Why are so many domestic firearms HQ/plants located in anti-gun states?

[foghornl]

IF any companies WANT to move, come to Ohio. We have A LOT of very skilled machinists/machine operators.

Not to mention the "In Your Face" factor to some certain big-city mayors that are STILL fighting the Pre-emption clause in Ohio's CCW laws...

 

[Kynoch]

The East and Midwest were industrial BEFORE they were liberal. Opening a NEW plant there might not make sense, but keeping the old ones running DOES. Of course, if their labr force went liberal (not all labor unions or union people are, but some are) then moving might make sense (by 'make sense' I mean cost-effective). This explains, in part, why a car company might prefer to move out of Detroit and set up in Alabama or somewhere, yet S&W stays put... they own the plant where it already is, and as long as their employees are more proud of being 'S&W' than 'United Machinists #whatever' there is insufficient motivation for them to move. Even when Ruger moved most of its operation to AZ, I suspect it had more to do with needing to expand and the cost of real estate being lower in AZ than NH.

You're talking apples and oranges when you try to compare guns to vehicles. Guns are a very small-time business compared to vehicles. GM, Ford, and the rest have long had factories in much of the USA -- they are not simply located around Detroit/Dearborn, although that's where their HQ's and technical centers remain.

I don't really see how one could honestly be "conservative" while being a member of a bargaining unit -- even when membership is compulsory for the job. To claim to be conservative while raking in the benefits of union employment seems to be an example of utter hypocrisy.

 

[Kynoch]

The East and Midwest were industrial BEFORE they were liberal. Opening a NEW plant there might not make sense, but keeping the old ones running DOES. Of course, if their labr force went liberal (not all labor unions or union people are, but some are) then moving might make sense (by 'make sense' I mean cost-effective). This explains, in part, why a car company might prefer to move out of Detroit and set up in Alabama or somewhere, yet S&W stays put... they own the plant where it already is, and as long as their employees are more proud of being 'S&W' than 'United Machinists #whatever' there is insufficient motivation for them to move. Even when Ruger moved most of its operation to AZ, I suspect it had more to do with needing to expand and the cost of real estate being lower in AZ than NH.

If you think the average skilled tradesperson or non-skilled employee in the Northeast was a "conservative Republican" during the beginnings of Colt, Winchester, etc. you're wrong. Labor throughout almost all of the USA has always been a dominant part of the Democratic Party going back well over 100 years.

There are now UAW-represented auto plants in the South. Automakers aren't going South to get away from their unions. They are going South to get away from crippling Midwestern taxes and to find a more willing and skilled workforce.

 

[pat701]

They were there before the anti-gunners

 

[Kynoch]

They were there before the anti-gunners

Now THAT I certainly agree with!

Equating anti-gun to "liberal" is an example of abject stupidity.

 

[mg.mikael]

Les Bauer moved from Illinoise

It's Illinois not Illinoise.....remember google is your friend or at least take the time to open up a dictionary.

 

[David E]

Who the heck is "Les Bauer?"

 

[Scimmia]

Who the heck is "Les Bauer?"

He meant Les Baer. With all of the firearms manufacturers on the Illinois side of the Quad Cities area (Springfield, Armalite, Lewis Machine and Tool, and Rock River), Les Baer is the only one that's moved across the river. So far.

 

[David E]

He meant Les Baer.

I know.

I just think its funny!

 

[B!ngo]

I think that it's an interesting question. I wonder if someone has actually studied that?
Seems to me that large-scale firearms manufacturing occurs where there is a strong machining, manufacturing and metal-making work. The work does not require large-scale transportation in and out of the plants because the goods are not large or heavy, so they needn't be located on the coasts, though they are sometimes there as well.
Most of U.S. skilled manufacturing requires scale of the surroundings to support a trained workforce, a fabric of inter-related companies working together in a common ecosystem, and have evolved over a long period of time.
Those are the same places that are large metropolitan areas, that are older, fallen off of the R&D and manufacturing evolutionary curve, and have often found themselves as a center of high unemployment and high crime. With that as a backdrop, local and state legislatures focus on closing the barn door after the horse has long since left. Restriction on behavior such as gun control trying to deal with the crime and blight, instead of dealing with the root causes such as a shrinking tax base to support education, health care for the young and old, and job programs for the unemployed.
I'm no sociologist, but I drove by a Holiday Inn last week.
B

 

[Kynoch]

I think that it's an interesting question. I wonder if someone has actually studied that?
Seems to me that large-scale firearms manufacturing occurs where there is a strong machining, manufacturing and metal-making work. The work does not require large-scale transportation in and out of the plants because the goods are not large or heavy, so they needn't be located on the coasts, though they are sometimes there as well.
Most of U.S. skilled manufacturing requires scale of the surroundings to support a trained workforce, a fabric of inter-related companies working together in a common ecosystem, and have evolved over a long period of time.
Those are the same places that are large metropolitan areas, that are older, fallen off of the R&D and manufacturing evolutionary curve, and have often found themselves as a center of high unemployment and high crime. With that as a backdrop, local and state legislatures focus on closing the barn door after the horse has long since left. Restriction on behavior such as gun control trying to deal with the crime and blight, instead of dealing with the root causes such as a shrinking tax base to support education, health care for the young and old, and job programs for the unemployed.
I'm no sociologist, but I drove by a Holiday Inn last week.
B

It pretty much all began with the Springfield Armory. The SA began in 1777 and was just about the highest technology place in the country at the time. It was the Silicon Valley of its day. Colt, Winchester and others also located in the same general area I'm sure due to workers, expertise.

Even after WWII Bill Ruger chose to locate in the Connecticut Valley even though he was from Brooklyn, NY and had went to school in the south.

 

[Owen Sparks]

These states were not anti-gun when most of these manufacturers got started 100+ years ago.

 

[Pilot]

It's Illinois not Illinoise.....remember google is your friend or at least take the time to open up a dictionary.

Yeah? How's that working out for ya, however it is spelled?

 

[armarsh]

I have been closely involved with three companies that moved. In each case, these companies were not able to convince more than 10% of their employees to move. Those that did move accepted generous relocation packages.

I can attest to the quality of the employees that did not move. As a matter of fact, the only people that were going to relocate unquestionably were employees that you would not mind being rid of.

In short, if you want to relocate a company, expect it to be costly and create some negative consequences.

 

[jman74]

The Brady Campaign ranks CT as 5th strictest in the nation, after CA, NJ, MA, and NY. Hawaii, MD, RI, and IL round out the worst 9, per their criteria.

I wonder how they do their ranking. It's pretty easy to get a carry permit here. Some towns are harder than others, but even in those towns it's more of a waiting game. As long as you can pass the Federal background, your good to go. It's shall-issue here. You need to invest more time in a hunters safety course than you do in a class to get your pistol permit. We do have some weird laws that don't make sense. No select fire, but full-auto is just fine for the NFA crowd. And the definition of a handgun can make you shake your head.

 

[OldPilgrim]

Most of the anti gun states are liberal states who use up more tax dollars on giveaways to their 'constituents' than conservative states. They'll take any additional income from any source to buy their votes. They're the worst form of hypocrite.

 

[eye5600]

I wonder how they do their ranking. It's pretty easy to get a carry permit here. Some towns are harder than others, but even in those towns it's more of a waiting game. As long as you can pass the Federal background, your good to go. It's shall-issue here. You need to invest more time in a hunters safety course than you do in a class to get your pistol permit. We do have some weird laws that don't make sense. No select fire, but full-auto is just fine for the NFA crowd. And the definition of a handgun can make you shake your head.

The explanation is that the Brady rating system is a crock. CT gets a boost in their ratings from having a AWB even though that contributes zip to public safety.

AWB aside, CT is pretty realistic that about the fact that, if a guy has a gun, it's not really that important for public safety concerns what kind of gun he's got, so we don't have the approved weapons lists, etc, that are so bad in MA and CA. The biggest threat in CT is police chiefs being hired out of Massachusetts and bringing their notion of political entitlement with them.

 

[Kynoch]

My understanding is that in spite of the anti-gun ownership policies, even the liberal politicos sing a different tune when it comes to protecting their own manufacturing base. So as a well-known example, old Ted Kennedy fought long and hard to keep the M14 as the main US service rifle because it was being made in his turf. They've made the business environment friendly even while attacking individual ownership.

The M16 was chosen by Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara. A Democrat and close ally of the Kennedys. He later ordered the closing of the Springfield Armory as a cost cutting measure.

 

[icanthitabarn]

Quote

The Brady Campaign ranks CT as 5th strictest in the nation, after CA, NJ, MA, and NY. Hawaii, MD, RI, and IL round out the worst 9, per their criteria.

You are correct, but IMO, this stupido list may start out OK but those other states listed are much stricter than CT. Double stupido list

 

[Texan Scott]

As to the semantic debate over 'liberal' as opposed to anti-gun, I think most people here understood my meaning clearly... but if i've egregiously offended any 'pro-gun liberals', I'd feel bad about it ... unless they happen to be holding me up as an "example of abject stupidity", in which case i'll keep my apology and the rest of my comments to myself, to avoid being further drawn in.

 

[Elessar]

I'm not sure what a "pro gun liberal" is???? Too many games with the language I think. Makes about as much sense as a "small government liberal". The two things are opposed to each other.