Bear Attack Victim: I wish I had a gun

[Alaska444]

Incredible story of a one year bear cub that attacked a mother and two children. The woman had bear spray which did not deter this young bear:

"It was kind of trotting around me, and then it would charge and growl," said Jones-Robinson, an English professor at the University of Alaska Fairbanks. "It charged, and I used my bear spray when it was about four feet away and then I fell with my pack on and dropped the bear spray."

Read more: http://www.seattlepi.com/news/artic...ng-ordeal-with-bear-3707497.php#ixzz20eC0iwhF

The most interesting aspect of this encounter is the woman's statement at the end of the news account:

It was a terrifying escape for Jones-Robinson and her nieces, who were visiting from Washington state.
"All I could think about was this bear is so close to me I can see its teeth," she said. "I could have kissed it. I wished I had a gun."

Read more: http://www.seattlepi.com/news/artic...ng-ordeal-with-bear-3707497.php#ixzz20eCFB5mE

Wonder if this failure of pepper spray will make the scientific stats. I guess we could chalk it up to the macaroni and cheese bear defense.

 

[Chevelle SS]

My Dad ALWAYS has his 44 Redhawk when he is in the woods. I usually carry a sidearm when hunting.

 

[xerxesthecat]

I like the story Jeff Cooper used to tell about the hikers wearing bells to alert bears of their presence. The assumption being that the alerted bears would amble off (being the peaceful, sensible, violence-abhoring teddy bears that we have been told they are) without confrontation. Cooper's story ended with a line about park rangers finding bells in bear droppings, and I agree that if I was headed back to bear country, I wouldnt want to go with anything less than my high cap 10mm.

 

[Rail Driver]

Personally, if I'm hiking in bear country, I'm gonna be carrying my Mosin/Nagant M44. Not only is it stout enough to take down a bear at pretty much any reasonable range, it's also got a nice long bayonet for if I run out of ammo, and makes a decent walking stick if necessary.

 

[rcmodel]

I prefer an old friend, older and more crippled then I am.

I can probably outrun him, but I can't outrun a bear.

rc

 

[paintballdude902]

both then i can throw the bear spray, shoot it and hopefully get rid of the bear. if it doesnt then i can shoot the bear

 

[goon]

From what I've heard, having both might not be a bad idea.
But to me the gun would be a necessity.

 

[hogshead]

You could carry a 22 and shoot him in the knee.

 

[firesky101]

I don't think you will have too many on this forum that would vote to be near a bear without a gun. FWIW I carry my 7.5" 44Mag redhawk with me in the woods, and there has not been grizzly in these parts for a long long time.

 

[Lost Sheep]

Incredible story of a one year bear cub that attacked a mother and two children. The woman had bear spray which did not deter this young bear:



Read more: http://www.seattlepi.com/news/artic...ng-ordeal-with-bear-3707497.php#ixzz20eC0iwhF

The most interesting aspect of this encounter is the woman's statement at the end of the news account:



Read more: http://www.seattlepi.com/news/artic...ng-ordeal-with-bear-3707497.php#ixzz20eCFB5mE

Wonder if this failure of pepper spray will make the scientific stats. I guess we could chalk it up to the macaroni and cheese bear defense.

Sobering. Thanks for posting, Alaska444

It is easier to miss with a gun than with bear spray, though at 4 feet it seems unlikely missing with either. I wonder what strength of spray, whether it did actually hit the bear in the face and how much was spent (before Ms Jones-Robinson dropped it).

Certainly having a gun as a backup to the spray would have enabled her to kill the bear, but, as it turned out, it would have saved only her pack and car keys, certainly not worth the trouble of following through her duty to preserve the skull and cape and turn it over to the State of Alaska (required under Alaska law for DLP shoots).

I look forward to reading more detailed reports in my local media.

As far as how this incident will be counted in the Bear-Human encounters, I will venture to guess it will probably be chalked up as "successful" unless the person compiling shows some judgement. That is, (a) no human injury bear (b) spray used (c) no firearm used. Though, from the (very short) testimony of Ms Jones-Robinson, the spray actually failed.

But as long as I am speculating, I wonder if shooting the bear (one-shot instant kills are rare in DLP situations) would not have brought the mother bear onto the scene.

By the time the locksmith showed up, I wonder if Fish & Game would have gotten there, too, properly equipped to defend against the bear. I would have gone back for my keys (which would hold little interest for the bear when a nice, juicy backpack was available to chew on).

As far as the bells are concerned, Brown Bears usually only attack when surprized or threatened. Letting them know you are coming will usually cause them to quit the area (unless they are protecting a kill or cubs). You take the best odds you can get. If you are in the woods birdwatching or just to enjoy the quiet, you probably don't want to wear bells anyway.

Lost Sheep

 

[Lost Sheep]

both then i can throw the bear spray, shoot it and hopefully get rid of the bear. if it doesnt then i can shoot the bear

Bears can run 35 mph over uneven ground. By the time you have determined that it is not a bluff charge, you have about 10 yards maximum to try the "throw the can and shoot it".

Do the math. At full speed a bear will cover 40 feet in less than one second. So, if you are surprised by a bear you don't have much time to react.

The more likely scenario is that the bear sees you and issues a challenge, giving you time to pick a defense. Backing away is usually best.

The MOST likely scenario is that you never know the bear was there unless you smell him.

Lost Sheep

 

[MachIVshooter]

I prefer an old friend, older and more crippled then I am.

I can probably outrun him, but I can't outrun a bear.

^^^^^^^^

This. You don't need to be faster than the bear, just faster than the other guy. lol.

In all seriousness, bear attacks, like all animal attacks, always make the news big time, so the threat is blown out of proportion. The reality is that fewer than 3 people are killed by bears annually in North America. Total human deaths in North America is about 2.8 million per year. So, quite literally, one in a million people is killed by a bear.

This doesn't mean I don't think a defensive weapon is a good idea, and I'd certainly carry one in bear country. But I do believe it's over-thought; The other things that present a much more significant deadly threat should be given appropriate consideration before worrying about hostile Ursidae. Man is THE apex predator, and all higher animals seem to know this and almost always avoid us, bears included. Once in a while, predation gets reversed, and it really sucks if you are that unlucky one in a million. But don't overthink it and/or overburden yourself with gear and weapons worrying about it to the point that you may subject yourself to a more likely fatal event, such as falling down a mountain because all your gear was too heavy and threw you off-balance.

 

[Alaska444]

Thanks Lost Sheep, but the issue of limited response time affects guns and deployment of pepper spray equally. In that situation, if you don't have someone to rescue you, playing dead is your only option but that is a 50-50 proposition. Not the kind of odds you want.

 

[bushmaster1313]

Cooper's story ended with a line about park rangers finding bells in bear droppings,

Sad but funny

 

[JTHunter]

Does anybody have any idea of the effectiveness of spraying the spray at the bear while firing 1 or 2 shots in the air to intimidate the bear?
If that doesn't work, you still have 4 shots to put in the bear.

 

[Alaska444]

Today, 09:47 PM #17
JTHunter
Member

Join Date: July 24, 2010
Location: Southwestern Illinois
Posts: 410
Does anybody have any idea of the effectiveness of spraying the spray at the bear while firing 1 or 2 shots in the air to intimidate the bear?
If that doesn't work, you still have 4 shots to put in the bear.
__________________
“Crime is to be expected since humans are never perfect. But the failure of Justice may be more damaging to Society than the crime itself.” - - Clarence Darrow

If the pepper spray is effective, you are doing aversion therapy for the bear which may teach them to stay away from man. If the pepper spray does not work, you are two shots fewer in your arsenal against the bear.

 

[Onward Allusion]

Carry both. It's not like you are required to carry just one.

 

[Alaska444]

Today, 10:06 PM #19
Onward Allusion
Member

Join Date: March 22, 2009
Location: IN
Posts: 1,801
Carry both. It's not like you are required to carry just one.
__________________
"With great power, there must also come great responsibility." - Stan Lee

"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke

Absolutely, since neither guns or pepper spray is 100% effective, that is my strategy as well. Since my wife cannot handle the recoil of any gun that is effectively lethal against bears, she has the pepper spray, I have the gun. Maybe not the "best" strategy, but it does give us dual options if we have enough time to react. If I go down, my wife still can protect me with the pepper spray and vice versa.

Other observational data shows avoiding dense brush and having 4 or more in a party is effective at avoiding bear attacks. Multiple layers of defense and good bear sense with campgrounds goes a long way. Unfortunately, nothing is 100% effective.

 

[Bobson]

I've never been sprayed with bear spray, but I have had direct eye exposure to OC rated at 2 million Scoville Heat Units - which is the most "powerful" pepper spray available to law enforcement - during my department's academy. I confess that it was the most painful experience of my life, but add that it took a solid ten minutes for the me to feel the full strength of the OC. Furthermore, I was absolutely able to function at nearly full capacity for some time following the direct exposure, as we were required to conduct specific tasks for the 60 seconds immediately after being sprayed.

I have very little confidence, if any, in any type of chemical agent being able to stop any mildly determined animal in the event of an attack.

I vote gun - no contest whatsoever.

 

[Texan Scott]

<--- just idly wondering about hollowpoint cavities filled in with habanero pepper paste... and garlic, because if I had to eat a bear, hot peppers and garlic sounds good right about now.

Of course, this requires a gun, but - why NOT both?

 

[BADUNAME37]

...hollowpoint cavities filled in with habanero pepper paste...why NOT both......

I would think that would make the wound-channel much more painful!
Good idea!

 

[Salmoneye]

The MOST likely scenario is that you never know the bear was there unless you smell him.

I've smelled them twice before I saw them...

Rank wet dog is all I can equate it to...

 

[EddieNFL]

The reality is that fewer than 3 people are killed by bears annually in North America.

Insignificant statistic...unless you're one of the three.

Gun.

 

[Reloadron]

Years ago I would extensively hunt deer in West Virginia with a friend of mine who lived there. One year I found a nice spot up from a river and parked my butt as my friend went further up the mountain. I caught movement in a large patch of hemlock expecting my 8 point giant WV deer.

This black bear walks out maybe 20 yards in front of me sniffing. Got up on the hinds and sniffed more, looked at me and just wandered down towards the river. Back then I carried a Ruger Model 44 Carbine I wish Ruger still made, along with my S&W Model 29 (Thank You Elmer Kieth).

That bear had no interest in me nor me in him.

Here in Ohio the black bear population is growing as they migrate in from PA. The only time I guess they get aggressive is if you get your ass between a mother and her cub(s) which is expected.

Whenever I am out and about in the woods my Model 29 is my best friend and travel companion.

Problem being is the bear and coyote population never read the book as to how they are supposed to behave and I am in their home.

Ron

 

[hardluk1]

First thing I see wrong here is it was a 100 to 200lb grizzly??? Really. And then when she did deside she needed her bear spray she said she tried to spray it at a distance of 4 feet?? It sounds like she was so under prepared she is lucky it was not even the avergae sized black bear much less a grizzly of any size.. BUT maybe she did get some spray in the bears eyes and that saved her from atleast getting chewed or slobbered on a bit.

IT would have been helpfull for her to atleast had the spray out and ready to use at 25 feet or so. Would still think if she had a gun she would have dropped it or she would have shot herself our someone other than the bear. If your going for a walk in black bear country ,a handgun should serve to protect ,should.

In grizzly country I will carry a slug gun, not a handgun but still have some bear spray. I do believe that if a healthy grizzly wants you it more than likely will get you so the rifle maybe way more usefull at shopping the bear from mauling how your with.