Concealed Carry during the GRE (graduate record exam)
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Five of Clubs
Member
Look, I understand that I'm sounding argumentative. My real desire is to understand the idea that carrying to the GRE is any different than CCW anywhere else. What better place to have that debate than here?
Uh, so much for encouraging people to exercise their rights here. Why carry to a GRE? Why carry to a movie theater? Why carry to a park, with your kids, to the mall, to the grocery store, to yoga? Some people carry everywhere they can as that's a way to be prepared in case they get attacked.
Just curious which people you are referring to.
The administrators of the building who have clearly laid out they do not wish firearms on their property? Or the OP who has decided his right trumps theirs?
I feel that as even though the OP has finished the test, as long as we remain civil, the discussion remains on topic. The OP was required to be in an area that he did not feel comfortable in, an area he described as dangerous. He was legally allowed to carry into that area but the people in charge would prefer that he did not. In what way are the wishes and concerns of the OP less valid than those of the owners of the test site?The OP made it sound like he would not be at that place at all had he not been forced to for the test. Sounds to me like the perfect place to carry.
So the owners of the test site would prefer he did not carry there but it's not as if they would have been able to protect him had he actually needed his gun. Places aren't any safer just because the owners don't allow guns on their property.
So the owners of the test site would prefer he did not carry there but it's not as if they would have been able to protect him had he actually needed his gun. Places aren't any safer just because the owners don't allow guns on their property.
I'm not going to get into a property rights fight about this - each of us needs to decide that for ourselves and is the subject of a different discussion. My comment was in reply to those who basically thought the idea of carrying to a GRE so silly in the first place (ie, if you feel in danger enough to need to carry, you shouldn't be there in the first place, etc).
1KPerDay
Member
Good thing you aren't, then, huh. Talk about a power trip.
Thank goodness you are not a moderator then because a lock would be uncalled for, and a ban would be absurd. Not everyone is cut out to be a moderator, and by the reaction in your post, that certainly applies to you.
It is clear that not everyone thinks like one another. I can see multiple problems with him not seeing the big picture (focusing on passing the exam), and instead worrying about getting in, not being detected once in, etc.
As someone else astutely pointed out, if the area is that dangerous, choose a different location to take the exam. There is no logical reason one would voluntarily put themselves into harms way if it could easily be avoided.
That was a concern of his. Since a weapon was presumably prohibited at the test location, he was inquiring about the legality, and what procedures they might use to search someone.
Refer to my second reply in this post.
Aside from what has already been stated, how productive would it have been to be thrown out of the exam upon discovery of a firearm? Furthermore if he was worried about it being discovered and the possibility of him being thrown out, he is obviously not focused on the important task at hand.
What "right" does the location have to deprive the OP of his ability to defend himself? His state already recognizes his right to carry the means for protection. Lots of folks "wish" no-one ate meat. Plenty of folks "wish" violence did not happen in the world. Millions of Americans "wish" to convert me to their religion.
So what?
The important thing is to behave ethically and legally, and the OP would have been doing both. Whether the area was dangerous enough to warrant bringing defensive weaponry is something else altogether, but you're waaaaay off base.
John
postalnut25
Member
I'm glad you took it and I hope you did well. I'll be doing the same thing soon. When I'm at home, The Auraria Campus isn't too bad. It's the light rail ride in that bugs me and would make me carry. The south line gets a little shady at Evans, and north of campus evry stop bugs me, but the campus itself isn' too bad.
So you think its ethical to disobey the wishes of a person or property holder? By what method do you arrive at this conclusion? It appears as if you are stating that a property owner has no rights.
Your analogies are off, as the wishes you describe are not practical nor enforceable. A more accurate analogy would be someone declaring themselves a vegetarian and someone else putting meat into their food because they don't believe man was made to ignore flesh.
The OP made a choice to visit someone else's location, for a voluntary exam that could be conducted elsewhere.
I guess to some rights are only worth fighting for or enforcing/ethical if those are rights they support. Any other rights are moot. Gos'ta gets mine, yo!
ny32182
Member
Test administrators don't own the school. 
Their personal "wishes" would not enter into my consideration.
That said, if I thought there was the slightest chance I could get searched and DQ'd from the test, I would leave the gun at home and focus on the test.
Their personal "wishes" would not enter into my consideration.That said, if I thought there was the slightest chance I could get searched and DQ'd from the test, I would leave the gun at home and focus on the test.
Test administrators don't own the school.
I agree with you here. If it was simply the administrators not wishing weapons when the campus allowed them, I wouldn't have an issue.
The OP stated the campus also prohibited weapons.
hardworker
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As the OP can see, the outcome of such actions is not well understood. Therefore, you're left with two choices: Leave the pistol at home, or carry it and see what happens. Don't be surprised if the second option ends badly.
Old Shooter
Member
That would seem to be the bottom line. Our previous decisions and suggestions are moot. It's your career path, educational goals and future that are on the line. If you carry and are not found out, no big deal. If you are "caught" (mayby by printing or a high riding shirt) it's your future that is impacted, not mine. I wouldn't risk it for one days carry but then I've never been accused of being the brightest bulb on the tree either.
ljnowell
Member
No more wrong then demanding he surrender his right to self defense.
Five of Clubs
Member
Vector - Well done sir! You just made a lucid and reasonable argument. I obviously don't agree with you, but that is completely beside the point. We have used this forum to debate a topic. My basic take is this: If it's legal, go ahead and carry. Your basic take is: In this case, the stakes of getting caught are a little too high. Neither of those arguments is unreasonable. And to think, people thought we couldn't keep this on the high road!
Regarding the property rights stuff, I have a simple way of determining whether I ignore the "no guns" signs. If I am entering a place that wants to sell me a service or a product, then I don't don't accept that I have to check my rights at the door. They have essentially created an open invitation for all-comers by unlocking their door every morning. To me, this would include the GRE testing service.
However, if my neighbor invites me to dinner, and if they were anti-gun, I'd never carry into their home. I can't think of an additional example like this, but basically I would respect the rights of the property owner under these special and personal circumstances. I have no doubt this reasoning is flawed, but it's just how I approach these situations. To be clear, I would never carry anywhere that it is illegal.
Regarding the property rights stuff, I have a simple way of determining whether I ignore the "no guns" signs. If I am entering a place that wants to sell me a service or a product, then I don't don't accept that I have to check my rights at the door. They have essentially created an open invitation for all-comers by unlocking their door every morning. To me, this would include the GRE testing service.
However, if my neighbor invites me to dinner, and if they were anti-gun, I'd never carry into their home. I can't think of an additional example like this, but basically I would respect the rights of the property owner under these special and personal circumstances. I have no doubt this reasoning is flawed, but it's just how I approach these situations. To be clear, I would never carry anywhere that it is illegal.
Thank you, and I concur that civil discussions of differing views can occur here if the moderators would only allow them. Sadly it has been my recent experience that few if any of these types of discussions are allowed to come to a natural conclusion before the thread get locked.
I'd be tempted to discuss this issue as well, but I've found that it guarantees that the thread will be locked as it has happened way too often for my taste. The Disney World example is a good place to use a comparative analogy, but the mere mention of it sets some admins/mods off the deep end and they shut it down.
Geeze...is there REALLY a need to carry EVERYWHERE you go?
Why would you potentially jeopardize admission to a school of your choice, by choosing to carry a firearm in a relatively safe and secure environment? The GRE test providers clearly prohibit firearms; state law may very well allow you to carry, but that doesn't prevent them from putting a notation in your record that says you violated THEIR testing center policies. Is is worth it?
Why would you potentially jeopardize admission to a school of your choice, by choosing to carry a firearm in a relatively safe and secure environment? The GRE test providers clearly prohibit firearms; state law may very well allow you to carry, but that doesn't prevent them from putting a notation in your record that says you violated THEIR testing center policies. Is is worth it?
xcgates
Member
Can you guarantee that I won't need it? Why wouldn't you carry if it were legal?
::EDIT:: Sure I don't need a pen everywhere, but I do carry one everywhere, unless I'm in workout clothes.
Where in the rules did it prohibit firearms? And I'm sure many people where someone threatened them, though they were previously in a rather safe environment.
It is a simplistic analogy, and I will need a pen far more often than a gun, but in general, the consequences could be much more severe if I were in want of a pen.
::EDIT:: Sure I don't need a pen everywhere, but I do carry one everywhere, unless I'm in workout clothes.
Where in the rules did it prohibit firearms? And I'm sure many people where someone threatened them, though they were previously in a rather safe environment.
It is a simplistic analogy, and I will need a pen far more often than a gun, but in general, the consequences could be much more severe if I were in want of a pen.
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The GRE prohibits firearms in its testing centers. The OP's state seems to nullify the testing center's laws. I doubt that prohibits the GRE from making a notation in his file saying "yeah, this guy violated our rules and brought a firearm into the testing center."
The point is that you don't have to carry a firearm EVERYWHERE you go; it is unnecessary. The OP should be more concerned about the probability of him getting hit by a car on his way to the testing center, than having to use his firearm to defend himself.
That being said, I wish I had the opportunity to carry; even then, there I would respect a PROPERTY OWNER'S wish, if he didn't want his invitees to carry firearms.
oneounceload
member
seems some folks need to loosen their over-tight tinfoil hats...........he should have left it at home or in his car and focused on his test while respecting the rights of the property owner
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