Best drop in ar15 trigger?

[Llama Bob]

One nice thing about the triggers that come in a housing is that their sear engagement is not dependent on the hole spacing of the lower. Not all lowers are perfect, and pin holds wear over time.

 

[Welding Rod]

While not as well known or talked about, Wilson's triggers have them all beat.



Truly "drop-in", built like battleships, ultra-safe, zero creep, crisp & clean breaking with a tactile and audible as well as excellent reset, zero overtravel. I have shot a lot of different high-end triggers and Wilson triggers are what are in my personal rifles. At about $270, they ain't cheap. I have the TTU-M2 as well as the TTU-MIL trigger.

There is a TTU trigger for any need or application:

I like these too. I now have several of them, though I have been using the same one almost exclusively for a few years now in my competition gun.

I like the M2 (2-stage) trigger feel, a lot. Reasonably short take up, very crisp, short over travel, with good reset. I also shoot Garands and M1As so I appreciate a uniform type of trigger pull (2-stage) in my rifles.

I have also tried a couple of the 3-gun units (3G) and I found I did not like the characteristics of the trigger pull as much. It is easier I think to shoot the M2 fast than to shoot the 3G with high precision.

The only aftermarket 2-stage AR triggers I have tried to compare the TTU M2 to is RRA's. I have owned about a dozen of those. The TTU is arguably a more precise pull, but the RRAs are pretty darn good too.

However I like the TTU as it looks like it has been built to outlast the rest of the gun. The construction is very beefy, very precise, and it doesn't rely on the trigger pin holes in the lower for accurate alignment of the trigger components.

Wilsons has them on sale once or twice a year for about $215 bucks. Usually once on Black Friday, and then some other time of the year I think.

 

[Coal Dragger]

Don't buy junky cheap lowers and you won't have that problem.

Admittedly I am an AR snob who only buys rifles that meet the TDP for the M4 (minus the full auto trigger pack and 14.5" bbl), or exceed it.

On that same note I'll give my vote to buying a Geissele Automatics trigger as your best bet for a reliable drop in trigger for an AR. Geissele is the only aftermarket trigger manufacturer to my knowledge to make a drop in trigger group that is safety certified by the Crane Naval Surface Warfare Center. Thus they make the only trigger groups that are authorized for the M4 SOPMOD program.

For a general purpose trigger on an M4 with a carbine length gas system I'd say it will be tough to beat the Geissele SSA, SD-C, or Super Tri-Con. These are all two stage trigger with a total pull weight of 4.5lbs. I hesitate to recommend a lighter trigger in a carbine length gas system because the carbines tend to be over gassed a bit resulting in faster bolt carrier speeds and more recoil forces to the rear, and then due to a higher buffer tube spring weight higher forward bolt carrier speeds on bolt closing. This results in more fore and aft movement, and can result in unintentional doubles with too light a trigger or one with too short a reset. Which is another reason the two stage trigger is preferred here as a more forgiving and safe trigger to use under stress.

The less bouncy gas systems you can probably run a Geissele SSA-E, SD-E, or even a High Speed national match trigger. Again all two stage triggers in the 3.5lb range, and all of them possessing the .mil certified sear geometry and parts quality that means a safe durable trigger group.

The last is the Geissele SD-3G, this is the Geissele single stage trigger. I had one in a Colt M4A1 SOCOM II (civilian version with the DD RIS II rail, and medium contour M4A1 barrel), and it was not safe. The reset is crazy short, and the trigger pull is 3.5lbs. Even maintaining a solid hold in the pocket of my shoulder the rifle could bounce back enough to reset the trigger and then trip it again from inertia as the bolt carrier group closed. I had to consciously smash the trigger and hold it down to the rear to prevent this. Not exactly good for deliberate shooting, but great if you want to hose down targets in a 3 gun match, which is what the trigger is designed for. I should have paid attention to the Geissele video on what this trigger is meant for. At any rate the super short reset triggers with low trigger pull weights have no place on a carbine length gas system weapon, and probably are totally inappropriate for a weapon that is anything but a range toy/race gun. I will note that my SD-3G trigger worked safely and perfectly when combined with a mid length gas system, and I acquired a Daniel Defense DDM4V11 PRO with an SD-3G in it that has also been perfect, but it is a very smooth rifle length gas system. I'll be changing out the SD-3G for an SD-C, or an SD-E here soon since I strongly prefer the more predictable feel of the two stage trigger.

For those who scoff at the notion of a two stage trigger being what you want in a fighting carbine/rifle I submit this from Pat McNamara, who has vastly more experience than I do or probably any of us at showing up at the appointed time and place to shoot savages in the face:

https://www.facebook.com/AliasTrain...472294.43053.197061490420046/355644741228386/

I do know that during my time in the USMC both stateside and in Iraq, I would have loved to have an issued service weapon with a Geissele two stage in it.

 

[Creature]

A two-stage is not really needed for a battle rifle.

 

[Whiskey11]

2 stage, single stage, doesn't matter what a military rifle needs so long as the troops can be trained to shoot them well enough to satisfy the brass. And yes, every single one of those rifles had them because the US built rifles that for their time emphasized shooter comfort and accuracy. That changed in the late 60s when long range accurate fire turned into spray and pray in the jungles of Vietnam.

 

[HKGuns]

That statement right there makes absolutely zero sense to me.

Most fighting rifles have two stage triggers. Period, end of story. If you don't understand then that is your problem.

Since the OP didn't state his intended use or preference a two stage might not be appropriate.

Move along if you still don't understand.

 

[agtman]

I have the National Match 2-stage from Rock River Armory in both of my ARs. It came in the first gun and I liked it enough I installed one in my other rifle. I find it very predictable and easy to shoot accurately. As a bonus it's less expensive than most other offerings.

"Less expensive" = cheap junk. That's the best thing you can say about an RRA NM unit.

Understand I'm not saying RRA's ARs are junk, just their NM trigger. It's junk, get rid of it.

 

[Coal Dragger]

Yep the RRA NM two stage is a garbage trigger. They are notorious for dropping their 2nd stage.

 

[HKGuns]

Yep RRA is the one you read about crapping out all the time. Timney's have failed as well.

G-triggers are a very safe bet at this point.

 

[Creature]

That statement right there makes absolutely zero sense to me.

Most fighting rifles have two stage triggers. Period, end of story. If you don't understand then that is your problem.

Since the OP didn't state his intended use or preference a two stage might not be appropriate.

Move along if you still don't understand.

I have been a member of this forum for a long time. It's a shame that long time member like yourself as well as newer members have fallen into the trap of incivility that so permeates and defines the digital generation.

Perhaps you think you are entitled.

How about you actually explain why most "fighting rifles have 2-stage triggers" and why it makes sense that they do...instead of chest thumping?

 

[HisStigness]

I have a Geissele SSA-E in my AR 15 and a Hi Speed National Match in my AR 10. They work.

 

[tuj]

you ask the best?

There is only one. Geissele hi-speed national match. Lock time is close to a bolt gun. 2-stage adjustable.

Others may disagree, but Tubbs AFAIK won national matches with this trigger. I love mine.

 

[SwampWolf]

QUOTE: "...I have the National Match 2-stage from Rock River Armory in both of my ARs. It came in the first gun and I liked it enough I installed one in my other rifle. I find it very predictable and easy to shoot accurately. As a bonus it's less expensive than most other offerings..."

I agree with Rittmeister. And I've pulled the trigger on mine at Service Rifle matches for a long time without any problem. I love this trigger.

 

[adcoch1]

X2
what you plan to use the rifle for determines whether you even need a drop in high expense trigger.

Long distance bench rest precision? Ok. Pick one.
CQB with a 10.5" barrel? Don't bother, there's no advantage and a light pull is even dangerous working in close proximity to team members or in direct contact with aggressors. By direct think shoving the muzzle brake into their face. You don't want a 2 pound trigger doing that.

Choosing the associated parts for a weapon starts with cartridge, to get the power and range working most of what is needed. That sets barrel length, the gas length, what optic, then a forearm, then a trigger. It's down the list - not unimportant - but definitely a much lower priority. It only enhances the potential accuracy, if needed, of the cartridge and barrel doing the selected task. It does nothing to improve things if the shooter lacks the skill to finesse it or the typical use situation doesn't fit it in.

Watcha gonna shoot is important.

I am going to build a lower for target/varmint hunting and some walk around hunting. Not competitive shooting or combat, i just want a light,quick reset trigger. I like quality, and i don't mind paying for it if the dollars are justifiable, but i commonly build better stuff than i can buy. Good advice on here... thanks guys.

 

[adavison64]

I like the CMC Triggers out of FT. Worth Texas. Very crisp, plus they are made right here in God's Country.

 

[adcoch1]

Heard a few good things about CMC, might have to try them out. Got a specific model in mind?

Sent from my LGLS740 using Tapatalk

 

[Rittmeister]

Please elaborate on the RRA 2-stage being a problem. This is the first I'm hearing of this. Both of mine are still running fine; admittedly I don't shoot thousands upon thousands of rounds.

 

[WVsig]

Please elaborate on the RRA 2-stage being a problem. This is the first I'm hearing of this. Both of mine are still running fine; admittedly I don't shoot thousands upon thousands of rounds.

They have a rep of wearing out faster than other 2 stage triggers as others have noted they tend to drop their 2nd stage. I have read reports of it happening as soon a a few hundred rounds. Most people believe it is a matter of when not will it happen.

I like the Geissele SSA but I sort of had to go that route because my older Colt had the large pins so there were not as many options out there for me.

I recently ordered a LaRue MBT-2S with the long shipping time frame. It drops the price down to about $125. I am not in any rush to put it into my BCM so I don't mind waiting. They are on par with the Geissele as about 50% of the price if you are willing to wait.

http://www.larue.com/larue-tactical-mbt-2s-trigger

If you have to have it now check around you can often find Geissele's on sale. 10%-20% off.

 

[agtman]

I recently ordered a LaRue MBT-2S with the long shipping time frame. It drops the price down to about $125. I am not in any rush to put it into my BCM so I don't mind waiting. They are on par with the Geissele at about 50% of the price if you are willing to wait.

Just got my second MBT-2S at the price-point you mentioned.

Trust me, not only is it well worth the wait, it's certainly as good a trigger as what the SSA costs (of which I have several) ...

Bottom-line: For $125, you will NOT be disappointed; in fact, you'll soon be ordering another one.

 

[Casefull]

I think it is silly to put a $200 trigger on a $500 rifle. Of course the companies that make them are doing very well. If you compete then go for it. If you smooth out your "cheap" trigger and keep at lubed with high quality moly grease you will most likely be happy with it.

 

[WVsig]

I think it is silly to put a $200 trigger on a $500 rifle. Of course the companies that make them are doing very well. If you compete then go for it. If you smooth out your "cheap" trigger and keep at lubed with high quality moly grease you will most likely be happy with it.

Who said anything about $500 rifles? When I hear these types of comments I wonder if the poster has ever handled a high end trigger. I understand they are not for everyone and that there the law of diminishing returns in play but they are better than stock triggers. IMHO

 

[Rittmeister]

Thanks for the info.

Now, what does it mean to "drop the second stage" of the trigger?

 

[HankB]

I put a Jewell 2 stage trigger in my 1st AR and like it a lot - it's set too light for "service rifle" competition, but I don't care about that at all. Several thousand rounds and never a problem.

Also have an RRA NM trigger in a mid-length carbine I built. Not as nice as the Jewell, but again, several thousand rounds without a hint of a problem.

Both are far, FAR better than a USGI-type "standard" trigger.

 

[nerfsrule2]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vvr0rSaFgZE

geissele super dynamic 3 gun trigger

 

[nerfsrule2]