bdickens
Member
Same outcome.
No it isn't.
If you're going to die anyway, you might as well do so with some honor and dignity.
Same outcome.
Or as a wise man once said, "If I'm going to Hell, I'm bringing someone to hold the door for me."No it isn't.
If you're going to die anyway, you might as well do so with some honor and dignity.
What on Earth has led you to that idea?No disrespect but some of you folks ought not even bother carrying a gun because it doesn't sound like it would do you any good in ANY circumstance, because you'd be too busy going over things in your head for it to be of any use.
No disrespect but some of you folks ought not even bother carrying a gun because it doesn't sound like it would do you any good in ANY circumstance, because you'd be too busy going over things in your head for it to be of any use.
That applies to every potential use of force encounter.My sense is if one finds himself/herself being ordered to kneel down by a criminal gunman and even contemplates for a brief second "what will a jury think of how I defend myself" there is too much brain clutter.
Yep. Should be "programmed". Do what is necessary timely, and do no more.That kind of decision should already be sorted by now, way far in advance of such situation presenting itself.
The video I posted simply mentioned looking for opportunities, and the manner in which you can do so, to look for cues of when there might be an opportune moment to defend yourself should you be caught in such a situation.
, or other "opportune moments to defend yourself" to look for? Are there scenarios and tactics that you have...shift those odds a bit more to your own side...
beyond those already discussed?“wargame[d]”
It seems as of late that robbers plan to shoot https://www.cbsnews.com/chicago/new...the-city-at-least-12-reported-monday-morning/Luzyfuerza's excellent post addresses very well how one might try a counter ambush. It is consistent with, and as I recall, expands upon, what Massad Ayoob has said.
I would no doubt look for the opportunity, but I would be unlikely to try shooting unless my judgement at the time indicated the risk of compliance to be higher.
In most robberies, including car-jackings, we see the perp departing without shooting. If he sees the victim reaching for a weapon, we can surely expect him to shoot when he might not have done so but for the attempted resistance. It's a gamble either way.
It would be naive to think that the question is one of whether or not the defender can expect to get off a shot first. The question is whetter the defender can prevent the robber from shooting. That's not the same thing.
Certainly not a basis for sound risk assessment, by any means.It seems as of late that robbers plan to shoot https://www.cbsnews.com/chicago/new...the-city-at-least-12-reported-monday-morning/
And why is that? Because "most" criminals don't act that way? A dangerous assumption to make in my opinionCertainly not a basis for sound risk assessment, by any means.
Good way to get shot.From most all I've read, the general consensus is if somebody pulls a gun on you, you shoot.
That assumption is the basis for the justification of deadly force.I'm of the mindset that if you pull a gun on me, you intend to take my life....
It means avoiding getting killed.I intend to defend my life, which means taking yours as quickly as possible.
I'm of the mindset that if you pull a gun on me, you intend to take my life. I intend to defend my life, which means taking yours as quickly as possible.
Yes, I assume that if I gun is being pulled on me, I'm about to be shot. And yes I plan to avoid being killed, which means killing my attacker. I'd rather be fighting for my life in a hospital than dead on the street. Could I have possibly complied, handed over my goods, and the perp run away? Sure..but I'm not going to assume that.Good way to get shot.
That assumption is the basis for the justification of deadly force.
It means avoiding getting killed.
Why would you ever think so?And yes I plan to avoid being killed, which means killing my attacker.
I practice for the most likely scenario, which means less than ten yards. I'm quite confident at those distances. My place of work would be the highest chance of needing to defend myself, and that distance would be much like the scenario in question...over the counter. I had to fight off this drugged up woman one time haha she was planning to stab me with a broken bottle, so I'm confident in my ability to assess the risk of a situation..nobody was hurt that night, and I hope that girl is okay, she was just a young college kid. I also know that I've had customers leave my store, and then go shoot at somebody behind the building less than 5 minutes later. I'm not rolling the dice on my life.How fast can you draw from concealment and make good hits?
Why would you not? A dead attacker means the risk has dropped to 0. Zilch, nada, threat eliminated.Why would you ever think so?
So, the OP has said that he posted this video to start a discussion about opportunities to counter ambush during armed robberies like the one in the video. And techniques to use.
We've discussed some possibilities above.
Are there more ways to , or other "opportune moments to defend yourself" to look for? Are there scenarios and tactics that you have beyond those already discussed?
Here are a couple that come to mind:
If an armed robber demands your wallet, phone, or keys, nervously fumbling with and dropping them while obviously complying (oh, I'm so sorry, I'm so nervous!) might distract the BG enough for you to initiate a counter-ambush.
Or fumble taking cash out of your pocket or wallet and allowing it to scatter out a little bit.
Instead of letting your phone drop right in front of the BG, nudge it just a little to one side, a foot or two away from him. Maybe to his gun side?
At short range, train to move quickly to one side or the other (ideally toward cover?) while drawing. A moving target is harder for the BG to hit.
When a BG takes the gun from one hand and puts it in the opposite hand or puts his gun down completely (say, to pick up money), this is a hard go signal. Observing malfunctions, slide locks, mags falling out, etc., are also go signals.
Coordinate beforehand with loved ones to fall to the ground if being held as a hostage while standing. Agree on a phrase, word or signal that triggers this. Decide on the conditions in which you will consider it (e.g. defender has gun drawn and on target, BG's gun is not pointed at hostage). Nobody wants to put a bullet right past a loved one's ear if they don't have to.
Where do you train to focus your attention during an armed robbery? On the BG's gun? His trigger finger? His eyes? His head?
Our brains react more slowly to external stimuli when we are talking. Especially when we're answering a question. How do you train to get a BG talking? What questions do you ask?
How do you practice hiding competence behind a facade of compliance or terror?
How do you practice to disguise your draw?
What have you wargamed? In your experience, which of these works? Or doesn't work? What have you been trained to do?