Wolf .223

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Alex45ACP

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Is it true that Wolf will wear out your gun faster than regular brass cased ammo? I'm seriously considering buying some because .223 is so hard to find/expensive right now, but it's not worth the savings if it screws up my rifle.

Also, is there any reason I shouldn't use Wolf to break in a new AR?
 
In my experience, Wolf is pretty good for cheap ammo. It works just fine and pretty consistently in my Armalite. I have heard people have reliabiliy issues with some rifles so you might consider just buying a few boxes to try out first before buying any bulk amounts.

I have heard people say it can wear stuff out or cause other problems. I have had no issues so far. I just bought a spare bolt assembly and firing pin so I think I have things covered for now. Someone else can comment on potential problems who has more experience with them.

I did buy a case of S&B brass ammo last year so I have a mix of ammo, but Wolf is my primary plinking ammo.
 
The older Wolf had a coating that would really gunk up things and was hard to remove. The new Wolf uses a polymer coating and doesn't make a mess any longer.

It smells horrible, but there's no real information out there to prove that it damages anything at all. Lots of "I heard about this guy"......
 
I bought 1000 rds of wolf and have shot half of it through my mini 14 thats a couple years old. It functions fine and does have a foul smell. It doesnt seem to cause undue fouling. The ammo is a couple of years old I bought from cabelas. Has a laquer coating on it. Cheap shooting, and seems accurate enough for me. My two cents.
 
I've never shot in my DR200

but I've noticed that one particular batch was extremely inconsistant about the muzzle report and blast. One round would be louder with mucho flames, and the next quieter with no flames.

Kinda turned me off. There's no way it was accurate. I was also buying WCC/TZZ for $115 per 1000 on my doorstep.

That could've just been a bad batch, and the newer stuff is better though.
 
Just make sure it's clean

I'm a range safety officer at my local gun range so you can imagine how many guys I see out there with AR-15's all the time. I have seen lot's of problems with the AR-15's on the bench and only one of them was because he was using wolf. I've seen thousands and thousands of wolf rounds go off without a problem, but you just have to remember one thing. Keep you rifle clean! If you shoot wolf ammo out of a dirty gun, you're asking for it! If your chamber gets gunked up with wolf gunk, the shells become just a little harder to extract, the harder they are to extract, the harder your extractor has to work to get them out. That means more, and harder contact with steel cases. I'm not saying this will definately hurt your extractor, but it's possible.

Wolf, I opt out.

Matt
 
Well, even if you were breaking a bolt every 1,000 rounds of Wolf, you would still save money buying a case of Wolf and a new bolt. If you were only breaking the occasional extractor, the savings are even better.

Having said that, I haven't seen any evidence of either yet. However Wolf is very dirty and can cause issues if you fire a bunch of Wolf and then run brass-cased ammo in a tight chambered gun. If you are going to use a lot of Wolf, just be sure to clean thoroughly with a good carbon cleaner and use a good chamber brush on a non-rotating rod after every trip.

I'd also add that if you want to do any type of accuracy testing, don't expect much out of the Wolf. It is 3-4MOA ammo in general, though you'll occasionally see better or worse from it.
 
I wouldn't use any steel-case or lacquer-coated ammo in an AR. See here for Olympic Arms' warning about it. Also, consult gunsmiths such as Clark Custom Guns for the amount of work they get repairing damage caused by such ammo!
 
Generally Wolf is fine in an AR15. Most problems with Wolf in an AR15 are due to the gun, not the ammo. If you have a 5.56 chamber (NOT .223) and a chrome lined barrel, you will likely not have any problems. FWIW, I've shot thousands of rounds of Wolf in both semi and full auto (where the chamber tends to heat up much faster) and had no problems, even with the old green laquer coated stuff. They newer grey cased Wolf is even better, though neither is exceptionally accurate. I've also not seen any evidence of abnormal wear on the extractor, though even if I had to replace an extractor every few thousand rounds the lower cost of Wolf would more than make up for it.
 
Ewwww. Russian steel case ammo in an American gun?

U S A! U S A! U S A!

Seriously, stick with NATO ammo for your 5.56 chambered AR. You just need to be on the look out for deals. AIM had a free shipping deal on their Adcom M855 ammunition last month. 500 rounds for $90. Same price now, but add shipping.
 
ocabj said:
Ewwww. Russian steel case ammo in an American gun?

U S A! U S A! U S A!

Seriously, stick with NATO ammo for your 5.56 chambered AR. You just need to be on the look out for deals. AIM had a free shipping deal on their Adcom M855 ammunition last month. 500 rounds for $90. Same price now, but add shipping.
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$90 for 500 rounds may be ok if you're only buying 500rds, but thats still about 50% more than the price of Wolf. When you're buying several thousand rounds per year, that savings easily adds up to several cases of ammo.

Funny thing about Oly's disclaimer; I've never known a manufacturer of any product or provider of any service that wasn't all too happy to limit their liability where practicable. Also, keep in mind that Oly does not provide chrome lined barrels, only chrome-moly or stainless. There is a difference. Chrome-moly or stainless is not mil-spec, chrome lined is. Oly knows this and thats why the disclaimer is there. FWIW though, I had a 5.56 SS Oly barrel that ran Wolf fine.
 
I shoot lots of Russian ammo(Barnaul and Wolf) through my M17s, never one problem. IMHO, if your AR-15 doesn't function with new production Russian ammo, why would you want it? From what I have seen, it seems like people are more willing to attribute their problems to Wolf rather than their gun. There is certainly a biase against Wolf in the AR community, I doubt its truly justified.
 
Much of the bad rap that Wolf has originated from problems with their lacquer coated ammunition, and it was well deserved.
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Strange.

Are we sure it wasn't the primer/bullet sealant?

IMHO, if your AR-15 doesn't function with new production Russian ammo, why would you want it? From what I have seen, it seems like people are more willing to attribute their problems to Wolf rather than their gun. There is certainly a biase against Wolf in the AR community, I doubt its truly justified.
Click to expand...

You and I are on the same page.
 
Here is what I have observed regarding Wolf:

I have never been able to melt the lacquer off of any Wolf cartridge case, including long-term exposure to temperatures of 500F. Your AR15 will begin cooking off at chamber temperatures of around 600F, so I am skeptical that lacquer has ever been an issue.

Wolf used to use a thick red neck sealant that did leave a thick, gummy red mess in the chamber and would cause cartridges to stick. You can avoid this by not using Wolf that has a thick red stripe around the bullet at the neck.

I do not think the problem with Wolf cases sticking (which has been reported in both polymer coated cases and lacquer coated) has anything to do with the case coating. I think what is happening is that steel does not expand to seal the chamber the same way brass does (probably another reason Wolf often produces lower velocities) and as a result carbon builds up on the chamber walls at a much faster rate (notice how much everybody complains about how dirty Wolf is?)

In guns with tight chambers, .223 chambers, or match chambers, the extra carbon buildup on the chamber walls may lead to functioning issues.

This baked on carbon is VERY hard. It is like the stuff on the tail of the bolt and it is difficult to remove from a chamber (especially one that is not chrome-lined). If you are going to use Wolf, you need to scrub the chamber thoroughly with a good cleaner or use a chamber that is cut a little more generously in your AR.
 
ocabj said:
Ewwww. Russian steel case ammo in an American gun?

U S A! U S A! U S A!

Seriously, stick with NATO ammo for your 5.56 chambered AR. You just need to be on the look out for deals. AIM had a free shipping deal on their Adcom M855 ammunition last month. 500 rounds for $90. Same price now, but add shipping.
Click to expand...

Isn't Adcom made in the UAE? Tell me how that is somehow better than Russian made ammo? (outside of specs that is)
 
MechAg94 said:
Isn't Adcom made in the UAE? Tell me how that is somehow better than Russian made ammo? (outside of specs that is)
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I wasn't implying that Adcom is US made, hence the 'Seriously' inserted at the beginning of my statement to counter the previous statements in my post.

I have no problem with people running Wolf steel case in their guns. I simply refuse to run it in my stuff. I will always recommend non-Wolf steel case to people who are asking about what ammo to use in an AR, but I'm not going to pressure anyone. To each his own.

There is a lot of NATO spec surplus out there in 556. A lot of it is not made stateside. IMI, Adcom, South African, British, etc. I'd go NATO surplus over Wolf.

Even then, I still shoot mostly Lake City or personal reloads using LC brass.
 
"Some" people will tell you to break in a new AR with something besides Wolf becuase it is underpowered .Then after it is broken in use the Wolf if you want. I can only speak for myself but all the AR's I have were broken in with Wolf. I broke one in this weekend with Wolf with zero problems. There is no evidence of Wolf of hurting anyhting and most of the claims were about the old casings anyway. Shoot the hell out of it!
 
I actually prefer Wolf for my RR M16s partly b/c it is underpowered - as in kind to my NFA toys. It is dead nuts reliable, sufficiently accurate (about 4 to 4.5 MOA with irons using A1 uppers.......I'm 51 BTW) for all blasting purposes. The empties can be policed with a power-mag; this matters at some shoots.

I have yet to personally find a single round that has enough of a defect that I would not run it through my guns. I cannot say the same for most competitively priced milsurp - whether we're speaking of ADCOM/XM###PD/SA/Malaysian/Norinco/eieio/whatever.

Yes, XM193 is probably better stuff. I can buy a complete upper with the savings I have realized thus far using Wolf. So I really don't give a rat's behind about what someone told someone about a conversation they heard once about something that might have happened to someone's extractor possibly b/c of Wolf......but not entirely sure it was Wolf.

BTW, I have yet to break any parts with Wolf. KBs? Heck, yeah, as in dynamite sticks.

Oh, yeah, it is dirty. This is b/c it is relatively underpowered and all powder burns cleaner at higher pressures vs low. But the Lord gave us Brake-cleaner and CLP for a reason.

Sam
 
Samuel_Hoggson said:
I actually prefer Wolf for my RR M16s partly b/c it is underpowered - as in kind to my NFA toys. It is dead nuts reliable, sufficiently accurate (about 4 to 4.5 MOA with irons using A1 uppers.......I'm 51 BTW) for all blasting purposes. The empties can be policed with a power-mag; this matters at some shoots.
Click to expand...

This is exactly my experience too. I've put ~3000 rounds of Wolf through my RDIAS host gun in the past year, 99% of it in full-auto. Zero problems. It's not very accurate, but on full-auto I'm not looking for pretty groups. If I want to do that, I'll shoot M193 in one of my semi-auto ARs.
 
I've put several thousand rounds of Wolf through my AR (Colt 6920). It runs like a champ.

If you do the math, you can shoot about 10 cases of Wolf and with the savings you can go out and buy a brand new AR. I won't pay $0.22/round when I can do it for $0.10/round (I stocked up when it was cheap :D)

If you're really really worried about it, take a look at Southern Ammo. You can get military turn in for about $120/1000 delivered. It's mostly TZZ (Israeli) and shoots great.
 
I have recently acquired an AR and am trying to decide what type of ammunition to stock up on. I do not fear that Wolf will cause my rifle to self-destruct, so my question is this--how does Wolf ammunition perform as compared to mil-surp ammunition? Is Wolf .223 loaded to M193 specs? I'd like to stick with one type of ammunition for all uses. Thanks for any input.
 
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