Another North Fork Tactical Update

I see several folks mentioning they are ordering from other places and cancelling their order here. That's all good and fine, but please remember all the importers are still dealing with the same alphabet bois in the end. I'm gonna go home with the one I brought to the prom and stick it out.

You may recall....in the original thread my question for Noah was how the primers would cross into the USA, because I'd never found anyone who was legally willing to do it.

But: I also feel if there is an opportunity to double down I'd take it. I'm going to send Noah an e-mail to find out.

I'm sticking it out as well. Noah has done a great deal of work to get this done and I wish him much success.
Personally it would make things a little less stressful if he feels the re-application has a better chance because a few i's were left undotted or a few tee's weren't crossed.
Knowing how Medicare won't pay a doctor because the forms weren't filled out 100% correctly and then not telling you why they were rejected is govt bureaucracy at it's best.
Hopefully the issues have been solved on the re-application.
Thanks Noah!

My guess is that 8 weeks from now we will still be talking about primer scarcity from our usual suppliers. I need to learn more patience anyway. Noah has my vote.

LoadingPirate said:

I ordered 60K primers 8 weeks ago from North Fork. I’m getting a refund. I’d consider letting it float with a better explanation. After 90 days I can’t dispute it.

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Yep and early on questions were not answered directly about why charge up front. Every business I have ordered from that has a delay does not charge the card until right before it ships. Maybe it's legit and I hope it is but I'm not a gambler. Money is money and I was taught not to throw it away and it has paid off nicely. YMMV

I'm going to wait it out as well. I do believe Noah has good intentions and also realize it still may not work out in the end. But I've already paid my credit card company the $450, so in my mind that money is already spent. I can't see any harm in waiting it out.

I'm not so sure about the 8 weeks to dispute the charge. I had a situation where my AX was charged fraudulently for airline tickets and AX refunded that. It was over a year.

I have some experience with credit cards, I as a vendor accept them, anytime there is a dispute the vendor is required to provide proof of the charge, ie a signature. That's what the chip in your credit card is all about now, fraud prevention.

I'm pretty confident I'd win a dispute if it came to that, I don't think it will. 8 weeks for a permit doesn't surprise me, IRS is quoting 12-16 weeks for an EIN.

I think both responses are reasonable—sticking it out or canceling.

Provided it does pan out, can you imagine the new orders once the first shipment arrives at a customers door?

I will be keeping my 5k order

I'm sitting tight as well with my 5K order.

CQB45ACP said:

I think both responses are reasonable—sticking it out or canceling.

Provided it does pan out, can you imagine the new orders once the first shipment arrives at a customers door?

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we will one day look back at the Primer Apocalypse of 2020 and have a chuckle.

“Do you remember when we hired Siberian Vietnamees trader to smuggle in Primers from Tibet”

I'm sitting it out also. Lets see, $120 to wait 8 more weeks or $800 for 2k primers at gun brokers and get them in 4 days. Since I have enough primers at this time waiting is not a problem. Losing $120 oppose to being over charged by 100's of $ doesn't seem like an option to me. Another site (Trifusion tactical) is stating delivery in Sept-Nov with a 50% down payment for 5000 primers,$750, seems state of the times we all have to deal with at a personal level.

PADoubleX said:

I'm not so sure about the 8 weeks to dispute the charge. I had a situation where my AX was charged fraudulently for airline tickets and AX refunded that. It was over a year.

I have some experience with credit cards, I as a vendor accept them, anytime there is a dispute the vendor is required to provide proof of the charge, ie a signature. That's what the chip in your credit card is all about now, fraud prevention.

I'm pretty confident I'd win a dispute if it came to that, I don't think it will. 8 weeks for a permit doesn't surprise me, IRS is quoting 12-16 weeks for an EIN.

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Having had some experience on both sides of the maze of bureaucratic inefficiency, I can tell you it is most likely all of the players are doing their best to make commerce happen. I know the BATFE has a bad - and well-earned- reputation for opposing American's basic civil rights but, that's in the politically-appointed leadership corps, not the office-workers who actually make things happen. Most of the staff are apolitical - that's the only way they can keep their jobs and their sanity. My initial response - back on March 5th - that March 15 was overly optimistic and it would be closer to June before any imports could actually be approved still stands. I said June 1st for a response from BATFE approving the import and it looks pretty accurate at this point. Bureaucracies serve a purpose: To see to it that nothing gets done. Eventually, processes pass out of the control of the bureaucracy and get done anyway.

Klaatu Barada Nikto said:

I'm sticking it out as well. Noah has done a great deal of work to get this done and I wish him much success.
Personally it would make things a little less stressful if he feels the re-application has a better chance because a few i's were left undotted or a few tee's weren't crossed.
Knowing how Medicare won't pay a doctor because the forms weren't filled out 100% correctly and then not telling you why they were rejected is govt bureaucracy at it's best.
Hopefully the issues have been solved on the re-application.
Thanks Noah!

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Well, keep in mind it is entirely possible the denial is based on North Fork's presale. If the BATFE field office interprets that as selling merchandise outside of the approval process, it will put the process on hold until the presale can be justified in writing. We are not talking about hard-and-fast laws with the BATFE, we are talking about policy and regulatory interpretations. E.G, judgement calls. The field office staffers do not want to get involved in approving an import which may later be tied to a public, tragic incident. They have to protect their jobs and their retirement. I'm not being sarcastic or accusatory, this is just the reality of civil service employment.

JDeere said:

Yep and early on questions were not answered directly about why charge up front. Every business I have ordered from that has a delay does not charge the card until right before it ships. Maybe it's legit and I hope it is but I'm not a gambler. Money is money and I was taught not to throw it away and it has paid off nicely. YMMV

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There are legitimate reasons to charge up front. Since these are high demand items, if you don't collect up front, folks can just put in orders that they never plan on paying for or orders for way more than they really want. If you make folks pay for it up front, you have a much better picture and control over inventory. As you can see from the email, he will issue refunds if you don't want to wait.

GeoDudeFlorida said:

Well, keep in mind it is entirely possible the denial is based on North Fork's presale. If the BATFE field office interprets that as selling merchandise outside of the approval process, it will put the process on hold until the presale can be justified in writing. We are not talking about hard-and-fast laws with the BATFE, we are talking about policy and regulatory interpretations. E.G, judgement calls. The field office staffers do not want to get involved in approving an import which may later be tied to a public, tragic incident. They have to protect their jobs and their retirement. I'm not being sarcastic or accusatory, this is just the reality of civil service employment.

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$100 bricks off GB or local post might be better then reading about import regulations and 4-letter Government paper cuts!

I’m disappointed! not really good at holding back my feelings! SUCKS!

I need bacon!

Mark_Mark said:

$100 bricks off GB or local post might be better then reading about import regulations and 4-letter Government paper cuts!

I’m disappointed! not really good at holding back my feelings! SUCKS!

I need bacon!

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Bricks seem to be going for well over $200 on GB.

packetloss said:

Bricks seem to be going for well over $200 on GB.

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Midway is up to $60/brick of what they don't have in stock.

Many many years ago I owned a small printing company and did a few jobs for the GPO (govt, printing off,) and never once was my bill payed on the first try. There was always some little something that was missed or incorrect. (date not in standard govt. format as an example) I eventually quit bidding on jobs. I can't imagine what its like to import munitions. Remember, this isn't a restaurant where you can ask your waitress to go into the kitchen and check on your order. Wish the delay hadn't occurred but I'm not surprised.

packetloss said:

Bricks seem to be going for well over $200 on GB.

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well my morning just got worst!

double bacon time

jag22 said:

Many many years ago I owned a small printing company and did a few jobs for the GPO (govt, printing off,) and never once was my bill payed on the first try. There was always some little something that was missed or incorrect. (date not in standard govt. format as an example) I eventually quit bidding on jobs. I can't imagine what its like to import munitions. Remember, this isn't a restaurant where you can ask your waitress to go into the kitchen and check on your order. Wish the delay hadn't occurred but I'm not surprised.

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The exact reason I got out of the defense contracting business...

PADoubleX said:

The exact reason I got out of the defense contracting business...

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Coffee is on me bro!

I'm staying in. In fact, I'll double down if he offers up any more pre-orders for those that ask for refunds and canceled their orders.

packetloss said:

There are legitimate reasons to charge up front. Since these are high demand items, if you don't collect up front, folks can just put in orders that they never plan on paying for or orders for way more than they really want. If you make folks pay for it up front, you have a much better picture and control over inventory. As you can see from the email, he will issue refunds if you don't want to wait.

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I like the stance that one of our own members has taken with his personally owned business. You put in an order, your card is charged. They have to buy materials to process your order and produce your goods. You are simply giving them the money to do that and getting guaranteed pricing at the time that the order is placed. If prices skyrocket, your order is already in. If prices fall, then so be it but you paid market pricing at the time that the order was submitted.

Another thing to remember, Powder Valley had these for sale ( and sold out) so the path is there for these to be imported. I would guess they came in thru the same POE. Hopefully just a matter of getting the paper work
squared away.

I believe that to properly put this into perspective is to know that sellers on GB (sellers with good ratings) have listed and sold these very same Unis Ginex primers.
So we know it can be done because obviously they did it.
I believe it's simply a procedural issue with NFT that will eventually get resolved.