Wisdom of Gun Related Events shortly after a shooting

[FIVETWOSEVEN]

Who cares if the Mayor of New York auctioned off airline tickets?

You're missing the point, Airline tickets being raffled off after 9/11 would be extremely poor taste if it was in NYC where people were directly effected by the attacks. If you seriously don't see my point than you are really dense.

 

[ny32182]

Last I checked they were still flying planes in NY. Consider me dense... I could care less if they auction off airline tickets. I'm sure someone somewhere is doing exactly that. And I am not offended.

 

[BCCL]

Any gun raffle within 100 miles of there, held at any time in which Giffords is still in office, would be manipulated exactly the way this one has been by anti's and their media friends.

When basic essential freedoms are involved, capitulation is the same as collaboration.

 

[we are not amused]

Sorry. I am just not inclined to be a victim.
Perhaps Obama had it right, "If they bring a knife to the fight, we'll bring a gun".
I just am not in favor of "lying low", or not "making waves".
Perhaps you are not ashamed of owning guns, but when we criticize others for exercising their rights, we imply we are.
Instead of attacking our own supporters, we need to back them up, and make it clear that the anti-gunners are the real people out of line.
While I don't advocate open carry, I would never attack some one who did. No matter how nervous it made the "fence sitters". I would instead try to educate the fence sitters why it was a good thing. I would support the open carry people, not attack them.
Instead of worrying about how we are portrayed by people who don't like us anyway, let's go out there and make them look like the silly fearful people they are.
Don't defend, attack!
Don't cave in to Alinsky tactics, use them ourselves!

General Patton once said, "don't die for your country, make the other guy die for his".
That is the attitude of a winner!

 

[FIVETWOSEVEN]

Last I checked they were still flying planes in NY. Consider me dense... I could care less if they auction off airline tickets. I'm sure someone somewhere is doing exactly that. And I am not offended.

I'm talking about the Mayor of NYC doing it, only 8 months after the attacks, not some random raffle at some random point in the country. Or even a raffle for tickets now IN NYC.
You just have to have some common sense that you don't bring up bad memories about something tragic. If your child was in a automobile wreck because someone was driving a Red Ford Mustand, wouldn't you be greatly offended if someone drove to the funeral in a Red Ford Mustang even though they knew the car the person that caused it drove one aswell when he could easily drive another car that he had?

 

[we are not amused]

I see your point, I just don't agree with it. I don't think most people are that stupid.
But really, it is a stretch, I really don't think people would have been upset by a plane ticket raffle. Unless it was possibly a ticket to Mecca, Saudi Arabia.

 

[we are not amused]

If a red Ford Mustang is what I had, it is what I would drive. I don't see the connection.

 

[basicblur]

If your child was in a automobile wreck because someone was driving a Red Ford Mustand, wouldn't you be greatly offended if someone drove to the funeral in a Red Ford Mustang even though they knew the car the person that caused it drove one aswell when he could easily drive another car that he had?

Wouldn't make any difference to me-sometimes a car is just a car.

 

[we are not amused]

I am sorry, we are just going to have to agree to disagree.
We have different mindsets.
I am not comfortable in compromising my principals to get along. Nor do I suffer fools gladly.
I personally do not believe any amount of time would have kept the anti-gunners from attacking the Pima County Republicans. Nor would the type of gun mattered.

My reaction is to get out there and explain why the anti-gun nuts are wrong, not attack fellow gun supporters for being "Insensitive".

Have a nice day.

 

[ny32182]

If your child was in a automobile wreck because someone was driving a Red Ford Mustand, wouldn't you be greatly offended if someone drove to the funeral in a Red Ford Mustang

No... and no one is in a wreck because of the kind of car they are driving. Like guns, cars are inanimate objects that need human intervention to do anything.

I had a high school friend who was killed years later in a car wreck driving a Ford Focus... considering how common Fords are, and the number of people who showed up at the funeral, I'm sure the parking lot probably contained a few dozen Fords, possibly even a Focus, but we all made it through without being offended by the contents of the parking lot.

 

[Mike1234567]

Red Ford Mustang...

It's not a matter of the berieved being "offended". It's a matter of them seeing it and causing them unnecessary "added grief". Why do that when it's easily within your power to avoid it?

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

I like these discussions. It show the depth and diversity of opinion, even by those that basically share a positive outlook on guns and gun ownership. Perhaps if we can reason with each other, we can find common ground. The problem seems to be not with reason, but more with knowing when to stand ground and NOT compromise. Without a valid stand on things, one never really compromises. They just get pushed around. When has an anti-gunner compromised, other than being forced to? People whose goal is to ban something have an end that by definition, has no compromise. Religions, for instance, that have no tolerance for other religions, also have no room for compromise, no matter what they say to the contrary. We must be willing to find ways to live with each other, and tolerate each other's ways, while safeguarding and preserving our ideals, or force people to accept us as we are. I do not mind using force when it is paramount to maintaining my very existence. It is simply the way of the world.

 

[FIVETWOSEVEN]

wouldn't you be greatly offended if someone drove to the funeral in a Red Ford Mustang even though they knew the car the person that caused it drove one aswell when he could easily drive another car that he had?

I see you missed that part.

No... and no one is in a wreck because of the kind of car they are driving. Like guns, cars are inanimate objects that need human intervention to do anything.

Didn't mean to say that the wreck happened because of the car he was driving. What I meant to say is someone that caused a wreck was driving a Mustang.

 

[Neverwinter]

I see your point, I just don't agree with it. I don't think most people are that stupid.

No, they really are. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Park51#Controversy

It's not a matter of the berieved being "offended". It's a matter of them seeing it and causing them unnecessary "added grief". Why do that when it's easily within your power to avoid it?

Because it's against their principles to take such matters into consideration. See my previous post about using anti-sensitivity as a shield.

The story that was posted earlier about a Glock billboard claimed that people were not outraged because they understood that guns don't kill people. This conclusion is an example of the misunderstanding context. There is a difference between advertising for a business and the raffling of an object only peripherally related to the organization.

 

[357 Terms]

Posted by w.a.n.a

General Patton once said, "don't die for your country, make the other guy die for his".
That is the attitude of a winner!
__________________

"Don't defend, attack"

I'm not sure you understand what a few of us are saying.
This is not a war!
Like it or not public perception dictates our everyday lives, you are not going to win over public sentiment with a narrow minded attitude, you will just push people away.

 

[Mike1234567]

The story that was posted earlier about a Glock billboard claimed that people were not outraged because they understood that guns don't kill people. This conclusion is an example of the misunderstanding context. There is a difference between advertising for a business and the raffling of an object only peripherally related to the organization.

I give up. You're right and I'm wrong.

When your child loses her beloved pet rabbit to illness then be sure to take her rabbit hunting one week later so she can have a nice rabbit stew.

Of course, the newly dead rabbit added to the stew has nothing to do with her dead pet. So why are you cowards whining about it?

 

[BADUNAME37]

I am sure if we asked Gaby what she thinks, she would be glad people are representing and upholding the Second Ammendment, because, after all, she is a gun-owner and shooter HERSELF!

If anyone would be taken aback by the whole raffle ordeal, I am sure it would be the victim, however in this case, I doubt very much she would even care!

 

[we are not amused]

To Mike

About time, you were beating a dead horse to death.

 

[USAF_Vet]

The story that was posted earlier about a Glock billboard claimed that people were not outraged because they understood that guns don't kill people. This conclusion is an example of the misunderstanding context. There is a difference between advertising for a business and the raffling of an object only peripherally related to the organization.

Arizona: Glock used to kill a bunch of people. Story gets national coverage. Months later, a Glock is advertised for sale. People get offended and bring in the media hounds to berate the seller.

Grand Rapids: Glock is used to kill a bunch of people. Story gets national coverage. Weeks later, a Glock is advertised for sale. No one gets offended, no media called to berate the seller.

Why?

 

[357 Terms]

If anyone would be taken aback by the whole raffle ordeal, I am sure it would be the victim, however in this case, I doubt very much she would even care!

There was more than one victim, you should ask what every family member that had a loved one die what they think about the GOP raffleing off a Glock.

Grand Rapids: Glock is used to kill a bunch of people. Story gets national coverage. Weeks later, a Glock is advertised for sale. No one gets offended, no media called to berate the seller.

Grand Rapids? was it the local Republican office that raffled off that Glock?

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

By all means, we should propagate irrationality........................

 

[we are not amused]

There was more than one victim, you should ask what every family member that had a loved one die what they think about the GOP raffleing off a Glock.
Grand Rapids? was it the local Republican office that raffled off that Glock?

This is silly and pointless.

You have your opinion, most of the rest of us don't seem to share it.

You aren't winning any one over.

I've explained my point of view, as has others. You have had your say, you are just repeating the same thing over and over.

I get your point, you think the Pima County Republics are evil because the hoplophobes in the News Media said bad things about them. Fine, I don't let hoplophobes dictate my opinions.

Get off your criticism about something that has already taken place and suggest something to mitigate the damage you think has occurred.

How do we educate the public so that when a bunch of hoplophobes in the news media distort the facts, the public recognises they are being lied to?

 

[Neverwinter]

Why?

Arizona: Victims are a Congresswoman and constituents attending a political gathering. Seller is the organization of the opposing party to the Congresswoman.

Grand Rapids: Victims are the family of a murderer. Seller is a gun store in town.

As I mentioned before, these are different contexts and pretending as though this is an issue of demonizing the object does your argument no favors.

How do we educate the public so that when a bunch of hoplophobes in the news media distort the facts, the public recognises they are being lied to?

Which facts are being distorted? Did the Arizona GOP not raffle off a Glock? Was Gabrielle Giffords shot with a different brand of handgun?

What I'm uncertain of is whether this is an issue of educating the GOP, or if they understand the nature of their actions.

 

[357 Terms]

I get your point, you think the Pima County Republics are evil because the hoplophobes in the News Media said bad things about them. Fine

LOL I never said anyone was evil, try to be rational, I said (as you mentioned)REPETEDLY! that they used bad judgement.

 

[Mike1234567]

Edited Due To My Rant: I try to remain open-minded. Closed-mindedness is just one killer of compromise which often partners with greed, hate, fear, or a hundred other antagonists.