is some new company out there now too
their commercials say they are the new choice between the fed ups
BSR

 

[jfh]

OTOH, I have used UPS as my shipper

for over five years now, and had a total of three damaged contents during this time--all of these were in 1999/2000, BTW.

I ship about five hundred computer cases a year, in their original / factory cartons. These cartons are new/unused at the time of their original shipment--i.e., they arrived here in palletloads by truck freight.

I have recently received FedEx shipments terribly beat up. My current UPS driver is a ding-a-ling, and I find little good to say about her service.

But the company itself I don't generally complain about.

 

[F4GIB]

Today's Wall Street Journal says that DHL is going to challenge UPS and FedEx with 7 new hubs, etc. Maybe THEY want our business?

 

[Gunsnrovers]

Sounds odd. Sent out two pistols last week for work. Both to FFL's via UPS. No issues. No comments from the clerks and this is here in West Los Angeles.

I use Supersaver overnight which is their "cheapest" overnight.

Tell the clerks it's a firearm and they lock it up until it's ready to ship.

With their new automated system, I even get emails the next day showing delivery and "signed for by".

While I think it sucks the carriers are forcing us to use expedited freight, UPS hasn't been any harder to deal with then FedEx or DHL in my experience.

 

[kbsrn]

They aren't anti-2nd ad

What they are is incapaible of keeping their employees from stealing the firearms. That is why they are making it harder and more expensive to send them.

 

[clarkg1124]

You'll get no joy from DHL.They will not ship firearms,firearm parts,ammunition,or anything else they deem"inappropriate".
Clark

 

[Zach S]

While I though the gorilla bit was funny, I also thought it was odd...

I've had numerous UPS shipments come my way, either gun parts or car parts, and havent experianced anything like what was mentioned. The boxed might have caved corners or something else minor, but nothing worse than any other method I've used, unless I deliver/pick up [whatever] myself amd take shipping out of the equation.

 

[outdoorman63]

ups shipping

i have many problems shipping with ups a firearm...the local hub has a policy that the long gun must be completely disassembled and shipped in a hard case inside a box...and the package cannot be sealed because they have to inspect it....that has been that way for over a year here...and they had told me company policy was going to change to make it harder to ship firearms.....i use only usps to ship long guns...as for other items i generally have no problem..

 

[thatguy]

The past problem with UPS was that each l;ocation and each employee had different rules or ideas of what the policy was. If they now require FFL from sender I don't understand why. I guess from now on you always say it is being sent for repairs? Lying to UPS is not a crime.

 

[mec]

Thelocal FedEX will ship a gun to anybody with an FFL based on the sender affirming that the business has the license. No sound and fury. No cringing or weedling. Their policies are close to the legal requirements. I notice that Smith and Wesson uses Fed Ex exclusively.

UPS, on the other hand, has prohibitive restrictions and lets the local managers add more. I know a guy who ships clocks all over the world and he says that UPS really doesn't want walk-in business. They are out for big contracts and no accountability. They make his shipments as inconvenient as possible.

Our local UPS dude in waco texas is a "gun owner" but is an extremely timid and fearful individual who will accept only ffl to ffl shipments.This is the outfit that turned David Koresh because a dummy grenade fell out of one of his packages.

 

[GLOCKT]

Overnight Policy

Both UPS and FedEx use the overnight policy,because both lack the facilities to store your pistol or rifle for 2-3 days.
The longer it stays in their system,the more probable it can disappear.
Lost prevention is an issue with them as it is with any company doing buisness with the public.

 

[Cacique500]

You could always spend your $30 and get a C&R license...then you can whip out your 03 FFL (they'll never know the difference). I keep a copy of mine in my wallet for just such occasions.

 

[manwithoutahome]

I ship handguns through USPS with my FFL03. For some reason, the USPS office here approved my shipping of handguns (you have to fill out a form and then the post master general approves/disapproves your app and you have to give/send them with your app a signed copy of your FFL).

I don't trust ups and they are too expensive for shipping. If you don't have an FFL, you can ship long guns via USPS and if you have an 03 they may approve you sending via USPS, it's worth a try.

The only thing that USPS won't ship, even with an FFL is ammo. You're stuck with usp or fed ex on that one .

DHL must have changed their policy, they handled switchblades when I was buying them for my collection (legal to own here, illegal to carry).

Wayne

 

[Devonai]

I've used UPS out of Manchester four times to ship firearms. The clerk only asked to see the recipient's FFL, and I was good to go. So far so good on the deliveries, too.

 

[yorick]

Don't ask - Don't tell -

I ship them UPS or USPS whichever is conveinent for me as 'machine parts' insured for whatever value.


thinking citizens have an obligation to ignore stupid laws

 

[71Commander]

Quote>Don't ask - Don't tell -

I ship them UPS or USPS whichever is conveinent for me as 'machine parts' insured for whatever value.


thinking citizens have an obligation to ignore stupid laws<quote

Is that legal though?

 

[UberPhLuBB]

If there were a law that said it was illegal to ship firearms, USPS wouldn't do it. I don't see what business of UPS or FedEx it is what the contents of a package are, beyond something dangerous to it's employees like an aerosol can or some explosives. An inert firearm is just a chunk of machined metal.

It's probably SAFER to ship it regular freight and not declair it, so courier employees don't know it's a valuable gun. A company's rules are not law, they're just one company's rules. So I don't see how it would be illegal to ship without declairing a firearm. It's not an airline where people can easily get to the gun and hijack the plane. It's point to point transfer, and only the sender and reciever may see what is inside the package.

Now, if UPS or FedEx X-ray packages (which technically is an invasion of privacy, whether it's for their safety or not), the worst they could do is return the package to the sender. Keeping it because you didn't ship it how they want you to (for their profit), would be thievery.

 

[Cool Hand Luke 22:36]

UberPhLuBB

Great picture. It looks exactly like how I remember my college days loading trucks at night for UPS at the Burtonsville, Md hub. Nobody treats workers worse than the Teamsters IMO.

If it's any consolation, it's usually not the drivers or loaders who mess up the packages, most of the time it's from a heavy package sliding down a chute onto a smaller one.

 

[ysr_racer]

whichever is conveinent for me as 'machine parts'

Try collecting on "machine parts" when they lose your package.

 

[GLOCKT]

The aircargo industry is regulated by the federal government.
They xray pkgs on a random search,they dont have time to xray them all.
To not declare what the contents are of a certain pkg is a chance you take.
When that $500 piece of "Machined Metal" comes up missing is a concern of yours and the Federal Governments.To not declare it releases UPS and FedEx of any liabilities that $500 piece of "Machined Metal" might occur.
Roughly 80% of UPS freight is delievered not signed for,so they have the right to leave that Machined Metal at their discretion.Now if the reciepient claims non-delivery and the rifle or pistol falls into the wrong hands the burden of proof falls on the shipper what the contents were.FedEx recieves signatures for roughly 80% of its delieveries.
Much like dangerous goods as explosives.These are documented and loaded on the last freight container of the airplane.In flight if the contents of dangerous goods were to become inflamed the pilot can access this last container and try to extinguish any fire on board.When fires occur mid-air its a no win situation for the company and whoever that DC-10 or Airbus falls upon.
Now You may not like the guidelines you have to observe but I hate driving the speed limit!
Being a 20 year courier I really dont care what's in the package.It's not worth loosing a 40k a year job,and I believe any courier in here feels the same way.We know by where they are going to what they are your not fooling us.When gun collectors recieve weekly shippments and gun smiths and manufactures get dels also,we know what it is.Your not fooling us.
Ship as you wish, when the dog bites back it could seriously hurt you.

 

[DMK]

Quote>Don't ask - Don't tell -

I ship them UPS or USPS whichever is conveinent for me as 'machine parts' insured for whatever value.


thinking citizens have an obligation to ignore stupid laws<quote

Is that legal though?

You know what, I have to seriously wonder about this. Technically, federal law requires that the shipper notify the carrier if the package contains a firearm. However, federal law also requires that neither you nor the shipper identify the package as containing a firearm in any way (I assume to prevent theft). So, whether or not you notified the counterperson (or whether or not you did notify them , but they did not hear or understand you), is basically your word vs. the counter person's. So how enforceable is that?

Having a type 03FFL, I trade a lot. I've legally shipped a lot of firearms interstate, both pistols and long guns. I have never seen them enter anything about package contents into a computer. To adhere to federal law, carrier regulations, common sense, and the desire not to get my firearms stolen, I do not note the contents in any paperwork either. I always verbally notify the carrier's representative that the package contains a firearm when handing the package over to the carrier. Most times they are very busy and hardly seem to notice although they are used to me by now(strangely, it's always packages containing ammo, not firearms that they give me trouble with). I doubt very much that they could honestly testify in court that I did or did not notify them on a given package.