Would you carry to the club?

[joey93turbo]

I'm having a tough time with this and I'd like some feedback.

I love going out. I'm a 23 year old guy and I'm very social, I like being around people and I like to dance with the lovely ladies of Portland. I'm also very concious of my personal safety. I know that if something is going to happen, it's most likely going to happen at night, downtown.

I know most of you are going to say "avoid the area", "stay home", and other things to that effect, but seriously, I'm not going to live my life in fear and regret not living out my youth.

So tonight I went out to a very popular club downtown. I carried my P220 in my CTAC at 4 o'clock and nobody noticed, at least that I could tell. It's very concealable and none of the clubs in Portland have metal detectors or frisk. The problem is, it's so big, bulky, and heavy that I can't dance with it and I feel very self concious (this could be because I just recently started carrying). I didn't try to dance tonight because I didn't want anyone hitting it or possibly seeing it.

I think I need a smaller gun for when I go out dancing, I'm thinking of a Kel-Tec P3AT. It's very small and light, and I've heard pretty good things about them. In a small holster in the small of my back I think it'd be virtually undetectable, yeah?

Anyway, I want to hear what you guys think, what would you do if you were me? leave the gun at home? purchase a smaller gun?

 

[Khaotic]

I'm fond of the Colt Mustang for "close carry" - but most folk don't care for the .380Auto round.

Perhaps you can find something similar chambered in 9mm?

-K

 

[ny32182]

Another social 23y/o guy here...

Basically, I have to put it like this: I don't carry "downtown", and I don't think other people should either.

-In SC, it is illegal to carry in places that serve alcohol for consumption on premisis. This would obviously include clubs.
-Usually when I go out to a club, I'm drinking. I think it irresponsible to carry while drinking.
-The club scene is the one place where I think "they will take your gun away from you" might in fact be a real possibility. Any altercation that is likely to happen will probably be instantaneous and at very, very close range. Most of the bar fights I've ever seen, no one would have had a chance to draw anyway...
-but even if you did get a chance to draw, what are you going to do? Start shooting in a club that is literally standing space only, if that? There isn't just a *chance* of collateral damage... there *will* be collateral damage.
-Your life will be over... you will be sued into oblivion by every patron you hit.
-Obviously, having a gun on your hip will freak out the vast majority of girls that are there, thus eliminating your reason for being there in the first place.

Thats why I don't carry in clubs.

 

[AirForceShooter]

bersa thunder in .380
and the .380 will do the job it you place the shot.
also it's cute and girls love it.
You can play "wanna see my gun?"

AFS

 

[VTKFJoe]

I would carry to the club if it were legal and I wasnt going to be drinking.

In VA it is not legal to carry concealed where alchohol is served and like ttbadboy said, the ladies might not want to dance with someone they knew was armed (for whatever reason).

BTW, the p3at can be pocket carried which would make dancing easier.

ttbadboy - best to stay out of bar fights all together but just because some dumb drunk punches you doesnt give you the right to deadly force anyway. you are right that shooting inside a scene like that would be bad. BTW, its probably not the best plan to admit to felonies in writing even under a screen name. Applebees has been pretty anti-gun here in VA and might just bust you. They dont get my money (well, they didnt before anyway too many other choices for me to eat at corporate restaraunts). Stay safe.

Correct me if I'm wrong but Joey, you are more concered with coming and going from the club and being downtown than you are about altercations in the club - right? Just dont dance with the jealous guys lady

Joe

 

[ny32182]

"Applebees has been pretty anti-gun here in VA and might just bust you"...

Corrected; good idea...

 

[Old Dog]

TTbadboy's first post is pretty good. If one is going to be drinking, and presumably focused entirely on dancing, having a good time, and interaction with the ladies ... one should not be packing. Simply doesn't seem like the time when you'd be alert enough to any threats necessitating response with deadly force (however remote in a nightclub). Logistically and tactically ... in a crowded, dark club (with the requisite loud music), how would you use a handgun? When? Why?

Even if one is not drinking ... but most of the others present are ... alcohol and firearms don't mix well. Crowded club? I once saw a guy dancing so vigorously that his S&W .357 somehow dropped (didn't see how he was carrying) onto the dance floor ... Close contact with the women? Sorry, just doesn't seem like a good idea all the way around, even in a state where it might be legal (and it's not in my state).

 

[logical]

You actually need a reason to not go into Applebees?

 

[spacemanspiff]

I'm not going to live my life in fear and regret not living out my youth

it isnt a matter of 'living in fear'. its about COMMON SENSE.

would you go to a night club unarmed? if not, why would you go there armed? the troubles the same, you just are ensuring you will be a part of the trouble when it finally does happen.

you may also be violating the laws of your state regarding where you can lawfully carry concealed. i doubt your local law enforcement will see your justification of 'oh i just want to have fun and maybe play commando when SHTF in a trendy club' as valid.
why would you risk losing your permit, and possibly your rights to own firearms, because you want to be armed while clubbing?

to me, that hints at poor decision making. you CHOOSE to go to places where you might encounter danger. you CHOOSE to go out of your way to frequent such places.
you could easily CHOOSE to stay at home. have friends come visit you.

in your CCW training, did they mention 'what would a reasonable person do...'
in this situation, a reasonable person would either club unarmed, or not club at all. thats not the answer you want to hear though. my guess is that you came here to show off how tactical you are with your tactical dancing shoes and tactical gun doing tactical dance steps in an untactical environment.

 

[VTKFJoe]

You actually need a reason to not go into Applebees?

No, not me. Not a fan of the Applebeast.

 

[psyopspec]

If you won't be drinking and it's legal, I'd deep conceal a small gun. Not because something might happen in the club, but things do happen on the street from time to time, to people traveling to and from a number of places, including clubs. Or park closeby and leave the gun the car. Again, only if you won't be drinking and it's within the laws of your locality.

 

[Soap]

I don't carry when I'm out because I'm normally drinking.

 

[joey93turbo]

A couple things guys.

1st, I don't drink. I guess I should've mentioned that in my initial post.
2nd, It's legal here in Oregon to carry in bars and clubs that serve.
3rd, I'm not worried about something happening in the club and I'm aware enough to check out the exits people most likely wouldn't use, should something real bad happen. I'm not 50 cent and I'm not gonna shoot up the club. I'm mostly worried about coming and going from the club.

 

[Texian Pistolero]

women + booze = danger

women +booze + weapons = jail time OR morgue

Don't DO IT!

What you may not consider it that you do not control the whole situation, even if you ARE sane and sober.

I'd be surprised if there was a jursdiction in the U.S. where this is legal.

You can get busted by somebody elses stupidity, even if you ARE innocent!

Decades ago, I dated a girl who was a "chaos magnet". She had this weird ability to naturally start a lot of insanity, yet be standing demurely to the side when that gendarmes rolled in.

I REPEAT! You can get busted by somebody elses stupidity, even if you ARE innocent!

 

[odysseus]

1st, I don't drink. I guess I should've mentioned that in my initial post.
2nd, It's legal here in Oregon to carry in bars and clubs that serve.
3rd, I'm not worried about something happening in the club and I'm aware enough to check out the exits people most likely wouldn't use, should something real bad happen. I'm not 50 cent and I'm not gonna shoot up the club. I'm mostly worried about coming and going from the club.

Sounds like you got it all figured out then already...

 

[spacemanspiff]

if you don't drink and you just want to bounce around with scantily clad women, taking aerobics courses at a gym is much safer.

 

[LiquidTension]

IMO pocket carry would be a better idea than IWB. When dancing, there's no telling where a girl's arms might go. Brushing something around the small of your back is much more noticeable than rubbing up against something hard in your pocket. How many things do you have in your pockets anyway? Cell phone, wallet, keys, whatever. Besides, a woman brushing up against something massive in your pocket might just work in your favor

I understand your concern about walking to and from clubs. We have an area called Five Points here, and another known as The Vista. All of the bars and clubs are really close together, but some of the ones on the fringes start getting into shady areas. I don't go to those bars, but if I did I'd feel better if I were armed. Of course, since it's illegal to carry in a bar here, and I'm usually drinking (haven't gotten it out of my system yet, 25) I wouldn't be carrying anyway.

[edit] - Yeah, you might want to get a new pistol. Keltec, J-frame, something like that. I think pocket carry with a 220 would be a little absurd, and probably not entirely concealed.

 

[joey93turbo]

I was thinkin the same thing about pocket vs iwb, that's probably the way I'll go. I do have quite a bit of stuff in my pockets but I'll make room somehow. Right now I carry a surefire G2, my benchmade auto, keys, wallet, cell phone, change, they're a little cramped, haha. I think I'll probably ditch the wallet in favor of a card holder or something. All I really use is my ID, CHL, and debit card.

 

[El Tejon]

It's all about specific intent.

Where I live, there are no prohibitions on guns in taverns, however, I go by this rule of claw:

If you are going out to have "a good time", leave any gun at home.

If you are going out to dinner or maybe a beer or two and pool or darts, then DH Doctrine applies.

BTW, I'm under court order not to dance.

 

[Konall]

Seems like an ideal situation for Smartcarry. If the girls get close enough to notice, they'll just think you Reeeeely like them

 

[Trisha]

The obvious question has been nagging since I first noticed this thread:

Joey, what kind of clubs are we talking about? How would you describe them?

eg: Hip-Hop? Salsa/Latin? Neighborhood club that has assorted live music? Three-floor danceclub where you can find anything you like?

Is it the kind of place where you never arrive before 2000, always change out of work clothes/dress to impress, etc?

Situational awareness pop quiz:

Can you visualize the exits from the last two clubs you've been to? What's beyond the exits themselves?

Take care out there.

 

[joey93turbo]

All the clubs I go to around here play hip-hop/pop but they're not "thug clubs", mostly well off kids from the suburbs. You do get there around midnight and do dress to impress. I can identify three exits in two clubs and two exits in three bars I frequent

 

[carebear]

if you don't drink and you just want to bounce around with scantily clad women, taking aerobics courses at a gym is much safer.

How the heck would YOU know Spiffy?

Joey,

With your "not drinking and it's legal" comment in hand, you can put me in the "deep conceal" column. Emphasis on deep.

I'd use something that keeps the gun in front and very hard to reach (Smart Carry-type seems ideal) or maybe a small gun in an IWB. I think this is a case where you may want to pick a smaller arm and dress around it. If only for style.

4:00 with a full size grip in a non-security holster in a crowd that's all rubbin' up on you leaves you at a huge disadvantage if someone figures it out and goes for a grab. They can snake an arm in from a body length away and be gone. I've seen it done with cash before.

"Deep" lets you keep it secure and non-obtrusive. Even if legal, if people start freaking out because they see or feel a gun you can quite rightly be asked to leave or be forcibly ejected from private property by the management. I think if you enjoy that particular place it'd be worth the trade-off to avoid a long-term 86-ing.

Keep it "deep" in the club and you can transition to a pocket for the more threat-likely walk to the car and drive home.

 

[spacemanspiff]

All the clubs I go to around here play hip-hop/pop but they're not "thug clubs", mostly well off kids from the suburbs

doesnt sound like its a threatening enough atmosphere to necessitate being armed to me. then again, i dont get the whole 'clubbing' thing. then again, if it aint a seal i aint gonna club it.

How the heck would YOU know Spiffy?

you've had dogs in your car before, right? and they leave that slobber-trail on the windows from their noses and tongues right? well have you seen the similar trails on the windows of the gym? thats me.

 

[sturmruger]

Joey I am 27 and have some of the same issues that you are running into. My wife and I like to go out for a night on the town, but doing so in Downtown Minneapolis can be dangerous. I have found clubs and places to drink that do not have metal detectors. Also If we are going downtown I choose not to drink. I don't think there is anything wrong with going downtown. If you are over 35 and think we should stay home, I guess I feel kind of sorry for you. Your life must be dull.

I feel pretty safe in most of the establishments that we visit, it is walking from our car to the club that gets me nervous. I really want to buy a Kel-Tec, but for right now I just carry my little J frame .38. If you aren't drinking and plan to dance with women your best option is going to be pocket carry. Most pocket carry holsters feel just like a wallet when the women touch your backside they won't even be suspicious.