Whats your idea of the perfect trail gun?
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Quoheleth
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Skeeter Skelton
Skeeter's comments regarding a kit or trail gun is that it should be light enough that it can ride in one pocket (or a holster) all day long and the owner hardly realize it is there, offset by a handful of rounds in the opposite pocket. It is primarily carried without any intent of shooting something, but mostly is carried for personal protection or survival.
To that end, I would argue that the .41s or .45s are a bit big. The SP101 should be just fine. The 3" barrel might be a better handling gun than the shorter tube, but you already have the 2.5" barrel. If you can shoot it well, I would suggest you wouldn't be underpowered with 5 in the chambers plus a 10 or so in the pocket.
I'm not trying to flame anyone who suggested the larger calibers or guns. They are all fine and have a place in the war bag. When I think of a kit gun or a trail gun is something light and easy. Depending on where you are in MO, you might run into coons or cougars. You need to base your decision on what you might encounter. Personally, based on what I saw when I deer hunted in SE MO, I would feel comfortable with the SP101 in my pocket. Where I grew up in Central Texas, I would go with a small .22; that new Taurus .410-shooting revolver would be nice for snakes, but a bit bulky for Skelton's definition, I believe. Here in SE Texas, I would probably go with a small .357 revolver, and depending on the particular piece of land, either load it with medium-warm hollowpoints or even the shot cartridges for cottonmouths or other creepy-crawleys.
If you are actively hunting, then the situation changes. GP141 or 161 would be a good choice, then.
My .02 worth...
Quoheleth
Skeeter's comments regarding a kit or trail gun is that it should be light enough that it can ride in one pocket (or a holster) all day long and the owner hardly realize it is there, offset by a handful of rounds in the opposite pocket. It is primarily carried without any intent of shooting something, but mostly is carried for personal protection or survival.
To that end, I would argue that the .41s or .45s are a bit big. The SP101 should be just fine. The 3" barrel might be a better handling gun than the shorter tube, but you already have the 2.5" barrel. If you can shoot it well, I would suggest you wouldn't be underpowered with 5 in the chambers plus a 10 or so in the pocket.
I'm not trying to flame anyone who suggested the larger calibers or guns. They are all fine and have a place in the war bag. When I think of a kit gun or a trail gun is something light and easy. Depending on where you are in MO, you might run into coons or cougars. You need to base your decision on what you might encounter. Personally, based on what I saw when I deer hunted in SE MO, I would feel comfortable with the SP101 in my pocket. Where I grew up in Central Texas, I would go with a small .22; that new Taurus .410-shooting revolver would be nice for snakes, but a bit bulky for Skelton's definition, I believe. Here in SE Texas, I would probably go with a small .357 revolver, and depending on the particular piece of land, either load it with medium-warm hollowpoints or even the shot cartridges for cottonmouths or other creepy-crawleys.
If you are actively hunting, then the situation changes. GP141 or 161 would be a good choice, then.
My .02 worth...
Quoheleth
hkenvy91
Member
heres mine
3inch 629
3inch 629
chief
Member
S&W introduced the M60 in a 5" barrel with adj. sights in .357 magnum, either that or the 3" adj sight .357 magnum version would be a good choice. For years my strolling in the woods gun was a 3" M36.
wcwhitey
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Quoheleth, I agree with the size issue, but I doubt Skeeter was ever armed with less than K frame in the woods. If I recall his favorite guns were .44 Special Colts and .44 Mag Ruger Blackhawks for being out in the woods. I think he had a Walther PP for concealment but I doubt it made its way to the trail. Part of the problem for trail carry now is that most people want to appear unarmed. Time was when most men would wear an old western rig even if it only carried a Ruger Single Six and 25 rounds of LR. A good holster and belt make all the difference. All things considered, a .38 would probably do it but I would opt for at least a good .357 in whatever configuration that you enjoy shooting. If you can carry more, better yet, but at least a .357. Bill
Quoheleth
Member
Skeeter: citation
You're right - Skeeter favored the larger .357s, .41s, .44s (Specials and Magnums), and .45s, but there were times when he went the opposite direction.
Here was my source, as found in Hoglegs, Hipshots & Jalepenos, p. 68 "What's a Trail Gun"
>>Let's concern ourselves with yet another time polished, nebulous term, "trail gun." ...It is a handgun that you carry when you venture afield without the specific purpose of shooting anything.
My idea of a trail gun is a handgun that with 50 rounds of ammunition will make a package small and light enough that you are unaware of its presence until you need it. It adds prectically nothing to the contents of backpack or saddlebags of horsemen or cyclist. Worn in a neat holster on the trousers belt, it lies flat and doesn't sag your pants. It also looks at home in a fishing box.
Being small and feathery, my trail gun is of necessity chambered for a small-caliber cartridge. For the purposes outlined, I suggest the .22 Long Rifle, .22 Magnum, .32 S&W Long, .32-20, or .38 SPecial [emphasis mine]. >>>
He then goes on to extol the virtues of the .22 LR as a trial gun for the next 2+ pages. FYI: this was written in 1977 - granted 20 years ago - but the .357s were quite popular by then. While he also wrote about how much he loved his .357s, when speaking of a trail gun, he wrote about guns that were much smaller and less powerful.
Likewise, in the same book, in the article "Belly Guns" (p. 158), he writes,
>>>I've never gone on a fishing expedition without a handgun, and it has usually been a .38 Special snubnose or a small .22...>>> A few paragraphs later, he tells about hunting arrowheads in the desert southwest, and packing snake protection. >>>My anthropological excursions are now helped by a snubby belly gun, toted either in a coat or pants pocket, with a bit of extra ammo balancing the pocket on the opposing side.
The two-inch SPecial is an excellent short-range snake killer, expecially when loaded with full or semi-wadcutter bullets. Almost as good is a small autmomatic or sixgun loaded with .22LR hollowpoint ammo.
I'm not trying to start an argument; only citing my source. The point is that one man's "trail gun" may be over powered or underpowered for someone else. Where Skeeter lived, a .22 was great for popping rattlers (personally, if I were in that snake-rich of countryside, that Taurus "Judge" would be much highter on my TBA list). If, however, I lived in Alaska, Ruger's ALASKAN would be right on my hip as my "trail gun."
FWIW,
Quoheleth
You're right - Skeeter favored the larger .357s, .41s, .44s (Specials and Magnums), and .45s, but there were times when he went the opposite direction.
Here was my source, as found in Hoglegs, Hipshots & Jalepenos, p. 68 "What's a Trail Gun"
>>Let's concern ourselves with yet another time polished, nebulous term, "trail gun." ...It is a handgun that you carry when you venture afield without the specific purpose of shooting anything.
My idea of a trail gun is a handgun that with 50 rounds of ammunition will make a package small and light enough that you are unaware of its presence until you need it. It adds prectically nothing to the contents of backpack or saddlebags of horsemen or cyclist. Worn in a neat holster on the trousers belt, it lies flat and doesn't sag your pants. It also looks at home in a fishing box.
Being small and feathery, my trail gun is of necessity chambered for a small-caliber cartridge. For the purposes outlined, I suggest the .22 Long Rifle, .22 Magnum, .32 S&W Long, .32-20, or .38 SPecial [emphasis mine]. >>>
He then goes on to extol the virtues of the .22 LR as a trial gun for the next 2+ pages. FYI: this was written in 1977 - granted 20 years ago - but the .357s were quite popular by then. While he also wrote about how much he loved his .357s, when speaking of a trail gun, he wrote about guns that were much smaller and less powerful.
Likewise, in the same book, in the article "Belly Guns" (p. 158), he writes,
>>>I've never gone on a fishing expedition without a handgun, and it has usually been a .38 Special snubnose or a small .22...>>> A few paragraphs later, he tells about hunting arrowheads in the desert southwest, and packing snake protection. >>>My anthropological excursions are now helped by a snubby belly gun, toted either in a coat or pants pocket, with a bit of extra ammo balancing the pocket on the opposing side.
The two-inch SPecial is an excellent short-range snake killer, expecially when loaded with full or semi-wadcutter bullets. Almost as good is a small autmomatic or sixgun loaded with .22LR hollowpoint ammo.
I'm not trying to start an argument; only citing my source. The point is that one man's "trail gun" may be over powered or underpowered for someone else. Where Skeeter lived, a .22 was great for popping rattlers (personally, if I were in that snake-rich of countryside, that Taurus "Judge" would be much highter on my TBA list). If, however, I lived in Alaska, Ruger's ALASKAN would be right on my hip as my "trail gun."
FWIW,
Quoheleth
wcwhitey
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No argument, I agree with both you and Skeeter's opinions. A 2" Snubby has been my choice on many a hunting trip, fishing trip, etc. It is about perfect for snakes and wounded deer. A good .22 is a great gun for many purposes. I took the post as the "best all around trail gun". IMHO that says .357. My personal preference is the Ruger Blackhawk 4 5/8" as I posted originally. If I came off as argumentative that was not my intention, I also enjoy Skeeter's way of looking at things. The biggest kick I get when I read the old articles is that men just do not speak like that anymore. Bill
MN
Here in southern Minnesota, bear and large predators other than humans are rare - mostly coyote, occasionally a roaming wolf (who, based on my rare contact with them down here, are: a. beautiful creatures b. vanish at high speed from humans).
For shorter, daily hikes, I carry a Glock 17 with rail mounted laser/light (M6).
Deeper in the woods, I prefer a bit more punch, and go with a S&W 686 2 1/2", with a couple of speedloaders inc. one with heavy BB.
When I go up to northern MN, I take my 6" S&W 629 - at least one speedloader with 300g hard-cast loads that will probably go right through a black bear and knock down the moose behind him.
I use the 6" since that is what I have had for many years - not optimum for a "kit" gun but its what I have and I like it.
Here in southern Minnesota, bear and large predators other than humans are rare - mostly coyote, occasionally a roaming wolf (who, based on my rare contact with them down here, are: a. beautiful creatures b. vanish at high speed from humans).
For shorter, daily hikes, I carry a Glock 17 with rail mounted laser/light (M6).
Deeper in the woods, I prefer a bit more punch, and go with a S&W 686 2 1/2", with a couple of speedloaders inc. one with heavy BB.
When I go up to northern MN, I take my 6" S&W 629 - at least one speedloader with 300g hard-cast loads that will probably go right through a black bear and knock down the moose behind him.
I use the 6" since that is what I have had for many years - not optimum for a "kit" gun but its what I have and I like it.Redneck with a 40
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My Taurus Tracker 357 4" loaded with my handloads.....158 grain Remington JSP's on top of 16.6 grains of 296, its a big boomer, packs a wallop. My 357 is not overly heavy or bulky, I can hike with it on my hip all day long, no big deal. My 357 will handle anything I'm likely to encounter out here in Colorado, bears included. Its an extremely versatile cartridge that can do alot.
If I'm certain I'm not going into bear country, then I believe a 22 magnum revolver would be an excellent choice. Its got quite a bit more power than 22LR, its 500 fps faster out of a 4 inch barrel and you can carry a lot of ammo and it won't weigh much. Plus the 22 mag uses real jacketed bullets, a big + in my book.
My 357 is not overly heavy or bulky, I can hike with it on my hip all day long, no big deal. My 357 will handle anything I'm likely to encounter out here in Colorado, bears included. Its an extremely versatile cartridge that can do alot.If I'm certain I'm not going into bear country, then I believe a 22 magnum revolver would be an excellent choice. Its got quite a bit more power than 22LR, its 500 fps faster out of a 4 inch barrel and you can carry a lot of ammo and it won't weigh much. Plus the 22 mag uses real jacketed bullets, a big + in my book.
niner4tango
Member
S&W 629 MG is the ultimate for me.
If you don't like .44mag, the S&W 686 4 inch
Equally important is the holster. A good belt holster with retention strap like a Galco Fletch. Or (I prefer) a shoulder holster like the Bianchi X15, cause my pants don't fall down..
I guess that's another thread, though...
If you don't like .44mag, the S&W 686 4 inch
Equally important is the holster. A good belt holster with retention strap like a Galco Fletch. Or (I prefer) a shoulder holster like the Bianchi X15, cause my pants don't fall down.
. I guess that's another thread, though...
Quoheleth
Member
Enjoyed the conversation, wcwhitey, and I certainly didn't feel either you or I were argumentative. My ripost was only to show my source - I wasn't just making it up. Preachers are accused of doing that on occassion, you know . I never lie...but I have been known to stretch the truth on occassion ;-)
Q
. I never lie...but I have been known to stretch the truth on occassion ;-)Q
22LongRifle
Member
A RUGER Blawkhawk with a 4"ish barrel in your caliber choice. I would like it in 44mag, just because its lighter than the 357mag.
Now, if we lived in a perfect world, than I would order me a SP101 with 4" barrel and a great set of sights. My buddies 32H&R mag is the stuff!
Jerry
Now, if we lived in a perfect world, than I would order me a SP101 with 4" barrel and a great set of sights. My buddies 32H&R mag is the stuff!
Jerry
Uberti Cattleman "Millenium" matte finish SAA replica in .357
Cheap, simple, durable, and with a set of Wolff springs, a real slick shooter, all for under $300 new, including the springs. Points like a SAA.
Holsters readily available, SAA design leaves a lot of extra steel around the cartridges, so no worry about heavy loads.
Cheap, simple, durable, and with a set of Wolff springs, a real slick shooter, all for under $300 new, including the springs. Points like a SAA.
Holsters readily available, SAA design leaves a lot of extra steel around the cartridges, so no worry about heavy loads.
jonsidneyb
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The ideal trail gun for me does not exist. A 4 inch J-frame .357 with adjustable sights.
As is always the case each of us travel different trails in different locations.
That will make a siginificant difference in our choices sometimes. As much as I want to say a good .22 RF revolver , I guess for a sorta overall thing I would end up with a 3 inch S&W 66 as a top choice.
Since these are not all that easy to find (my brother has one that I have made him will to me, so I hope I don't get that one), it seems the Ruger SP101 in 3 inch would be a good choice, and since you already have the 2&1/2" I think you are set up pretty good already.
That will make a siginificant difference in our choices sometimes. As much as I want to say a good .22 RF revolver , I guess for a sorta overall thing I would end up with a 3 inch S&W 66 as a top choice.
Since these are not all that easy to find (my brother has one that I have made him will to me, so I hope I don't get that one), it seems the Ruger SP101 in 3 inch would be a good choice, and since you already have the 2&1/2" I think you are set up pretty good already.
koja48
member
One of these -- Model 57 or Python
backed by on of the 1911s
Mom always told me to make sure I have clean shorts on in case I get hurt. Dad always said to carry a 1911 in case someone wants to cause that hurt. Sound advice from both.
backed by on of the 1911s
Mom always told me to make sure I have clean shorts on in case I get hurt. Dad always said to carry a 1911 in case someone wants to cause that hurt. Sound advice from both.
22-rimfire
Member
I have enjoyed this thread. Those that frequent the outdoors do in fact have to choose a trail or woods gun if you want to carry a handgun. I really like 22's for woods use as I usually end up doing some plinking. It just adds to the overall enjoyment of the day. My 357 and 41 mag suggestions are based on what I own, not what I hope to own or think is perfect. It is hard to go wrong with a 357 mag revolver in the woods of whatever barrel length you fancy.
I do notice an N-frame Smith in a holster on my belt relative to the Skeeter Skelton definition. I still like them, but I doubt I carry one on the Appalachian Trail (if legal) for any distance unless I was really concerned about my protection to justify the weight of the firearm.
Funny comment at the end above. ..... yep, holly worn out underware and holes in your socks.... don't get caught with either.
I do notice an N-frame Smith in a holster on my belt relative to the Skeeter Skelton definition. I still like them, but I doubt I carry one on the Appalachian Trail (if legal) for any distance unless I was really concerned about my protection to justify the weight of the firearm.
Funny comment at the end above. ..... yep, holly worn out underware and holes in your socks.... don't get caught with either.
Matt Almeda
Member
Perfect Trail Gun
My perfect trail gun is my 3" S&W Model 629.
Quad Ported with a bobed hammer. I carry it in a Bianchi Black Widow holster.
I have it with me whenever I go up to our hunting property.
I usually have to run off poachers every year during deer season so it's very comforting having a large gun on the hip. Thankfully the poachers usually either play stupid or hop in their trucks and drive off quickly.
Have a great day!
My perfect trail gun is my 3" S&W Model 629.
Quad Ported with a bobed hammer. I carry it in a Bianchi Black Widow holster.
I have it with me whenever I go up to our hunting property.
I usually have to run off poachers every year during deer season so it's very comforting having a large gun on the hip. Thankfully the poachers usually either play stupid or hop in their trucks and drive off quickly.
Have a great day!
ArchAngelCD
Member.
jonsidneyb,
Do you really think that is the ideal revolver for the woods? A 4" J frame would be only a few ounces lighter than a 4" K frame, and a K frame will give you 1 more round. I don't know exactly what a 4" K frame Magnum weighs but a current 4" Model 10/64/67 weighs 36 oz. and the 5" Model 60 is 30.5 oz. I'm sure a 4" K frame would be to your liking. (but I've been known to be wrong!! LOL)
bears? what bears?
Just when you think there are no bears out there. . . .
Wildlife officials: Male bears sighted in local areas are looking for love
From my local paper
I live in Wilson Twnshp, mentioned above - a mixed rural area outside of the small university town of Winona. I go out in the evening and smoke my evening cigar either on my patio or on a screen porch attached to the carriage house. The labs come out with me. Over the weekend, when I went out, the Labs went crazy, running around, clearly agitated. The bigger one was sniffing wildly around the deer feeder, bird feeder and patio garden, and they were both indicating something in the field/woods across the drive. I did not see anything and did not get the big spotlight out; I assumed it was coyotes in the field, as they are out there most nights. Now, I expect it was probably the mentioned bear, as all the areas mentioned are right around where I live.
Do I carry when I go out to smoke?
Do bears poop in the woods?
My usual carry, though, is my daily carry - one of my J frames with Corbon 110g. Maybe I need to carry more gun when I go out to smoke!
Although I am sure I could fend off a black bear with a J frame, 2 young male labradors and a Saint Luis Rey churchill.
What cigar for larger bears, though?
Just when you think there are no bears out there. . . .
Wildlife officials: Male bears sighted in local areas are looking for loveFrom my local paper
I live in Wilson Twnshp, mentioned above - a mixed rural area outside of the small university town of Winona. I go out in the evening and smoke my evening cigar either on my patio or on a screen porch attached to the carriage house. The labs come out with me. Over the weekend, when I went out, the Labs went crazy, running around, clearly agitated. The bigger one was sniffing wildly around the deer feeder, bird feeder and patio garden, and they were both indicating something in the field/woods across the drive. I did not see anything and did not get the big spotlight out; I assumed it was coyotes in the field, as they are out there most nights. Now, I expect it was probably the mentioned bear, as all the areas mentioned are right around where I live.
Do I carry when I go out to smoke?
Do bears poop in the woods?
My usual carry, though, is my daily carry - one of my J frames with Corbon 110g. Maybe I need to carry more gun when I go out to smoke!
Although I am sure I could fend off a black bear with a J frame, 2 young male labradors and a Saint Luis Rey churchill.
What cigar for larger bears, though?
JMusic
member
retrieverman
Member
For summer time ATVing and basically all outdoor activities, I prefer my S&W 650 22 magnum. It's a J frame with a 3" barrel and is light and accurate.
Shawn Michael
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Backpaking Gun.....
Well, I have what I think to be the best trail guns at any price. For the 90% of the time it is the s&w TRR8 which is my bedside gun as well. Very very light (which makes a huge difference if you really hike) The weight can be "adjusted" by adding or subtracting the steel rails. 5 inch barrel, long enough, but not too long for the job. 8 shots of hardcast 357 mag with an extra moon clip. Lots of firepower in a very light pistol that is very controllable and I can shoot well.
10% if in large bear country, 6.5 inch s&w .500 compensated hunter. I have an aimpoint mounted on it and I can shoot it more accuratly than any other other pistol I have owned (I just have to zen out and forget about the recoil that is coming.) Heavy enough that I often opt for the 357 which makes a good argument for a light .44.....
If I could only have one, a 45LC/454 combo is hard to beat (ruger srh)...if you handload you can get those 45LC smoking
smith mountain guns in .44 are really great too.
Well, I have what I think to be the best trail guns at any price. For the 90% of the time it is the s&w TRR8 which is my bedside gun as well. Very very light (which makes a huge difference if you really hike) The weight can be "adjusted" by adding or subtracting the steel rails. 5 inch barrel, long enough, but not too long for the job. 8 shots of hardcast 357 mag with an extra moon clip. Lots of firepower in a very light pistol that is very controllable and I can shoot well.
10% if in large bear country, 6.5 inch s&w .500 compensated hunter. I have an aimpoint mounted on it and I can shoot it more accuratly than any other other pistol I have owned (I just have to zen out and forget about the recoil that is coming.) Heavy enough that I often opt for the 357 which makes a good argument for a light .44.....
If I could only have one, a 45LC/454 combo is hard to beat (ruger srh)...if you handload you can get those 45LC smoking
smith mountain guns in .44 are really great too.
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