Who Else Has Finally Figured Out That Sub-Compacts Are a CCW Handicap?

[chicharrones]

I came across a pretty good video recently on what to use when in bear country, you know, the bears that will actually eat you, and the boy did a pretty good job of showing what was reality (close to anyway), instead of what people "thought was reality.

He actually used a target rigged up to charge him and showed how different guns worked from the holster, or shoulder, depending on the guns. Turns out, reality really is a bitch!

Got a link to share?

 

[Alllen Bundy]

Sure do -- see #85 above.

I've got a Desantis Nemisis pocket holster. It protected the trigger and I was able to draw from it okay, and it was a huge improvement over no pocket holster. But my main issue with it is that it doesn't stop my pistol's handgrip from printing. I consider it a learning tool. I was able to determine that pocket carry would work for me, and then I found a better pocket holster made from horsehide. But I still had to modify that holster to work for me.

I'm now up to holster #6. I've had to modify 3 of the 6 holsters. Only 2 out of the 6 holsters work well for my carry methods.

It's never easy!

 

[toivo]

I've got a Desantis Nemisis pocket holster. It protected the trigger and I was able to draw from it okay, and it was a huge improvement over no pocket holster. But my main issue with it is that it doesn't stop my pistol's handgrip from printing.

The pistols I'm using are small enough that printing isn't really an issue -- maybe a little bit with the P238, but the Pico and P32 have little stubby grips that barely show. I can see it being an issue with a longer grip, though.

 

[GarnetandBlack]

I find that I shoot a micro close enough to as well as a compact or full size, that it makes sense to carry it most of the time because it is so easy to carry. That’s the Shield Plus with green dot. It’s just so easy to shoot fast and accurately even with large size hands, that it is the choice most of the time. Any smaller like my Kahr CM9 and it becomes a knife fight gun only. The Shield Plus, it’s a great combat weapon all around for me. I was thinking about the kid who made the 42 yard shot to end the mall shooting a few months ago, and that’s a shot I would have a decent chance of making with the Shield with optic. It’s that good. So, I’m quite the opposite from the OP since I found a micro I shoot well. There’s not enough of an advantage to a full size to pay the price every day.

 

[CNobbe]

Ballistics gel is expensive and shooting the tests was a PITA but at least I had real world performance testing out of my carry guns.

I worked in an E.R, Level 1 trauma center for long enough to know caliber/ballistics are pretty much irrelevant.

 

[trackskippy]

Got a link to share?

Here ya go.

 

[Capybara]

I've got a Desantis Nemisis pocket holster. It protected the trigger and I was able to draw from it okay, and it was a huge improvement over no pocket holster. But my main issue with it is that it doesn't stop my pistol's handgrip from printing. I consider it a learning tool. I was able to determine that pocket carry would work for me, and then I found a better pocket holster made from horsehide. But I still had to modify that holster to work for me.

I'm now up to holster #6. I've had to modify 3 of the 6 holsters. Only 2 out of the 6 holsters work well for my carry methods.

It's never easy!

The penalty for good concealed carry seems to be spending a lot of dough on multiple holsters and living with them for a period of time. I am on holsters number 10 and 11 in 8 years of carrying.

 

[Capybara]

I worked in an E.R, Level 1 trauma center for long enough to know caliber/ballistics are pretty much irrelevant.

As far as damaging the human body, agreed, any gunshot wound is serious business.

As far as quickly and efficiently stopping a threat, ballistics demonstrably make a huge difference in how quickly you can mitigate a threat
before it wounds or kills you. If they didn't, the military and LEOs would all be carrying .22 pistols, wouldn't they?

 

[trackskippy]

The penalty for good concealed carry seems to be spending a lot of dough on multiple holsters and living with them for a period of time. I am on holsters number 10 and 11 in 8 years of carrying.

Its a never ending thing. Better stuff seems to come along on a pretty regular basis, and it pays to try things out, even if they don't pan out. How else are you going to know?

Ive sold off a number of "hoster boxes" on eBay over the years as they accumulate. At least you can recover some of the money and put it towards something else.

eBay has also been a pretty good resource for buying things that look like they might be worth a try, and usually for less than new.

 

[trackskippy]

As far as damaging the human body, agreed, any gunshot wound is serious business.

As far as quickly and efficiently stopping a threat, ballistics demonstrably make a huge difference in how quickly you can mitigate a threat
before it wounds or kills you. If they didn't, the military and LEOs would all be carrying .22 pistols, wouldn't they?

Within reason should be applied here. But regardless, speed, accuracy, and volume of fire wins out over magic bullets, every time.

 

[Capybara]

Here ya go.

Very eye opening videos, thank you for sharing them. It appears that being able to apply multiple grouped hits with a smaller caliber
might be much better against a threat than one or two hits with a large caliber that has more recoil and is typically a bigger, heavier, clunkier
firearm.

You could also see that if that was a real bear, no matter what he shot it with, it still likely would have killed him in most cases unless
it just knocked him over and didn't have a chance to use it's claws and teeth before dying or losing consciousness. He almost always got his last shot off with the "bear"
when the "bear" appeared to be about five feet, less than one bear length from him.

A very creative way to test this.

 

[GarnetandBlack]

Here ya go.

Great test. A feel way more comfortable with a 10mm than a .44. The data says almost any caliber ends bear attacks, but a bunch of 10mm is a good recipe for getting them to head in a different direction.

 

[Charlie98]

Within reason should be applied here. But regardless, speed, accuracy, and volume of fire wins out over magic bullets, every time.

That's my general spin on it.

I think a lot of people overthink ballistics, when they should be out on the range practicing with their SD pistol.

 

[chicharrones]

Here ya go.

Thank you, @trackskippy . Good stuff there.

 

[Capybara]

That's my general spin on it.

I think a lot of people overthink ballistics, when they should be out on the range practicing with their SD pistol.

The experts all say shot placement is everything and you can't put shots where you want them unless you practice a lot.
I miss my old private range where I could do drills, draw from concealed, rapid fire, shoot while running, take cover and shoot, etc.

There is only one range near me where I could do most of those and it requires booking an entire range by yourself or with buddies at about $400 for 4 hours.

 

[Charlie98]

There is only one range near me where I could do most of those and it requires booking an entire range by yourself or with buddies at about $400 for 4 hours.

That's why I do most of my drills out in the NV desert...

 

[Capybara]

That's why I do most of my drills out in the NV desert...

California is so restricted and anti-2A that thousands of square miles of BLM desert within 1-2 hours of me is still 100% restricted against any kind of target shooting.
If I drive three hours, each way, out near Barstow on the way to Vegas but still in California, I can find some public shooting area, but six hours of driving to shoot a couple of hours just becomes not worth it.

I used to run a public range cleanup in a local National Forest area above Santa Barbara that had been open for almost 100 years. I organized a cleanup effort through Calguns and in three years, me and my crew removed 125 tons of
garbage, I had backhoes, sometimes upwards of 20-50 people, a local trash company would haul it all away to the dump as a public service. We removed cars, appliances, you name it, idiot people shot it and
left it in a pristine National Forest. We were being good citizens, keeping a public range clean.

Eventually a stupid kid broke the four rules and accidentally shot himself and died up there, that was all the excuse that the local anti-gun politicians needed to pressure the Forest Service
to shut the range down permanently. So that shooters paradise is now gone, after nearly a century.

 

[trackskippy]

You can still do a lot of it in dry fire too. Live rounds are important too, but not absolutely necessary for a lot of things. Working on drawing, your presentations, moving, etc, can all be done, and its all good muscle memory and toning too.

Still, theres no replacing live ammo for a lot of the shooting parts. Just is what it is.

 

[Capybara]

You can still do a lot of it in dry fire too. Live rounds are important too, but not absolutely necessary for a lot of things. Working on drawing, your presentations, moving, etc, can all be done, and its all good muscle memory and toning too.

Still, theres no replacing live ammo for a lot of the shooting parts. Just is what it is.

I've done regular old dryfire at home for quite a few years. I just bought a Strikeman dry fire system so I can at least drill at home and get one shot off and see where I actually hit a target but of course, it isn't really functional for doing follow up shots without changing your grip to recharge the pistol. Better than just pure dry fire although not by a lot. Best I can do now, along with range trips but they won't let us rapid fire or draw from concealed but at least it gets your sight picture, breathing, trigger control a workout. We do the best we can with what we have available.

 

[Charlie98]

I used to run a public range cleanup in a local National Forest area above Santa Barbara that had been open for almost 100 years. I organized a cleanup effort through Calguns and in three years, me and my crew removed 125 tons of
garbage, I had backhoes, sometimes upwards of 20-50 people, a local trash company would haul it all away to the dump as a public service. We removed cars, appliances, you name it, idiot people shot it and
left it in a pristine National Forest. We were being good citizens, keeping a public range clean.

When I was stationed at Fort Carson, in Colorado, there was an ad hoc shooting range up one of the mountain roads. In the 3 years I went there, it went from a nice, wooded spot, to a bomb crater... trees shot down, trash everywhere... it was a wreck, and... of course... the Forest Service had to shut it down.

The same is largely true of where I shoot in NV, near Laughlin. There is a nice, clear 100yd area designated as an open public shooting range... but it gets trashed on a regular basis. Someone brings out a Bobcat and trash truck now and then, to clean it up... but it's a disgrace that shooters... excuse me... idiots who shoot guns... destroy the place.

And... I feel sorry for you folks in CA. You're outnumbered...

 

[Alllen Bundy]

You could also see that if that was a real bear, no matter what he shot it with, it still likely would have killed him in most cases unless it just knocked him over and didn't have a chance to use it's claws and teeth before dying or losing consciousness. .

Bear spray appears to be more effective than most pistols. I remember reading one account where they found over 20 bullets that were stopped inside the bear's fat layer.

Just give the bear your pic-a-nic basket and back away!

 

[commygun]

I’m not so sure that smaller guns are necessarily harder to shoot than larger guns. At 7 yards I shoot my Beretta Nano as well as any of my larger guns. I think it’s more about triggers than grips. Though the Talon stick-on’s make a big difference with the micro-9s.

 

[Capybara]

I’m not so sure that smaller guns are necessarily harder to shoot than larger guns. At 7 yards I shoot my Beretta Nano as well as any of my larger guns. I think it’s more about triggers than grips. Though the Talon stick-on’s make a big difference with the micro-9s.

I do have a Talon Stick-on on my Shield 1.0 but compared to that, the new sandpaper-like grip texture on the Shield Plus is REALLY impressive. Feels like that gun sticks to my hand better than any other gun I have. The Ruger Max 9 has a little of that feel too but Smith nailed it on the new Shield Plus grip texture. Really sticks but doesn't tear up your hand either like so many stipple jobs on Glocks do.

 

[Capybara]

Bear spray appears to be more effective than most pistols. I remember reading one account where they found over 20 bullets that were stopped inside the bear's fat layer.

Just give the bear your pic-a-nic basket and back away!

The guy in the video I thought shot pretty well at the bear target considering how fast it was accelerating toward him. He was nailing it in the eye, face and head.

 

[Styx]

I don't find smaller guns harder to shoot just because they are smaller. Hand size, trigger, type of sights, ergos, and round choice makes much, much, much more of a defining factor. That is, it's all a personal matter rather than a black and white difference between shooting larger and smaller guns.

My hands are medium to small, so most fullsize guns don't fit my hands well. Fullsize and compact handgund are certainly harder for me to conceal.

I’m not so sure that smaller guns are necessarily harder to shoot than larger guns. At 7 yards I shoot my Beretta Nano as well as any of my larger guns. I think it’s more about triggers than grips. Though the Talon stick-on’s make a big difference with the micro-9s.

You're right. It all depends on the person's physical attributes and personal taste.