Accurate Charge Weights BP In 60 Army

[Crawdad1]

DPris you had it worse than me but not by much. I Read everything that the late Sam Fadala, God rest His Soul, wrote about black powder and also the holy grail of black powder the Lyman Black Powder book. Practiced on a kit Remington revolver I put together that I bought at Montgomery Wards and spent day after day screwing things up. But I learned.

But the one thing I do to every Colt I owned is 'V' notch the back hammer sight.

 

[rodwha]

My Pietta Remington (2013 model) has the faster 1:16" twist and does fairly well with my 170 grn WFN (.400" OAL) and 195 grn WFN (.460" OAL) with 30 grns of 3F Olde Eynsford or Triple 7.

It's loaded now with T7 and 170's and has about 1/4" of space to the mouth. T7 compresses more than BP though. I have been considering buying some thinner (1/16" IIRC) to use as filler as it's easier to deal with over cereal grains, especially in the field.

My shooting has been done at 15 yds offhand and I typically see 3-3.5" groups that open up another inch or two with a flier.

Judging by others' chronograph results I figure this is getting about 325-375 ft/lbs.

My ROA does well with 35 grns of either powder and with both bullets. I've only tried charges in increments of 5 grns as my measure is for rifles and graduated by tens. I only want field useful loads and began at 25 grns and found these loads to be the more accurate. I don't use a ball much any more, but seem to recall similar enough group sizes.

 

[DPris]

Craw,
At 17, with no money to speak of & no real access to (or knowledge of) Fadala or any other resource material, I had to wing it.
Did not even know enough to avoid brass frames, so my first (which I still have) is a brasser I retired long ago.
Still in good shape, but has not been fired in at least 25 years.

No idea who actually made it, it says "Williamson Arms" on the barrel, round barrel, not octagon.
It broke the hand spring in about 1970, fortunately had a girlfriend whose father was a bit of a gunnie & he was able to repair it for me, for no charge.

Your mention of the hammer sight notch reminds me the one on that old .36 was off center, thing never did shoot exactly straight.
I was thinking about addressing that hammer notch on this 60.
Probably will at some point.
Definitely not ideal for quick acquisition.

Rod,
I have 777 & some other BP sub down in the basement.
I've used Pyrodex & 777 in the past, should probably experiment some more in the 60.
Just kinda like BP, though.
The smell takes me back over 45 years.

Denis

 

[rodwha]

I admit I enjoy my Olde E. I really wanted to see what the fuss was with the traditional group but only cared for energetic powders. I looked for Swiss but couldn't find it locally. But then Goex came out with Olde E, and I ordered it online. I like it and T7 for different reasons though, and so I use both. They perform quite similar enough in my guns, and so there is no need to reduce the charge by 15%.

I would like to chronograph both though.

I like the smell of Pyrodex, but it ends there. I still have some for breaking in new guns.

 

[DPris]

Yeah, drifted away from Pyrodex a while back, still have some leftovers, though.
Have not tried the Olde Eynsford.
Where do you order from?
Denis

 

[Malamute]

Have you checked groove diameter vs chamber diameter?

I have an Uberti 60 that shoots passably well. It normally gets shot with fairly full loads, 35-38 grs I think? The one I saved on the fridge was one handed @ 15 yards, its about 3/4" tall by 1 3/4" wide for 5 shots.

 

[DPris]

Have not.
Probably should, huh?
Denis

 

[Malamute]

Just a thought, if its acting funny like that.

 

[rodwha]

I order from Grafs. I used to buy my 3F T7 from BassPro until they didn't have it in stock for several months and gave me no choice but to look online.

Olde E is merely $1 more per pound over standard Goex, and well worth it to me.

My Pietta Remington had way undersized chambers of .446", and so a fellow on a forum reamed them closer to groove size for me (.449"). If nothing else it's not as hard on the lever linkage when I load my .456" bullets or .457" balls. I would prefer it closer still, but I haven't seen a hand reamer of that size, though Brownells does carry one slightly larger. I'm not sure if I care to buy it as I am likely to go with Uberti if/when I get another.

 

[DPris]

Thanks.
I'm having a hard time with the idea of paying $45 for a single pound of powder there.
I'll keep on looking locally.
Denis

 

[RPRNY]

Powder Inc. OE at $26/lb delivered (albeit a 5 lbs order).

 

[DPris]

It's the Hazmat fee that kills it for me.
Denis

 

[rodwha]

It killed it for me too until I looked at a bulk buy to negate it for the most part. I also liked that I no longer waisted my time getting to BassPro to find it sold out.

Some places will stick percussion caps in the powder order so that only the one fee is charged. Grafs does his but haven't had ANY caps in about two years so I pay two fees. I keeping meaning to try another vendor that has higher prices but carries what I need for one fee.

 

[DPris]

Yeah, if you do a bulk buy it spreads out the Hazmat, I just don't normally drop a couple hundred on a single powder order.

Graf's is a last resort, if I can't find anything locally.
Denis

 

[rodwha]

Triple 7 was the only powder BassPro carried that I wanted. It's about $32-33/lb after taxes. Grafs has it for $23/lb and so 3 lbs plus the HazMat and shipping about broke even. It's around $100 to your door, which is my monthly hobby funding.

But I also buy Olde E which is $18/lb and just $1 over standard Goex, which is well worth it to me.

3 lbs of powder lasts me a fair amount of time. If I could find the powder cheaper locally I'd prefer to avoid the HazMat, but with just 3 lbs at a time negating it and not needing to drive to get it, and more so not being concerned with finding it sold out, it's just not worth driving any more.

 

[rodwha]

With percussion caps it was the same thing. Rem #10's are all that work for me as I cannot find and CCI #11 standard (non magnum) caps to try, which is what my Track of The Wolf nipples were designed for.

With hoarding by many, and companies turning their attention to smokeless, caps were absent for loooonnnnngggggg stretches of time. It's a chunk to drop $100 for just powder, caps, or lead, but at the same time I know I'm set for a fair amount of time. You just don't know if/when the next dry spell will hit.

I'm interested in flintlocks now partially because of this.

 

[DPris]

I can find CCI 10s & 11s locally, Rems seem to work better in overall results.
Denis

 

[Malamute]

Denis, did you get a chance to check the size of the chambers and groove on your gun?

Been curious. May not be the problem, but who knows at this point.

 

[DPris]

No, I don't have the equipment.
It'll have to wait till I can get it in to my gunsmith.
Denis

 

[Malamute]

Do you have a dial caliper? You can get pretty close with one, get an idea if they are far off in size anyway.

 

[DPris]

I don't have a strong enough rod to slug the bore & don't have a pin gauge for the chambers.

My calipers wouldn't give me a good chamber reading.
Denis

 

[RPRNY]

I don't have a strong enough rod to slug the bore & don't have a pin gauge for the chambers.

My calipers wouldn't give me a good chamber reading.
Denis

A 3/8" wooden dowel will do fine for slugging your barrel. For the chamber, wax a round ball and seat it in the chamber (just the ball). Remove the nipple and push the ball out with a nail. Measure the slug and the ball with calipers.

 

[DPris]

Thanks.
Might just wait till the gun goes back to Goon's for Round 2 & ask him to do it.
Denis

 

[Crawdad1]

Wish this weather would break so I can get out and do more testing and post the results. :banghead:

 

[DPris]

I don't think a .457 would work well.
The .454 shaves a good ring & the lever already takes some effort to seat it.

A .457 would be a nuisance to load.
Denis