Why hasn't there been any legislation to protect the so-called "Gunshow Loophole"?

[usmarine0352_2005]

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So it is our right to purchase firearms from private parties at gun shows and outside of gun shows without background checks. The anti's have a history of attacking this right and calling it "the Gun Show Loophole".




My question is why hasn't anyone made any laws protecting the right to buy guns through private party transasctions without background checks at gun shows our outside of them, similar to the "Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act".





You'd think it would be a good idea, no?

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[CoRoMo]

In my state, the "loophole" is closed in the sense that transactions at gunshows have to go through the NICS/4473 rigmarole. Thank you knee jerk reactions to Columbine.

But it would be great to undo that. Otherwise, I don't know what it would look like to 'protect' the legal act of a private transaction.

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

^ same here

 

[Zoogster]

Legislation protecting something which is already clearly legal would be merely a statement.
Any such legislation would just as easily be reversed by legislation that did the opposite and nationally ended private transactions.
So the legislation wouldn't grant any new freedoms, and wouldn't prevent future antis from prohibiting it either (only it being considered a Constitutional Right which private transactions have not been deemed would do that.)


Interestingly enough and demonstrating why the term is so poorly chosen:
Most sales at gun shows actually do go through a background check because the majority of regular sellers are FFLs and as a result of being an FFL must follow the same procedure at a gun show or at a store front.
The "gun show loophole" being ended effects gun shows less and the ability of neighbors, family, and friends more.

 

[CoRoMo]

...why hasn't anyone made any laws...

While I think the intention of this idea is in the right place, I don't even like it when our law makers decide to help us out; unless they are flat-out repealing something that was never any good to begin with. The legislative branch of our government(s) seem to be all thumbs when it comes to doing anything beneficial.

 

[wlewisiii]

Because if it were fixed the NRA couldn't use it as a scare tactic to rake in more money from their marks. So they tell the legislators they own to not let it be fixed.

 

[dogtown tom]

Sure they do

 

[medalguy]

And here I always thought the Second Amendment to the United States Constitution guaranteed our right to buy and sell firearms. Silly me.

 

[dogtown tom]

medalguy And here I always thought the Second Amendment to the United States Constitution guaranteed our right to buy and sell firearms. Silly me.

Nope.

And thats how Congress used the Commerce clause to restrict buying and selling.

 

[Millwright]

How do you "protect" something that doesn't exist ?

FFLs at gun shows have to perform the same "checks" as they would in their own shop !

"Private Sales" are just that - private - hence not subject to any government oversight ! I can sell you a car, a tank, or a gun. What you do with them is your business. Only if you want to license that car does the matter of "title" come into play. >MW

 

[Buck Kramer]

wlewisiii you got the first part right...

 

[orionengnr]

Because if it were fixed the NRA couldn't use it as a scare tactic to rake in more money from their marks. So they tell the legislators they own to not let it be fixed.

I do hope you wear that tinfoil hat under your touque. It would look silly outside.

 

[usmarine0352_2005]

.

Because if it were fixed the NRA couldn't use it as a scare tactic to rake in more money from their marks. So they tell the legislators they own to not let it be fixed. .

Someone may say that, but then there's this:



http://www.tennessean.com/article/2...-loophole-?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE

Ex-gun show operator trains sights on 'loophole'


11:59 AM, Dec. 5, 2011


But he said his buddies in the Tennessee Firearms Association are irritated by his one-man campaign to close the so-called “gun show loophole,” which he claims allows murderers and thieves to buy stolen guns..

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[steelerdude99]

>In my state, the "loophole" is closed in the sense that transactions
>at gunshows have to go through the NICS/4473 rigmarole. Thank you knee
>jerk reactions to Columbine.

>But it would be great to undo that. Otherwise, I don't know what it would
>look like to 'protect' the legal act of a private transaction.

CoRoMo,
Does that mean that all face to face sales are banned state-wide (i.e. Colorado) or just at gunshows? IF "just at gunshows"... what's stopping them from making the sale "elsewhere"?

chuck

 

[Neo-Luddite]

Making laws to further ennumerate, protect or otherwise cirsumscribe Our rights, however well intended, will utlimately produce in the mind of someone, some where, at the some time ----the wrong-headed idea that as something that was a right needed to be thusly protected they might be able to limit it in some way.

There never was a 'loophole' except as created in the minds of those who want to abridge the rights of their fellow citizens. As a few here have pointed out on this thread all you'd be doing is stating that 'citizens have a right to do "X"' ---we already knew that was the case. But the semantic/rhetorical problem with this is that in the mind of many we are implying that maybe-JUST maybe- some one should need permission to 'do X'.

This leads to a generational fog of such non-sense that goes on for so long even free men and women believe they need a permit, license, registration, or credential to do *ANYTHING* whether they do or not. Taken to the logical extreme you'll find yourself in a very special place called "The land of say-so" ~ or 'Illinois' for short.

 

[Owen Sparks]

They may close the "gunshow loophole" but they will never close the parking lot across the street loophole.

 

[ol' scratch]

In my state, the "loophole" is closed in the sense that transactions at gunshows have to go through the NICS/4473 rigmarole. Thank you knee jerk reactions to Columbine.

But it would be great to undo that. Otherwise, I don't know what it would look like to 'protect' the legal act of a private transaction.

You know what is stupid about that? Those two little fools purchased the firearms illegally anyway because they were underage. Who is to say that the moron who sold them the firearms would have done a background check?

 

[brickeyee]

Laws Are usually restrictive.
They tell what you CANNOT do.

Anything not prohibited is allowed.

There are very few law that say what is allowed.
If we had them the law would be minions of time larger tan it is now.

Anything nit illegal is by definition legal and allowed.

 

[Eric M]

The firearms used by Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold were straw purchased I believe.

 

[ATBackPackin]

In Pennsylvania the "loophole" is already closed. Anybody buying a firearm at a gun show has to fill out the 4473 and pass background check.

Privates sales on handguns also have to be done through a FFL, but long arms can be done without paperwork.

 

[medalguy]

Good question for ATBackPackin: are FTF individual sales in Pennsylvania even allowed, or do next door neighbors have to go to a dealer to transfer a .22 rabbit gun? Just how far have we ventured from what our founding fathers intended? Ironic this is in Pennsylvania isn't it?

 

[ATBackPackin]

Good question for ATBackPackin: are FTF individual sales in Pennsylvania even allowed, or do next door neighbors have to go to a dealer to transfer a .22 rabbit gun? Just how far have we ventured from what our founding fathers intended? Ironic this is in Pennsylvania isn't it?

That is what I was addressing with private sales are the same as FTF. Handguns have to go through a FFL. Long guns can be done FTF with zero paperwork as long as you don't believe that person to be restricted.

 

[ATBackPackin]

I guess what I don't understand is that if the person is restricted then they will just buy the guns illegally. Isn't hard to do. So yet again all they are doing by restricting FTF sales of handguns are restricting law abiding citizens.


I do have to admit though that all of this gun control has drastically reduced crime in Philly.

Yes that was sarcasm.

 

[sig220mw]

As some one else said it is already legal, why bother.

As for the NRA......they don't scare me, I send them money because I want to.

 

[MachIVshooter]

Does that mean that all face to face sales are banned state-wide (i.e. Colorado) or just at gunshows?

Just on the premesis of a show.

IF "just at gunshows"... what's stopping them from making the sale "elsewhere"?

Nothing. I've done exactly that. Of course, it wasn't to avoid a BG check; I just didn't have the cash on me.

The firearms used by Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold were straw purchased I believe.

No. All private sales. Only the handgun was an illegal sale because they were minors; They could lawfully possess the long guns. They had their friend Robyn buy the long guns because the private sellers refused sale to anyone under 18, even though such a sale is perfectly legal. Of course, they hacked the shotgun to NFA length. Not that it matters when murder & suicide are on the menu....