Why no smokeless muzzleloaders?
- Thread starter WestKentucky
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Maybe manufacturers are afraid folks might do something stupid like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SU1lGa1iH9E
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SU1lGa1iH9E
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osteodoc08
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Am not advocating this, but I have known individuals to use TrailBoss powder in a smoke pole. Not sure on charging or process, but just throwing it out there.
ironworkerwill
Member
IF! Some one uses mod powder in a ML other than one that is supposed to use modern powder they are asking for trouble! At best it will shoot but there are other worse things that can and have happened. An explosion or a hot jet to the face being a couple of options there.
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WestKentucky
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I'm not doing it, but if a person did want to how would they figure out where to start the load work up and where to stop? Seems to me like the first bungee jump...who knew how well that would work?
ironworkerwill
Member
The thing is - no one really knows where to start unless it is a rifle designed to use smokeless. I doubt trailboss would have any advantage in velocity over black powder if it didn't blow your face off.
kilibreaux
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There are many instances where people have loaded MODERN STEEL muzzle loaders and cap & ball revolvers with smokeless powder. I'm sure it's not talked about too much because if it were the Feds would almost certainly decide to take another look at how "BP" firearms are regulated.
The Ruger Old Army can handle smokeless loads...actually I converted a number of uberti 1873 ".44 Blackpowder only) cap & ball revolvers to shoot the .45 Colt and they've had ample amounts of ammo fired from them...including smokeless for the most part.
The Ruger Old Army can handle smokeless loads...actually I converted a number of uberti 1873 ".44 Blackpowder only) cap & ball revolvers to shoot the .45 Colt and they've had ample amounts of ammo fired from them...including smokeless for the most part.
redneck2
Member
That could be true, but you don't simply interchange equal amounts of smokeless with black powder. I knew some guys that did that. Started reloading with a 1st Generation .45 Colt. The first round they fired off blew the gun to pieces. Destroyed a very valuable firearm and put a guy in the hospital.
As I understand it, black powder has a pretty linear burn rate. That is, twice as much powder gives twice as much pressure. I'm sure it's not this linear, but it's a LOT closer than smokeless.
I suspect the average shooter has absolutely no idea how the burn rates and pressure curves interrelate with smokeless powder. With smokeless, an increase of 10% or even lots less can increase pressures maybe 100% or more. Using the exact same charge but using powders with different burn rates can have catastrophic results.
On the average black powder muzzle loader (.50 cal), you can vary the charge from 70 to 100 grains as a normal variation. If you vary the charge that much with smokeless, you'll have a bomb.
I don't have a Savage, but as I understand it they give very exact load data, which would make sense.
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Elkins45
Member
I've been using a Savage ML10-II during the muzzle loading hunting season for 13 years now. The main purpose for me is not having to shoot it empty at the end of the day and then having to disassemble and clean it. If I don't shoot it I just stick it in the gun safe until next year and I fire that loaded shot as a sighter. After the first few dozen shots fired for sighting and testing when I first bought it, I only fire it 2-3 times to verify zero and the 1-2 shots I take at deer each year.
I think it's been cleaned 2 or maybe 3 times since I've owned it. And it continues to shoot as well or better than my traditional BP rifle. That's the appeal to me.
Hi West Kentucky, I didn't take the time to read all the posts but I'm a BP shooter and was wondering the very same thing a while back. I googled up (lol) some info about that, and the Savage co. did make one but some careless person stuffed a bunch of smokeless powder in one , and by the looking at the pictures, wayyy too much and blew his fore arm ( left arm) and hand apart and probably tried to sue the heck out of the company somehow. I still think it can be made and in this day and age,, a safe one that will only hold up to so many grains of powder...
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