California: Banning lead and requiring microstamping since 2007

[Green Lantern]

Lets make sure the rest of us boycott any gun manufacturer that DOES retool their factories ... if enough of them comply with this there will be nothing to stop them from spreading this crap coast to coast.


That and there has to be a way to kick Arnie out of the GOP.

ACTIVISM time? Put ALL gun-makers on notice, right now, that they're facing a boycott from the 49 FREE states if they go along with this insanity???

And maybe Arnie will do like Bloomberg and leave of his own accord?

 

[TexasRifleman]

Besides its not who makes one. If a company wants to make one you need to make them aware of what you will do.

I hate seatbelts, should I boycott Chevrolet because the DOT required them to put seatbelts in cars?

Blaming a company that's in business to make money because they are obeying the law where their product is sold just doesn't make any sense.

Angry? Good! Take it out on someone that is responsible, not on someone that's stuck with it. I promise you the gun makers hate this more than you do, it's gonna cost them a fortune.

 

[zxcvbob]

A proper response is for gun owners to immediately start the process going for a recall election. Also perhaps a referendum to overturn this stupid new law. Recall elections, and intiatives and referendums are easier to do in CA than in most states.

It would also help if gun manufacturers announce that they will not sell any guns to police unless they also have the microstamping. (I haven't read the law, but thse things *always* exempt the police)

Bob

 

[bumm]

TexasRifleman was saying
>Blaming a company that's in business to make money
> because they are obeying the law where their
> product is sold just doesn't make any sense.
>Angry? Good! Take it out on someone that is
> responsible, not on someone that's stuck with it.
> I promise you the gun makers hate this more than
> you do, it's gonna cost them a fortune.

And if the manufacturers have any sense AT ALL, they'll look past what they might make selling weapons to California law enforcement in the short run, and simply refuse to do business in California.
Marty

 

[only1asterisk]

Gun and ammo makers will have to decide what is in their best interest. While a short term gain might be had by submitting to CA's foolishness, to do so only hastens the end.

Take it out on someone that is responsible, not on someone that's stuck with it. I promise you the gun makers hate this more than you do, it's gonna cost them a fortune.

It will cost them 2 fortunes if they go along. I think a smart businessman can do that math.

David

 

[Mokothar]

So, MP25's just become even more disposable right?

How long until people stop building drug labs, and start pumping out sten gun analogues? Those cost $6 to make in a civilian shop in WWII. Gotta be a market for those once legal supply dries up ...

 

[kludge]

Instead of boycotting gun makers, why don't we just boycott California instead?

Then they won't need any illeagals to pick the fruit and vegetables.

Two birds, one stone.

From now on it's only Florida/Texas Oranges and Grapefruit for me.

 

[Deavis]

Maybe there is a way not even thought of yet where a maker can meet this portion of the law easier than retooling their entire manufacturing plant and keeping this for CA destined handguns only. Car makers do it with emissions stuff.

Even if they could, do you really want them to? There are some problems that aren't worth the time to find a solution and this is one of them.

 

[Michael Thomson]

Where the hell was the N.R.A. on this? Are they too busy licking the stamps from membership dues to even care or at least pretend to to get involved with whats going on in California? Maybe the N.R.A. washed their hands with California a long time ago and this bill was ripe for the taking as there would be no oppositon, or at least a token one from the political pro-gunners.

A simple search of NRA-ILA's website will give you numerous posts about this bill and other bills in CA. http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/State/Specific.aspx?st=CA

Here is a copy of NRA's letter to the Governor in late Sept. http://www.nraila.org/media/PDFs/ca2007_AB1471.pdf

I don't live in California so I don't know who NRA mailed regarding this bill but mailing every member when many probably live in districts represented by avowed anti-gunners seems like a waste of money to me. Rather than mailing members in districts represented by gun banners, I would hope they would target their resources on affecting the positions of legislators who hadn't already made up their minds to support the microstamping bill.

 

[ArmedBear]

Yeah, but he was during the Davis recall. That's when he should have been elected. For what it was worth (moral victory) he got my vote.
But the Republican heirachy was pushing Arnold because he was an "electable Republican". Uhhh, does this sound familiar?

If you read the rest of my post, it was Tom who made himself unelectable, over an issue that he, as governor of a state, would have no jurisdiction over.

I was pissed off at him then, and I still am. Nothing matters in politics unless you win.

I still think he's a good guy, one of the few.

 

[Zundfolge]

I hate seatbelts, should I boycott Chevrolet because the DOT required them to put seatbelts in cars?

We're talking about 1 state, not the federal government (and we're trying to prevent the entire nation from going the way of CA).
To complete your seatbelt analog; they forced manufacturers to put the seatbelts in the cars LONG before they started forcing us to wear them.

Maybe there is a way not even thought of yet where a maker can meet this portion of the law easier than retooling their entire manufacturing plant and keeping this for CA destined handguns only. Car makers do it with emissions stuff.

Emissions stuff bolts on to the motor after assembly. Your analogy would be fine if you were talking about things like magazines and muzzle brakes.

The big logistical problem with microstamping guns is that you have to keep the frame, firing pin and extractor together throughout the manufacturing proccess ... as it is now, the frames are assembled in one stage and the firing pins and extractors are in big bins and they grab them as they assemble the slide without worrying about firing pin #xxxx getting mixed up with extractor #yyyy for frame #zzzz.

The parts themselves aren't all that expensive (and honestly its the little hand-built gun manufacturers that could more easily comply with this loony law). Its the massive slowdown and significant increase in labor and part tracking that are prohibitively expensive. I would honestly expect semi auto handguns to double in price if we all had to buy microstamping guns.

Of course this doesn't address the massive problem of replacement parts. You're going to have to custom order your firing pins and extractors. No more breaking a part, running to the gun shop, buying a replacement, popping it in and getting back to the range that afternoon ... now you have a part break you'll have to send the gun back to the factory where they will replace the part with a properly numbered one. So a $5 firing pin replacement just went up to $50 to ship the gun and another $100 for parts and labor.

And all this for a system that will probably not solve one single crime that wouldn't otherwise be solved.

 

[Blackfork]

This isn't about safety or criminals

This is about destroying the gun culture and it's a significant step down the road to getting that done.

 

[Zundfolge]

Yeah ... I know ... but they sold it on the promise of "solving crimes".

 

[eliphalet]

I won't buy Ben and Jerry's ice cream because of their stance on gun control and really like that Cherry Garcia. Other company's products are avoided too. So from now on anything that comes from California and I know it that can be bought from another part of the country I will. Pretty simple for me.
If I wanted to see Disney it's off to Florida, if I want to warm up in the winter Arizona is as close to me as CA. the Oregon coast is a nice place to see the ocean, it can be real easy.
I write letters I have made phone calls I do my own boycotts, NRA life member. I know for the most part I stand alone but that is OK too. I will continue to do my or what I feel is my part, small unnoticed or not.

 

[Grey54956]

Boycotting CA products may make some sense, but I have a better way to strike back against the lead ban. Boycott hunting in CA.

California, like any other state, needs hunting license fees to fund conservation efforts. So, a boycott on hunting in CA will deprive them of this source of funding. In addition, boycott any and all CA state parks. If you must camp or hunt, go to AZ or OR instead. Once funding dries up, parks are in desparate financial need, and coyote populations are through the roof, CA will have to bend on the issue.

 

[SuperNaut]

Boycott hunting in CA.

I really like this idea. It would also affect outfitters, guides, and retailers as well. If we could only wake up the Ducks Unlimited and Sierra Club fudds in CA.

 

[JoshM]

For the Microstamping legislation to even have a chance at working it is going to need an effective registration database in place first.

Considering Canada's* problems, with a registration database, this is a major hurdle by itself, and this is before the separate Microstamping field/requirements are included.

My understanding is that a registration database of firearms owners is prohibted under the FOPA 1986 (at least at the Federal level) ? With that in mind can pressure be applied to squash Federal funding to this project ?

* - I reckon the NRA/etc should get a hold of the footage of RCMP officers having to admit to a Canadian Parliamentary committee that the long gun registry was useless as a crime fighting tool. That should make interesting watching for long suffering CA taxpayers.

 

[Librarian]

For the Microstamping legislation to even have a chance at working it is going to need an effective registration database in place first.

Already here. Since 1990, all firearms transfers (except some C&R) have had to go through a California FFL, and the dealer must file a Dealer's Record Of Sale (DROS) with the state (in addition to the dealer-retained Federal 4473). The handgun version includes serial number, make and model; long guns do not.

 

[Novus Collectus]

People have mentioned the idea of criminals picking up empties at the range and throwing them around crime scenes. Well it is possibly worse than that when criminals catch on to this and start doing that in other states and some poor California gun owner gets investigated at the other state's invesigating cost and ATF trace cost expense.

 

[Surefire]

Companies can still see brand new models to CA LEOs after 2010, without microstamping IIUC.

These LEO exemptions are elitist in nature. I think any company that sells non-altered new model guns to CA LEOs should be boycotted.

 

[Mokothar]

Couldn't somebody sue the Californian police departments for reckless endangerment, seeing as they're sending officers out on the streets armed with what are legally considered "unsafe" guns?

Frankly, I'd like to see a lot of trigger happy officers limited to revolvers.