almost sold a gun to a BAD BOY THUG last night

[streakr]

This is one of the best reasons for internet firearms sales. Deals made, money comes in, FA goes to FFL who performs backgrounds.

I only sell online or to people I know.

s

 

[CHEVELLE427]

UPDATE

DID A PHOTO LINE UP LAST NIGHT

so im guessing the ball is still rolling

 

[MachIVshooter]

This is one of the best reasons for internet firearms sales. Deals made, money comes in, FA goes to FFL who performs backgrounds

I trust my judgement a whole lot more than NICS when it comes to who I would or wouldn't sell to. Plenty of people I've seen through the shop that pass a BG check I would not have made a private sale to. And a good share of the denials are good people who maybe didn't pay a traffic ticket or some other trivial crap.

 

[bogie]

Just more reason to only sell to friends, or friends of friends.

If you're selling something to someone who you don't know, how'd they find out about it?

Agent Schmuckatelli over at F-Troop frowns mightily upon those folks who run a business selling guns without an FFL...

 

[Floppy_D]

I took a gamble and met with a guy from THR... tinygnat219. Turns out he was a heck of a guy, and I got to meet him at one of the coolest gun stores in my area that I never knew about (Greentop). He invited me to join the VCDL, and told me about some cool CAS shoots, that I never knew about... both of which I still need to do. One way or another, I was glad to meet a world-class 2nd amendment bubba. There's good folks out there, just gotta screen for the oddballs and meet in the heavily lighted public at first.

 

[ServiceSoon]

And a good share of the denials are good people who maybe didn't pay a traffic ticket or some other trivial crap.

I don't like the NICS system either but lying and spreading propaganda is a Brady strategy.

 

[MachIVshooter]

I don't like the NICS system either but lying and spreading propaganda is a Brady strategy.

Who's lying? You don't think a bench warrant from an unpaid speeding ticket will result in a denial? And you don't think that such minor offenses aren't often the issue?

I was denied when I was 19. CBI revamped their system and conveniently "lost" certain details about history, like they only showed that I had been charged with a class IV felony, but did not "have the record" that all charges were dismissed in my case.

 

[dalepres]

I liked the suggestion of one poster to sell to members of thehighroad. I would bet that, for most members, they could easily find a buyer here for anything they had to sell. I know that NE Oklahoma sellers would have a potential buyer in me for a whole long list of want-to-haves.

 

[TAB]

Who's lying? You don't think a bench warrant from an unpaid speeding ticket will result in a denial? And you don't think that such minor offenses aren't often the issue?

Working in a FFL in CA, ~ 90% of the people that failed the test, were not do to the DOJ check, but the DMV check. Several were for tickets people had gotton 10+ years go.

Out of the remaining 10% I would say 9% of that was for things like unpaid child support. In my 3 years working in a pretty active shop, there was only one person that came up bad, and it was from some one that had been 5150ed.

 

[Chisel Head]

...Agent Schmuckatelli over at F-Troop...

F-Trooper = F-****

...Out of the remaining 10% I would say 9% of that was for things like unpaid child support

That's stupid that you, as a gun vendor, are indirectly employed to do the law enforcement agency's work for them. First, they aren't rewarding you for it. Secondly, what someone does in traffic or that someone goes out for that proverbial pack of cigarettes and doesn't come back, doesn't have anything to do with your relationship to your clients. Maybe, all gun owners should sign a petition making the Social Security Department responsible for deriliction on civil infractions. Wouldn't it be more effective to threaten civil violators with the deduction of past fines and child support payments from future pensions than to literally force a potential client to own an unregistered firearm derived from potentially shady sources?

 

[conw]

And this is why you NEVER meet at your home to sell anything.

Wal Mart parking lots are good, Starbucks, Home Depot......very public areas.

Good thing is he's probably all hot air. If he was a REAL bad boy he wouldn't have left.

+1. One of the best places I can think of (in light of 44and45's post) is in front of a gun shop.

Did your intuition tell you anything over the phone? Me thinks so.

 

[bogie]

Just wait until one of you blithering geniuses sells a gun to a reporter. While he's got the proverbial hidden camera going.

And then you've got to explain how you KNEW that he was a "face to face," and not a homicidal maniac.

We are living in an adversarial atmosphere. You can make it better, or you can make it worse.

 

[TAB]

That's stupid that you, as a gun vendor, are indirectly employed to do the law enforcement agency's work for them. First, they aren't rewarding you for it. Secondly, what someone does in traffic or that someone goes out for that proverbial pack of cigarettes and doesn't come back, doesn't have anything to do with your relationship to your clients. Maybe, all gun owners should sign a petition making the Social Security Department responsible for deriliction on civil infractions. Wouldn't it be more effective to threaten civil violators with the deduction of past fines and child support payments from future pensions than to literally force a potential client to own an unregistered firearm derived from potentially shady sources?

I don't have one prob with then not allowing people that have not paid child support not being able to buy guns, or have drivers lic. I always found it funny that the 1st year FTB took over collections... they collected almost 3x what had ever been collected before...

If you have a warrent out on you( and you do for failure to apear) I personally don't see the diffrence between rather your wanted for murder or jay walking. You still going to end up the exact same place... Under arrest.

 

[Chisel Head]

A jay walker is likely to get a different cage & audience than a murderer, though. Maybe, except in Arizona where all pink panty-wearing captives are created equal



That is the attire of which governor Schmuckatelli forces the convicts to wear there. Isn't it?

 

[ServiceSoon]

Who's lying? You don't think a bench warrant from an unpaid speeding ticket will result in a denial? And you don't think that such minor offenses aren't often the issue?

I apologize if I am incorrect. I just can't comprehend that the NICS system would apply in such a way. The only prohibited persons that could apply to not paying a speeding ticket would be:

TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 44 > § 922
(d) It shall be unlawful for any person to sell or otherwise dispose of any firearm or ammunition to any person knowing or having reasonable cause to believe that such person—
....(2) is a fugitive from justice; ....

TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 44 > § 921 Definitions:
(15) The term “fugitive from justice” means any person who has fled from any State to avoid prosecution for a crime or to avoid giving testimony in any criminal proceeding.

How would this section apply to a civil infraction? Especially considering the defintion for the term "crime punishable by a term exceeding one year" which seems to waive non-violent crimes.

It couldn't be:

TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 44 > § 922

(8) is subject to a court order that restrains such person from harassing, stalking, or threatening an intimate partner of such person or child of such intimate partner or person, or engaging in other conduct that would place an intimate partner in reasonable fear of bodily injury to the partner or child, except that this paragraph shall only apply to a court order that—
(A) was issued after a hearing of which such person received actual notice, and at which such person had the opportunity to participate; and
(B)
(i) includes a finding that such person represents a credible threat to the physical safety of such intimate partner or child; or
(ii) by its terms explicitly prohibits the use, attempted use, or threatened use of physical force against such intimate partner or child that would reasonably be expected to cause bodily injury; or

What gives?

 

[TAB]

Its not the unpaid ticket, its the failure to apear that puts you on the list.

 

[Tarvis]

the way i understand the gun sell laws FTF is i cant sell to a known felon, a known mental patent, a minor, OR SOMEONE OUT OF MY STATE

I called the local ATF office a couple of weeks ago, this is what they told me as far as private transfers go: You probably should get a bill of sale and some information from the buyer, but none is required. If the ATF shows up wanting to know why a rifle registered to you was used in a crime, they have no recourse if you sold it. There is no way of actually knowing if a person is a felon or adjudicated mentally defective if they seem to act normal and aren't wearing an orange jumpsuit issued by the county.

You did a good job not selling it to him and from what I can tell, handled the situation very well. So he was apprehended?

Agent Schmuckatelli over at F-Troop frowns mightily upon those folks who run a business selling guns without an FFL

The ATF said you can not sell a firearm you did not buy intending to use. Shoot a few rounds through it to see if you like it. "What if I bought and sold 30 guns last month?" Just trying to find one I like, sir.

 

[ServiceSoon]

There is no way of actually knowing if a person is a felon or adjudicated mentally defective if they seem to act normal and aren't wearing an orange jumpsuit issued by the county.

I personally require a valid LTC or CCW.

 

[Chisel Head]

...considering the defintion for the term "crime punishable by a term exceeding one year" which seems to waive non-violent crimes...

That's pretty much how it used to be, way back when. Nowadays, I hear people are taking a heavy fall for posession of soft drugs or for commiting economic crimes. Of course, all of wich are non-violent. In states like Arizona, simply forgetting your driver's licence at home is enough to land you in Governor Schmuckatelli's Pink Panty Zoo.
Any penalty which exceeds a year is a felony conviction, by the way

 

[JImbothefiveth]

I would keep all face-to-face sales away from my house, just so he doesn't find out where I live.

 

[gym]

Just a thought, sorry that I hadn't been around, the last week, but what about his PO, that might carry more weight than anything else. If he's on parole now or even from a prior, he may take a word from his Parole Officer to heart. Or possibly be violated, as long as the PO agrees not to drag your name into it. Perhaps one of the officrs that were involved in the initial conflict might be of help here. And I have found that guys like this one usually fall into a mold, and continue to make the same mistakes over again.

 

[fp2000h]

Yeah but we know he doesn't have a gun

And he knows the OP does.
And he knows the OP called the cops, which means he's been identified and he knows it.

Yeah, cause logic is what's at work in this guy's head. Seriously though, I hope it turns out well. God knows I would be freaked out, staying up late and hanging out on the roof with a red dot.

 

[Jim K]

IMHO, the OP was lucky. Just because a bad guy wants to buy a gun doesn't mean he doesn't already have one. And face-to-face transfer can mean he takes what you have and you get a face full of bullets.

Jim

 

[CHEVELLE427]

Jim
them there bullets can fly both ways.

Same thing can happen at you local yard sale. You put signs up and invite strangers over to see the stuff you want to sell and if you have furniture it most likely is inside your house.

Bad guy at the house or on the street you have to know/watch what is around you now days.

did a photo line up Sunday night, felon was to be picked up last night but no word yet

 

[fizik]

I've only had one shady encounter while selling a gun., but I had the foresight to bring one of my own and a friend who was carrying. Granted I've only sold a couple guns, I'd much rather buy and have more lol, but when the guy you meet is wearing gang colors, driving an Impala with huge wheels and talking about his PO being a prick, it's not quite right. I just told him I left the gun at home, and would call him back and left. Good luck here, but I'm with the people saying he won't do anything. Still be prepared as you are, just in case.