10mm or 40

[tracy crider]

Needing to get a new hand gun for carry and have owned a few 40cal but not and 10s what do you think the pro,s and cons are for each and what would you get

 

[Kayaker 1960]

10mm is great for woods carry but they tend to be thicker/heavier than .40 guns. For me .40 works for general use. If I'm in the woods with lion and tigers and bears I take my .44 mag. If I didn't have a .44 mag I would consider getting a 10mm for that purpose.

 

[FireInCairo]

I figure 10mm to be the ultimate personal defense round for downing a bg the quickest, but... Though I've never shot one I can presume it has quite some snap, even with Glock's larger than average subcompact dimensions. They're likely quite a handful, and aren't quite as concealable as their .40 and 9mm counterparts can be had in subcompact size.

Can't lie, though, I may get one myself one day.

 

[JDR]

10mm 1911 with a .40S&W drop in barrel is a wonderful setup!

 

[LouisianaAviator]

In ballistic gel tests, there doesn't seem to be much difference between service calibers (9mm, .40, .45, even 10mm). All pistol rounds are pretty ineffective as far as stopping a threat, though if penetration is what you need (such as if you're in the woods with bears around) 10mm might be a good choice for maximum penetration, but even then I'd rather have a .44 Mag or .454.

For self defense against 2-legged critters, there's no significant advantage to 10mm over .40. There's no doubt 10mm is faster with more muzzle energy, but in my opinion, the recoil increase offsets that very slight advantage.

Any reliably expanding, 12-to-18-inch-penetrating caliber is gonna be similar in performance.

 

[RustyShackelford]

10mm....

Id pick a .40S&W over a 10mm unless you are really keen on buying a 10mm.
I'm not against the 10mm per se, but it has a few -s....
Gun writer & US Army veteran Duane Thomas wrote a detailed article years ago about why he thought the 10mm was less than ideal for a duty/CCW caliber.
He wrote the 10mm by design had feeding-cycle issues. He also said the muzzle blast, recoil, flash, etc just didn't make it worth it.
The 10mm with full house loads is widely known to wear out a pistol quickly.
If you want to "mix things up", get a new .40S&W then buy a after market .357sig. You can use the same pistol mags for either caliber & the .357sig is extremely potent.
Just so you are aware; the .357sig isn't a lightweight, it's loud, some rounds have a big muzzle flash & it's not easy on guns either.
The +s are that it feeds/cycles great, hits hard(high KE level) & offers excellent marksmanship.
The US Secret Service has issued the .357sig since the mid 1990s(SIG P229R DAK).
I used to like the caliber but the lack of ammunition sources & a low demand for .357sig led me to the larger .45acp but Id feel well armed with a .357sig pistol.
Hornady, www.hornady.com now offers a .357sig Critical Duty round.
Corbon DPX & Speer Gold Dot .357sig rounds are good too.

The 10mm is good but in 2014, Id say a .40S&W pistol would be better.

Rusty
www.sigsauer.com www.sgammo.com www.glockstore.com www.glock.com www.shopcorbon.com www.midwayusa.com www.natchezss.com

 

[Starter52]

Go with the .40 S&W.

I handload, shoot and enjoy the 10mm round, but still I believe there is little need for a 10mm carry gun. The .40 S&W is a better choice for day-to-day carry.

 

[MachIVshooter]

10mm is considerably more potent than .40, but for carry, you're not going to have many options. The Glock 29 and Tanfoglio Witness Compact are the only two 10mm pistols I'm aware of that aren't full size, and they're still not exactly small. I have the Witness Compact, and it is almost as large as my full size S&W 5906 & 4006, also just as heavy. The G29 is slightly more truncated and a bit lighter, but also thicker. Meanwhile, in .40 you have options like the Kahr PM40/CM40/Mk40, which are quite diminutive, along with other subcompacts. The 10mm is just too much for the guns and the hands in such a tiny pistol. I'm a big time 10mm guy, but I wouldn't be too keen on touching off full power loads in a <1" wide, 2-finger grip, 16 ounce pistol.

 

[Desolo]

A question: do you reload? If you reload 10mm is great! Also if you plan on using it in a fullsize platform it would be manageable.... but its not for everyone. In most of the loads I like its like a .357 revolver type of recoil, just in an auto loader format. Some dont like that.

I love mine, and excepting the urge every now and then to get a .40 barrel to "plink" with id not bother owning a .40..... and besides I can get ALOT of brass for the price of a barrel

Nothing wrong with a .40..... its just better at being used in different ways. As others have said, its friendlier in small weapons then 10mm, and 10mm is a handful in smaller ones, and those its in arent that small to begin with.

My suggestion? See if you cant try both and see what you like better.

 

[Nom de Forum]

I have a G20SF 10mm and I don't think it is a best choice for defense against humans but it is a good one. More power than needed for humans and recoil recovery is slower than with a .40. You can of course can install a .40 barrel in it but then you have a rather bulky .40 caliber pistol. I only carry it on a belt holster outside the city where it is an extra measure of power for cougars and bears over what my .40s and 9mms provide. It is fun to shoot and with a 9x25 Dillon barrel it is even more fun to shoot.

 

[AustinTX]

Just go with .40 S&W. Whatever small advantage one round of 10mm has over one round of .40 in a self-defense situation (against people) is more than offset by the increased muzzle flash and recoil, which will result in slower follow-up shots (especially at night). Unless money for ammo is no object, you will also be able to train more frequently with the .40.

Another thing to give at least passing consideration -- given that 10mm gives you no actual advantage -- is how using a 10mm might handicap you in the event that you were prosecuted and/or sued for civil damages after a self-defense shooting. It's not hard to imagine the prosecutor or trial attorney trying to make you look like a bloodthirsty nut for using 10mm. "Ladies and gentlemen, ask yourselves why this man couldn't be satisfied with the kind of handgun caliber that the men and women who keep us safe use, from small-town police to the FBI and even the military. Oh no -- what's good for all of these professionals was just too weak for the defendant. Ladies and gentlemen, why did he feel the need to use a round so powerful that even the FBI gave up on it a quarter century ago? During the course of this trial, we're going to prove that the defendant was no innocent victim here. By the time you begin deliberations, you will have no doubt that Mr. OP desired this sort of confrontation -- relished the thought of getting to use a caliber suitable for hunting buffalo on another human being...."

 

[Jorzac]

10 mm no question. My EDC is a G29 loaded with Underwood 135 gr Nosler HPs at 1600 fps, 767 fps ( their #s). Lose a little out of shorter barrel. Can't think of a better self defense setup. Also have a G20 with 6" barrel. Love the 10mm. Most people giving advice about 10mms have very little first hand knowledge.

 

[Jorzac]

I actually think my 40s and 357 sigs have more felt recoil. Snappier. The 10mm is more of a push. The comments about availability are overstated as well. You can find range ammo and most sporting good stores and gun shops. The internet is your best source for "real" 10mm ammo. Underwood, DoubleTap and Buffalo Bore being a few.

 

[WestKentucky]

My experience on meat pushed me away from 40sw. It was whitetail so it's debatable on whether it's relevant but the penetration at 15 yards was not good and neither bullet did much more than flare the hollow point slightly and stop. I expect a 10mm to do much better. I had better results with 38spl and 9mm. I would certainly buy the 10mm and buy a drop-in barrel, but then again I would be looking seriously into 45 GAP or other bigger long cartridges to make the most of the frame by allowing the most interchangeability from big and long down to small and short.

 

[Jorzac]

Great point about interchangeability. With a 10mm, you can change just the barrel for 40, 357sig and 9x25 Dillon. That's 4 calibers with just a barrel change. Pretty versatile. Can't do that with any other platform. Anything from 100 gr 9mm bullets in 357 Sig up to 220 gr hard cast 10mm.

 

[flyskater]

I have a Glock 20. I shoot a 180gr bullet at 1300+ fps 10mm ammo and shoot a .40 ammo in the same barrel for the past 4 years. Yup. No drop in barrel, no malfunctions. Alot of people don't recommend it, but after shooting several thousand .40 S&W rounds down the 10mm pipe, why change now?

 

[bangswitch]

I have both a .40S&W (Ruger SR40C) and a 10mm (G20 2nd gen). The difference to me in shooting them is like the difference in shooting a Model 14 .38 Spl, and a Model 19 .357 Magnum. Same basic gun in terms of weight, but the cartridge differences make them into different guns entirely. The .40 S&W has proven itself as a good defensive round and it's cheaper to shoot than 10mm. Unless you want to be able to shoot through a windshield or the side of a door to get to what's on the other side, a .40 is plenty.

 

[Nom de Forum]

I have a Glock 20. I shoot a 180gr bullet at 1300+ fps 10mm ammo and shoot a .40 ammo in the same barrel for the past 4 years. Yup. No drop in barrel, no malfunctions. Alot of people don't recommend it, but after shooting several thousand .40 S&W rounds down the 10mm pipe, why change now?

From the very beginning of your shooting .40 in your 10mm barrel you have been headspacing off the extraction grove/extractor engagement. I wonder if after several thousand .40 S&W rounds whether erosion to your chamber now results in the same headspacing with 10mm. Can you check that out and post your findings?

 

[SDGlock23]

I'll vote .40 all day every day. The .40 has a lot more bullet options available for it and smaller sized guns which is plus for concealment, not to mention it's less expensive more efficient than the 10mm.

I'm not against the 10mm as I've had quite a few over the years and honestly it is a good cartridge. I had to ultimately ask myself is this, is the 10mm really capable of doing anything the .40 cannot do? What I see when I hear people talk about "real" 10mm loads are people who are overly obsessed with velocity/energy, which isn't exactly bad in itself. However keep in mind most 10mm JHP loads use bullets designed around typical .40 velocities, so pushing them too fast can actually be bad as over stressing the bullet results in a loss of penetration, but most don't care when all they want is "energy" and if not for this "energy" then why bother with the 10mm at all?

Plus, if you pit a "real" 10mm against a "real" .40 (often overlooked), there's not that much difference. If the 10mm is a good woods cartridge, so is the .40. Too many people make it black and white, as if the 10mm is good for this but not the .40, which makes no sense. So if i take a G20 in the woods with, say a 180gr XTP running 1300 fps I'm golden but if I take a G35 with a 180gr XTP running 1250 fps I'm not? Some things I don't quite get, the talk of how superior the 10mm is supposed to be is one of them.

 

[CWL]

If that's what you want go ahead.

For me, 10mm is too big to carry. Bullets are expensive because I shoot a lot.

 

[4v50 Gary]

I like 10 mm. I'm in bear country.

BTW, SFPD killed a tiger (yes, big tiger and not a little kitty kat) with 40 S&W caliber pistols.

 

[RustyShackelford]

AZ vs Fish....

Post #11 brings up the same point raised in the Harold Fish incident, AZ vs Fish.
Harold Fish was a retired teacher with no criminal record who used a 1911 series 10mm(with Federal Hydra-Shoks) to defend himself from a guy who had a pack of dogs. Fish was reportedly hiking in a remote area when a guy with a pack of dogs encountered him on a trail. Fish according to some accounts asked the guy to control his animals. This made the dog owner irate & he lunged at Harold Fish. Fish then drew his 1911 & fired at the man.
Later, in court, Fish's use of a single action pistol & the 10mm became points brought to the jury.
One female juror later told NBC News she really didn't understand why Fish used hollow-points & why he used the 10mm. She also flatly stated; "I don't know a lot about guns."
A retired CT state trooper testified against Fish too explaining how "no major LE agency in the US was using a 10mm or a single action Caspian model".
Fish was convicted but he was given a chance at a second trial based on the material in the case. The prosecutors & courts decided not to re-try Fish & he was a free man. This was after thousands of $$$ & nearly 2 years of his life.
AZ even changed the requirements & standards for self defense based on this court action.

You can use a 10mm for defense but as posted, it's not as common as a .40 or 9mm.

 

[tommy.duncan]

I am a 10mm fan (and 10mm club member). I use my G20 as a woods gun (I am not in bear country, but they have spotted cougar, 4 legged, in the area). I still don't carry the 10mm as a CCW The biggest concern is over penetration.

Gun writer & US Army veteran Duane Thomas wrote a detailed article years ago about why he thought the 10mm was less than ideal for a duty/CCW caliber.
He wrote the 10mm by design had feeding-cycle issues

This is not true. I have been shooting 10mm since the early 90's, 0, that's right ZERO malfunctions. I have shot over 15k rounds through my Delta and another 5k through my G20. This comment is made by another 10mm hater.

I would go with the 40S&W for CCW.
I also CCW 357sig, but that is another discussion.

 

[Tcruse]

I suspect that this discussion could go on for years. If you are looking for a carry solution, one suggestion that I hear often is to look at what your local police carry. I would be the last to claim that they have any "special skill or knowledge" however, the approach can provide a good explanation for your caliber choice should that question ever come up in a court case.

 

[ATLDave]

He wrote the 10mm by design had feeding-cycle issues.

What was the basis for his statement? In what way is a 10mm inherently any more or less well-suited to "feeding" or "cycling" than any other straight-walled, rimless cartridge? That's just silliness.