AR-15 Newbie

Which Rifle Would YOU Choose?

  • RRA Elite Operator2

    Votes: 13 21.7%

  • Del-Ton DTI-4

    Votes: 2 3.3%

  • Del-Ton MOE Carbine

    Votes: 4 6.7%

  • Spike's Tactical ST-15 M4 LE Carbine

    Votes: 41 68.3%
  • Total voters
    60
  • Poll closed .
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J

JPG19

Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2010
Messages
292
Location
Northwest Arkansas
Hey guys, this is my first thread here on THR so please go easy. I'm in the market for my first AR-15 and have done quite a bit of research, leading me to conclude that for every statement that "x" is absolutely necessary in an AR, there's another saying the opposite. I know I want it chambered in 5.56 NATO, M4 feed ramps, a properly staked gas key, and prefer a chromed BCG.

The rifle will be used primarily for target shooting and fun, as a SHTF gun, and to dispatch the occasional coyote, etc. on our property. I've narrowed it down to the following based on price, features, and reputation. I will be using iron sights for quite a while and add an EOTech or other optic later on once I'm comfortable with the irons. Given the never-ending contradictory statements about who's best, what's most important, etc., I'm putting my trust and faith in the THR community to help me decide which rifle I should choose. The one's I'm considering are (along with my key thoughts) as follows:

1) RRA 16" Elite Operator2 - $1,000
- Comes with lots of goodies and upgrades, Free-Float Handguard, Mid-Length gas system, Chromed BCG.
http://www.rockriverarms.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=462

2) Del-Ton DTI-4 16" Rifle - $750
- Inexpensive, M4 Feed Ramps, great reviews, nice and simple.
http://www.del-ton.com/DTI_16_DTI_4_Rifle_p/rftm16-0.htm

3) Del-Ton 16" Carbine MOE Rifle - $830
- Similar to #2 plus a few upgrades (buttstock, handguards)
http://www.del-ton.com/DTI_16_Carbine_MOE_Rifle_p/rfth16-moe.htm

4) Spikes Tactical 16" ST-15 M4 LE Carbine - $849
- On backorder, 1:7 barrel, M4 Feed Ramps
http://www.spikestactical.com/new/z/st15-m4-le-carbine-p-387.html

Any input aside from "You can't go wrong with any of them" would be helpful. I am interested in what YOU guys would choose. As much as I like the Spike's Tactical, I'm not sure I can wait however many months it would take for it to arrive. I primarily feel torn between #1 and #2. Thanks guys!
 
I voted for the Spike's on your poll, but a few other options to consider would be the S&W MP15 Sport, and then also Palmetto State Armory. Plenty of user feedback are available for each of these via the Search function.

Assuming your top budget is at/around $1000, the Spike's, the PSA, and the BravoCompany offerings will be among your better options at that price point. If you are trying to stay in the $700 range, the PSA and the S&W will more than likely fit your stated needs.

Personally, I'm a Spike's ST15 owner and it was worth the wait, about 8 weeks, and currently they've adjusted their operation to try and whittle that down a bit.

Either way, I'm sure the THR regulars will kick in here at some point with various viewpoints and reasons that'll steer you into being comfortably informed.
 
I don't own any you listed but I would go with Spike's. You should also look at Bravo Company and Daniel Defense to your list. My BCM rifles have served me well.

Sent from my LG-P999 using Tapatalk
 
from what you put up there 2 choose from Spike's wins hands down.as stated above take a hard look at BCM and Palmetto State Armory,they both are in your price range i think and are high quality AR's BCM would be my 1st choice
 
I have a Spikes M4 LE upper and the quality is superb. 100% reliability through about 1000 rounds far. None of your other options is even in the same league, as far as I'm concerned.
 
you say you will be using irons for quite awhile yet 3 of your 4 choices are carbine length. you want some more sight radius in relation to barrel. I think you need to check out more midlengths including some of the new bravo company 14.5 midlengths. also cmmg has some nice dissapator configurations that give you midlength gas systems with rifle sight radius.
http://cmmginc.secure-mall.com/shop/index.php?shop=1&cat=83
 
I voted spikes, because it is the best option out of all of you choices. I got a lemon from Del-ton and have a personal bias against them though. That said, Spikes is still alot better quality.

I'd also look at BCM. Love my middy from them. Haven't cleaned it in forever, just lubed, and fed it nothing but steel cased ammo. Still runs like a champ.
 
For a little more you can get a "tier 1" rifle.

With all due respect JPG19 I'm really surprised BCM isn't on your list. About a year ago I did my research and went through what you seem to be going through. I concluded BCM was the rifle I wanted. Now I own 3 of them with probably another on the way when I come home from the sandbox.
 
Thanks for all the great input guys, looks like I'll be going with Spike's Tactical and will take a look at BCM (thank you for your service bamcis). I guess now the choice is primarily between a carbine or mid-length gas system. I am under the impression that the mid-length gas system is less harsh on the rifle, no? With that said, what advantages does a carbine length system have? Also, I should clarify that my decision to use the irons for a while is simply to become familiar and proficient with them, in the event that my optic should fail.
 
14.5" Middy gas is the softest shooting light Ar. But may not like cheap/weak ammo. These are very popular in 3 gun comps now. Sometimes ejection is annoying and too far rearward.

14.5" Carbine is just about as soft. A bit more reliable than Middy with weaker ammo. Better for leftys.

16" Middy is about the same as 14.5" Carbine. Soft enough. Shoots well.

16" Carbine gas has a ton of power to work with weak ammo. Better 16" carbines will have a smaller gas port and heavy buffer from all that dwell time. Excellent for leftys.

18" Rifle gas is like the 14.5" middy, but 18" rifle is heavier so it has even less recoil.



Any will work fine as long as a good company built them. Usually it's the cheaper companies that screw up 16" carbines and 14.5" middys. Wrong buffer, port size etc.etc. A PWS FCS556 compensator will do wonders to the recoil of the smaller/lighter rifles.
 
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I've found that the time between follow up shots is a lot shorter with a mid-length gas system compared to a carbine on a 16in barrel. So if you plan on doing any fast shooting I'd go with the mid-length. Mine runs weak ammo very well. Never had a problem other than the occasional dud round, but thats to be expected from russian ammo.
 
I have a Bushmaster LE, and a put together with Spike lower that has a much better trigger with a pro low Panther upper 16" Bull barrel (chrome molly). Both are 1/9 twist barrels and handle mid range bullets of 55 to 62 best. Haven't tryed all weights yet.
 
The Spike's is made with better parts and probably somewhat better QC than the others. The RRA will probably be cosmetically prettiest with the others fairly close behind.

Oh, btw, I own AR pattern rifles from all three of those brands plus several others.

Did you consider the S&W M&P15 "Sport" model? It's a real bargain.

Beyond that, a midlength gas system is really nice to have on a 16" barrel, primarily for reliability but also for the longer sight radius and longer handguard. All of those companies and many others make midlength 16" setups. (Note: many people refer to all AR pattern rifles as carbines, while other people specifically mean the gas system length and handugards featured on the M4, CAR-15 and XM177 when they say "carbine" in the AR context.)
 
jpg19 said:
what advantages does a carbine length system have?
Click to expand...
it's common so there's a lot of support for it but it's true home is in SBRs like the xm177 and car-15 it originated from.

good barrel lengths are like this
carbine 11.5 to 12.5 (10.5 if there's a suppressor)
mid-length 14.5-16
rifle 18-20
 
Why not a smith and wesson?

attachment.php
 
Of those, I'd prefer the Spikes, but I'd personally go with a midlength gas system (better fit with the 16" barrel, better handguard length, longer sight radius).

My own AR is a Rock River midlength, but it required some final assembly steps that the factory neglected (gas key screws weren't properly staked, castle nut wasn't staked). I enjoy it, but if I were to do it over again, I'd probably go with a BCM midlength upper and avoid the hassle of fixing those oversights.
 
I'm pretty much new at this myself, but I voted Spikes. After reading a ton of info on various forums, from your choices Spikes is definitely the way to go. I'd look into BCM or Daniel Defense too. For my first AR, I chose to build my own. I went with a Spikes stripped lower and BCG, an LMT upper, a DD Lower Parts Kit, a BCM charging handle, and MOE handguard/stock/grip/BUIS. I love the gun and it was a great experience researching the parts and assembling it.
 
Thanks guys for all of your input. I definitely want a mid-length gas system, and embarrassingly enough, had forgotten about that decision (made months ago when I first started looking into AR's) when I started shopping around again. I don't necessarily have anything against the M&P 15, although it looks to have a "carbine" gas system which would nix it from my list of options. Daniel Defense is far out of my price range, as I promised the old lady to stay around a grand, if not less.
 
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