What's the problem with MIM parts?

[gdesloge]

"I do not have the ability to de-MIM a S&W lockwork."

Of course you do.

All it requires is money.

The only entity "cheapening" your experience is you.

You don't approve of S&W's marketing choices, but you have a way around that.

gd

 

[oldfool]

straight shooters drink straight bourbon, G
(we leave the Uncle Jack sour mash for them Colt guys)

 

[Guillermo]

well OldFool...you know a lot about guns but bourbon...


in order to be called bourbon it has to be made from at least 50% sour mash corn. Your Maker's Mark is sour mash.

And while I would suggest you can get a lot better bourbon for what you are spending...don't be filling any of that waterford BEFORE you shoot them there classic Smiths


(BTW...Jack sucks. It is like a high dollar Hi-Point)

 

[oldfool]

yep, it's all 'sour mash', but it's a lot like MIM, G
it's all 'steel' (well 50% minimum anyway), but what matters is how well it's done, donchaknow

the trick to getting a good edge on a forged steel blade is using stones properly
the trick to smoothing a good trigger is burnishing 'em the old fashioned way, thousands of rounds sent downrange

(but neither the crystal nor the whiskey ever comes out of the wood cabinets until the guns and ammo are locked away in the STEEL cabinets)

 

[918v]

Of course you do.

I guess I should be grateful that S&W is still doing me a favor by producing a revolver. I think I'll write them a Thank You letter just before ordering a CNC mill and a heat treating furnace.

 

[Guillermo]

locked away in the STEEL cabinets

not MIM cabinets?

 

[H. Faversham]

Quote
THR > Tools and Technologies > Handguns: Revolvers > S & W and MIM Parts
DMiculek
December 18, 2005, 01:38 PM
Smith & Wesson seems to have the MIM process down pat.
I recently had Jerry Miculek do an action job on a Smith 610, my first handgun with MIM parts. Of course I asked his opinion on the MIM, he stated he preferred them to the older forged parts as they (mim) were held to tighter tolerances and required less work to achieve a nice action job on.
He went on to state that in several hundreds of thousands of rounds he never had a mim part fail. End quote

But it sure is fun debating folks who hate MIM/S&W when they use made up "facts", call us trolls, and believe Taurus, which also uses MIM parts, is better than S&W.

BTW, Guillermo, what the heck would a Texan (and I've been one over 12 years) know about sour mash? Stick to S&W and 100% Agave.

 

[Guillermo]

what the heck would a Texan (and I've been one over 12 years) know about sour mash

many, many years in the wine and spirit business.

Stick to old S&W and 100% Agave

fixed it for ya!

 

[918v]

He went on to state that in several hundreds of thousands of rounds he never had a mim part fail.

But it sure is fun debating folks who hate MIM/S&W when they use made up "facts", call us trolls, and believe Taurus, which also uses MIM parts, is better than S&W.

Please show one example of a made up fact, other than JM's claim he hasn't broken any MIM components.

 

[oldfool]

"many, many years in the wine and spirit business."

aha...that explains it !
friendly PM sent..
Texans might not know bourbon, but they sure know revolvers.. I used to be one myself.. (a Texan, that is)

 

[Magnumite]

One part shown failed. Hmmmm....that means none are good?

 

[Guillermo]

I used to be one myself.. (a Texan, that is)

I thought you might have been a revolver. You know enough about em'.

required less work to achieve a nice action job on.

this is incongruent with the specifications that he required for the JM625

I find this difficult to believe

 

[Old Fuff]

I do not have the ability to de-MIM a S&W lockwork. All I can do is buy older used S&Ws.

Well if you want to go to the trouble, you can replace the following:

1. The trigger, including the internal parts.

2. The cylinder stop

3. The rebound slide & spring.

4. In theory, (I haven't tried it) the hammer - if the internal lock is either removed or the lug ground off. You do have to include the internal parts, and the nose on the firing pin would have to be ground or filed off. On a K and J frame you could use a hammer intended to go into a rimfire model where the firing pin is frame-mounted.

I don't recommend doing all of this because of the cost, and there are other features then the lockwork between older vs. newer revolvers that are in contention.

So a partial conversion may be improbable, but it's not impossible - and the services of a competent 'smith may be required.

I wonder how MIM responds to welding.

Don't even think about it....!!

 

[918v]

One part shown failed. Hmmmm....that means none are good?

as good.

Try finding a standard hammer block that broke.

 

[918v]

Don't even think about it....!!

Why? Does MIM explode or something?

 

[Old Fuff]

Why? Does MIM explode or something?

No, but you may have trouble getting the weld to stick, and the material around it may crumble or crack. Remember what you have is metal particles that are fused, but not melted together.

In the context you had in mind (exchanging MIM/ S&W lockwork for older parts) what do you need to weld?

 

[918v]

Older hammers won't fit MIM guns. The nose is too tall. But I could weld one up and modify it to fit. Hmmmm.

 

[Old Fuff]

I think it may be more of a case of cutting down, rather then building up... but in any case there wouldn't be any problem welding bar-stock parts.

If you are going to go in this direction look into getting a hammer made for one of the .22 rimfire models that had the firing pin in the frame.

 

[Armed012002]

Hypothetically, suppose I have access to a vertical machining center.

Does anyone think there's a market for milled barstock hammers, triggers, and lockwork for Smith & Wesson revolvers?

I don't know of anyone that makes parts besides S&W.

 

[Prosser]

You would do us all a great favor, because then S&@ would run you out of business, either selling forged parts for near free, or, offering them as a warranty option. I don't know how Philanthropic you are, but it would be a great service to the gun industry.

 

[918v]

I'd pay it. Consider people are paying that much for 1911 drop-in kits.

 

[H. Faversham]

Preview
Per 918v: "Please show one example of a made up fact..."

Here are eight:

MIM parts do NOT polish well.
S&W does not trust MIM parts for hard use.
Second guessing the decisions at Smith & Wesson is impossible. They are simply an embarrassment.
Forged hammers are more durable than MIM hammers
There is plenty of evidence of [MIM parts being "so bad']
Taurus is better than S&W
MIM S&W revolvers are not better
Jerry Miculek's claim he hasn't broken any MIM components is not true

So, 918v, are you now going to say you're sorry?

Time for a Bailey's Irish Cream and a cup of decaf.

 

[918v]

Sorry.

But forged hammers are more durable than MIM hammers and I did provide evidence of MIM being bad.

 

[gdesloge]

Well, it must be awful to both love S&W and to hate them.

Terrible inner conflict. Cognitive dissonance and all that.

I hope that you seek help for your condition.

Maybe some time at the range?

We're all behind you.

Happy Independence Day!

gd

 

[Guillermo]

Well, it must be awful to both love S&W and to hate them.

Terrible inner conflict.

Not for me...I used to love S&W...now I loath them.

It is kind of like many marriages.

I am just glad I didn't have to buy S&W a house.