Considering a progressive press.

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CrankyCraig

CrankyCraig

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My wife and I shoot around 600 rounds of various calibers a month average sometimes a lot more.

I’m currently reloading 45, 45 Colt, 40 S&W, 9mm,380 38/357. All on my Lee Classic Turret press. I have all Lee Dies and auto drum powder measures. They work really, Really well for me. However , I’d like to be able to produce more ammo in less time but I’m not sure what would work with Lee dies?

I’m not really keen on having to buy new dies and I really enjoy my AutoDrums.

Any suggestions ?
 
I'm happy enough with my Lee Pro 1000s that I have two of them-- one for large primer, one for small. I used a Lee turret for several years, and the output increase is astonishing. There are a bazillion videos on how to set them up and tear them down, and there's a monster thread of tips and tricks for them right here on THR.
 
CrankyCraig said:
All on my Lee Classic Turret press. I have all Lee Dies and auto drum powder measures. They work really, Really well for me.
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I still use a Lee Classic Turret press for the rounds that I only need a hundred or so at a time. For .380, 9mm, and 45acp I switched to a Hornady auto progressive. It is way faster even though I still prep my brass and store it away to load later. Lee dies work great with the Hornady die bushings. Switching things around is super-fast. And if you like the auto drum powder measures, you will love the Hornady. When I bought it, I thought I was going to get a case feeder later. So far, I like it just the way it is. It’s a great upgrade from the Turret press.
 
Lol I see were this is gonna go quick.

The dies and powder dispensers can be used on more than just lee presses.

Some key info we need.

Budget.
Mechanical ability
Wants in production per hour
Wants in switchover time
Wants in number of die stations
Want case or bullet feeder?
Are there outlets near by loading station?


Awnser those questions and we can move forward.

If you want an idea of what we are all using.
I have a lee loadmaster for my loading. I have also loaded on a LNL. Not impressed with them. I have a dillion 550b. I do not use as it's a bit slow for me. Also have a 1050 not set up yet mostly due to cost of adding all my calibers. All presses can be made to work well.

Maybe another option is to look at inline fabrication and speed that turret press up a bit.
 
I went through this 18 years ago when I started shooting 200 rounds a week at a range. The Rock Chucker could do it but I was spending 2 to 3 nights a week doing it. I decided it was time to move to a progressive press at this point. But, which one? I had no experience with anything other then a single stage press. I had all the dies for what I was reloading and didn't want to invest in new dies. This eliminated the Dillon Square Deal.

So, I looked at what was out there and started talking to owners of those presses. I passed on a turret press as they are just a more efficient single stage. With a progessive you can create a finished cartridge with each pull of the handle. I talked to owners of Lee, RCBS, Hornady and Dillon.

The Lee owners told me that they spent more time tweaking their presses then reloading. The primer system just didn't work to well on the Lee. Out of 10 owners 5 told me to go with Dillon.

RCBS was tough, I only found 3 people loading on RCBS progressives. All 3 told me the press was good but said they would rather have something else. Hated to pass on RCBS as I always had such good luck with their equipment.

Hornady LnL owners pretty much didn't complain. But they told me there were some quirks like a spring that held the cases in the shell plate had malfunctions and the powder drop and case flare took 2 stations (Dillon did this in one station). Hornady later combined the stations like Dillon but the press owner had to pay for the upgrades. The other weak link was finished bullets not ejecting from the shell plate. Hornady later upgraded the shell plate but once again at the press owners expense.

Dillon press owners had the least complaints of all. Their presses were the most expensive but I heard no complaints. Out of 10 owners only 1 told me he hated the Dillon and wanted a LnL.

I went with Dillon and ordered a 550b. The learning curve was very short and I found myself cutting the reloading time from 2 or 3 nights a week to just a couple of hours.

I kept the 550b for 2 years. What no one warned me about was powders to use on a progressive press. Not all powders give good results. I used to load a lot of Unique at the time. For some reason I started seeing squibs. Took me a while to figure out why but I managed to trace it back to Unique powder clumping in the powder measure. One solution was to add a powder check die that would warn me if a case was empty or over charged. The 550b only had 4 stations and I was using all of them. For this reason I sold the 550b and moved to a 650xl. The 550b is a good press but it needs something to warn you if a case is empty. This is the only flaw I found with this press.

The only other thing I'll mention is you have to have some mechanical ability to run a progressive press. You don't need to be a master mechanic but from time to time you need to adjust things or take them apart for cleaning.

The above is from my experiences with learning about progressive presses and running them over 18 years.
 
all of the brands mentioned..unless i missed one...will work with Lee dies.
With the Dillon presses, you need changeover kits for each diff. caliber,and that can add up to serious coin. Some do interchange, but it's still going to add up .

..any brand you pick will have a learning curve,but the ability to produce mass ammo at a sitting is a real treat.
 
I'll give you an objective review as best I can as a Hornady LnL press and why I recommend them overwhelmingly if you get them for the right price. THE TRICK IS to stack discounts on Cabela's and you can get them for dirt cheap. What I did was buy a bunch of gift cards for 10-13% off in sites like giftcardzen. ( If you a super patient, you can sometimes find them for 20% off). Likewise, wait till a veteran or Memorial Day sale when Cabela's discounts them 10% of as well. Then you sign up for activejunky.com which usually gives 8-12% off (usually more during Cabela's holiday sales). Also if you military, Cabelas does an additional 5% off on top of any sale they are having.

Anyways, if you read all that, my price came out to like 43% off the total retail price. Which was a steal, so of course I loaded up and all Hornady products are well worth it at that price.

Now, on to the press itself. Yes, if you spend a lot more on a Dillon, it's like an Apple computer, it will just work. But you are going to pay a premium. Between my Hornady LnL Press and Case feeder. I spent probably about 2-3 hours on tuning it in and getting it working great. You will have to buy a few 3D printed mods like I did to get the press working better. Similary, I did have to Dremel the sub-plate to get the shell plate from shaking every time it indexed (which is a well known mod for the press, not just some **** I made up on a whim)


So yes, the LNL is well worth it, expect a few hours to tune it in, but if you can get it at the price I did, you will be more then happy with it (ESPECIALLY if Hornady is still running their free bullets rebate.)
 
I have Dillon 650 with case feeder and 4 Lee Pro 1000 set up for dedicated calibers. I also have Lee Classic Turret, 2 C-H "H" type presses, Herters turret and C-H 205/RCBS RS5 single stage presses.

I reload 380Auto/38Spl/9mm/40S&W/45ACP/45LC currently and have been spoiled by dedicated Pro 1000 set ups as I simply walk up and add powder/primers/cases to start reloading. For high volume pistol caliber reloading, it's hard to beat the Pro 1000.

For several years, I have used Pro 1000s to load almost all the test rounds for various load developments and range comparison test threads on THR (C-H 205 single stage was used for reloading rest of test rounds).

Why?

- With Pro Auto Disk, I can meter most powders with .1 gr variance (W231/HP-38, etc.), many powders with less than .1 gr variance (Titegroup, etc.) and some powders like Sport Pistol with less than .05 gr variance

- I can obtain OAL/COL variance average of less than .005" with many bullets and less than .003" with RMR FMJ bullets

AZAndy said:
happy enough with my Lee Pro 1000s ... there's a monster thread of tips and tricks for them right here on THR.
Click to expand...
While many will post Pro 1000 is "finicky" and troublesome with primer attachment requiring much "tinkering", various THR Pro 1000 owners have come together and "managed" to work out the issues and smoothly operate our Pro 1000s in this support thread - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...lutions-no-bashing.507454/page-3#post-7877744

Here's a step-by-step Pro 1000 set up (with my PM help) out of the box by a THR member who never used a Pro 1000 before (and won bullseye league with match loads loaded on Pro 1000) - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/preventing-pro-1000-set-up-problems.761231/

Pro 1000 reloading check list with QC checks - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...lutions-no-bashing.507454/page-6#post-9614898
 
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I went through this a few years ago and went with the LNL AP. I have not had many issues with it and any problems were easily solved. it has actually taken some of the fun out of reloading because it is so quick, one three hour session and I have enough ammo for a few months. regrettably I don't shoot as much as you do, about 2k pistol and 1500 rifle a year.

the deciding factor for me was the cost per caliber for the dillon units. I read up on them, went so far as to start budgeting for it, but when it came down to ordering, I got my LNL setup for less that $450 including shell plates for all calibers I load. I already had dies like you, so the only thing needed for each caliber to load is a $30 shell plate where the dillon units are $50 for the 550 series or $80 for the 650's.

I don't think you will regret blue or red, they will both work. I have no experience with the dillon powder dispenser, but the hornady one does everything I could ask from it. it does not do well with powders lie 4064 or varget (long stick powders) but bullseye, autocomp, BE86 and many of the rifle powders I have used work very well. they work well enough that I when I weight the powder from every 50th-100th round they are within the .1g tolerance of my scale.
 
If you love to tinker and have a rock solid bench, you might be happy with the Lee. I wasnt., But maybe I'm just getting old and fussy.
 
Point_Taken and Linux Mint, nice write ups! That's what people need to see when they start thinking about buying a progressive. I think I spent 6 months talking to owners of progressives to get a picture of what the quirks are and the good points of each brand.

You need to look at customer service and user groups too. I had questions on my 550b when I first got it, things that no one told me. Some other things to know are make sure the press is mounted securely or you'll have primer problems. What I thought was secure in reality wasn't, I had primers seating upside down and side ways because the press moved while in operation. The second thing is keeping it clean. Knocking out primers causes grit to find parts of the press that don't like dirt, like the priming system. I try to clean mine about every 2k of cartridges produced.
 
Here is my two cents.
Go with the Dillon 650 if you have the coin. I have one with the case feeder and like it best.
Go with the Hornady LNL for a little less cash outlay. I never had the case feeder for it so I can't comment on that. It's good but Dillon is best.
If money is tight Lee is the choice but I used to have to fiddle with the primer feed on mine. Perhaps it's been improved since I started with the Lee 30 years ago. I still use lots of Lee reloading stuff but sold off the Progressive 1000 a couple of years back.
Just my .02 YMMV
 
joed said:
nice write ups! That's what people need to see when they start thinking about buying a progressive. I think I spent 6 months talking to owners of progressives to get a picture of what the quirks are and the good points of each brand.
Click to expand...
Thank you.

My reloading mentor was a bullseye match shooter and trained me to reload on Dillon 550 and Lee Pro 1000. Both presses produced accurate match loads which he used to shoot sub 2" groups at 25 yards out of his match pistols. I chose the Pro 1000 due to automatic index and shot USPSA matches producing 2" groups at 25 yards with my pistols - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...ts-and-discussions.778197/page-6#post-9924922

solman said:
I started with the Lee 30 years ago. I still use lots of Lee reloading stuff but sold off the Progressive 1000 a couple of years back.
Click to expand...
solman, I have reloaded a lot of rounds on several Pro 1000s (several hundred thousand rounds) and helped set up new reloaders on Pro 1000s successfully without the "dreaded" primer feed issue. As well illustrated in the THR Pro 1000 support thread, there are some considerations to make Pro 1000 operate smoothly and reliably - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...lutions-no-bashing.507454/page-3#post-7877744
  • Fiocchi, PMC, Tula and other "Metric" sized primers won't seat as reliably as CCI/Magtech/Winchester "English/Standard" sized primers. These "Metric" primers in once-fired or tighter primer pocket cases like 9mm S&B/RWS are especially problematic. If swapping out primers with CCI/Winchester primers fix primer feeding/seating issue, problem is not with primer attachment but primer brand used.
  • Pro 1000 center hex rod (Lee calls it "action rod") MUST BE lubricated for smooth reliable index operation of shell plate which also extends the life of the small nylon hex gear (a consumable item that must be replaced when worn or shell plate won't index properly). I usually put a drop of oil (any that I have on the bench or motor oil I use for cars) on my finger tip to lubricate the top and bottom of hex rod and cycle the ram lever until indexing of shell plate is smooth.
  • Shell plate index timing not properly adjusted is primary cause for primers not feeding and seating reliably on a new Pro 1000. Shell plate should click into station before carrier reaches the bottom of the ram travel.
  • Powder granules falling into the primer attachment opening on top is second common cause for primers not feeding and seating reliably on a new Pro 1000. A simple cover made from paper or plastic to catch the powder granules will prevent this problem.
  • Primer seating rod not dropping all the way down is third common cause for primers not feeding and seating reliably on a Pro 1000 (which is caused by powder granules falling into the attachment opening and falling around the seating rod). If primer tilts on the rod, bottom of shell plate will rub on the tilted primer and won't index properly (See picture below). If force is applied on the ram at this point, tilted primer will gouge the primer attachment surface and subsequent primers won't slide smoothly.
Primer tilting on seating rod that did not drop fully due to fallen powder granules at the bottom of the seating rod hole.

index.php


Primer fed properly without tilting from seating rod dropping fully below attachment surface

index.php


  • Gouged primer attachment surface is common cause for primers not sliding smoothly to feed and seat reliably. Gouged surface can be "burnished" with folded copy paper after attachment is carefully pried apart. If gouge/damage to the attachment surface cannot be repaired by "burnishing" with folded copy paper, the attachment needs to be replaced for reliable sliding of primers.
These are the "tinkering" I have done with Pro 1000 primer attachment which resolved the "finicky" primer feeding issue every time provided shell plate was installed tight and primer attachment was kept full of primers.

We have had several THR members use the Pro 1000s out of the box and by following the check list we developed have consistently avoided the "dreaded" primer feed issue. Unfortunately, many reloaders start out on progressive reloading on Pro 1000 lacking experience/patience and are quick to blame the press when it was operator unfamiliarity with press or operator error.
 
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sbwaters said:
Which Hornady 3D MODS? Purchased where?

Thnx.
Click to expand...

3D Black cat works and some stuff on ebay, just search Hornady LnL on ebay and some stuff will pop up. Most of it was for the case feeder though. The only thing that is better aftermarket (and on ebay) is the primer arm. The cheap one they send you breaks to easily.
 
Twenty years ago I was in the same boat, just with a Lee Deluxe 3 hole turret. I went with the Dillon 550b because I didn't want the headaches I was hearing of with other presses. I am still using the 550 for pistol ammo, I think I will wear out before it does. You can use Lee dies, but it is smoother with the Dillon dies, so over the years I have switched to Dillon dies for volume pistol cartridge loading. I am pretty sure you have better choices today, than I had back then, but I am glad I went with the Dillon. I still have and use the Lee turret press, now thirty four years old. These can be lifetime investments for some of us, so you might spend a bit more on something that will stand the test of time.
 
Some of your cartridge usage might not be worth the changeover effort, especially small caliber to large caliber or vice versa. I use my Hornady for the high volume stuff and run enough to be worth the setup, for example a whole box of 500 bullets. To do that, you have to own the brass. Lower volume stuff or misc loads gets done on the turret.

addendum: I should add that my context is having a case feeder, while not always an extra set of dies to use just on the AP. If the settings work great on the turret, I would be reluctant to reset the dies to the AP. So, owning the dies is part of it, else it adds to the setup time, often the most troublesome..
 
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I have a Dillon 550c. Not as fast as a 650 Dillon or Hornady LNL but caliber changes are quick and easy. Since it does not have auto index there are no timing issues. One of the downsides of a 550 is that it is 4 stations and not a station for a powder check die. I have my 550 setup so I can visually check each powder charge. Something I would do anyway even if I had a powder check die.

I never primed on any press until I started using my 550. The priming set up works very well.
 
For 45ACP my choice was between the Loadmaster or a Pro 1000

Priming on the top of the stroke on the Loadmaster, when everything else is going on, would seem to take the feel out of priming, and affectively using up a station over any other press that primes on the bottom and expands/powder drops on top at the same station.

That leaves the comparison between a "4 station" Loadmaster verses a 3 station Pro 1000.
I've loaded a lot of quality handgun ammo before Lee convinced everyone they needed a "factory" crimp die as a 4th die.

You can see where I'm going here and chose the Pro 1000 over the Loadmaster with the bonus of a $75 savings.
I have nothing but success with the Pro 100 thanks to all the info posted here on THR.
And if I ever do have a problem the answer can be found on THIS forum by simply asking :thumbup:

Regretfully, I have not seen the Pro 1000 sold without the dies or powder measure, components the OP already has :(
:D
 
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RealGun said:
Some of your cartridge usage might not be worth the changeover effort, especially small caliber to large caliber or vice versa. I use my Hornady for the high volume stuff and run enough to be worth the setup, for example a whole box of 500 bullets. To do that, you have to own the brass. Lower volume stuff or misc loads gets done on the turret.
Click to expand...
bds said:
I have Dillon 650 with case feeder and 4 Lee Pro 1000 set up for dedicated calibers. I also have Lee Classic Turret, 2 C-H "H" type presses, Herters turret and C-H 205/RCBS RS5 single stage presses.

I reload 380Auto/38Spl/9mm/40S&W/45ACP/45LC currently and have been spoiled by dedicated Pro 1000 set ups as I simply walk up and add powder/primers/cases to start reloading. For high volume pistol caliber reloading, it's hard to beat the Pro 1000.

For several years, I have used Pro 1000s to load almost all the test rounds for various load developments and range comparison test threads on THR (C-H 205 single stage was used for reloading rest of test rounds).

Why?

- With Pro Auto Disk, I can meter most powders with .1 gr variance (W231/HP-38, etc.), many powders with less than .1 gr variance (Titegroup, etc.) and some powders like Sport Pistol with less than .05 gr variance

- I can obtain OAL/COL variance average of less than .005" with many bullets and less than .003" with RMR FMJ bullets


While many will post Pro 1000 is "finicky" and troublesome with primer attachment requiring much "tinkering", various THR Pro 1000 owners have come together and "managed" to work out the issues and smoothly operate our Pro 1000s in this support thread - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...lutions-no-bashing.507454/page-3#post-7877744

Here's a step-by-step Pro 1000 set up (with my PM help) out of the box by a THR member who never used a Pro 1000 before (and won bullseye league with match loads loaded on Pro 1000) - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/preventing-pro-1000-set-up-problems.761231/

Pro 1000 reloading check list with QC checks - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...lutions-no-bashing.507454/page-6#post-9614898
Click to expand...
the auto disk is not bad at all but I like the Auto Drum better will it work on the 1000?
 
solman said:
Here is my two cents.
Go with the Dillon 650 if you have the coin. I have one with the case feeder and like it best.
Go with the Hornady LNL for a little less cash outlay. I never had the case feeder for it so I can't comment on that. It's good but Dillon is best.
If money is tight Lee is the choice but I used to have to fiddle with the primer feed on mine. Perhaps it's been improved since I started with the Lee 30 years ago. I still use lots of Lee reloading stuff but sold off the Progressive 1000 a couple of years back.
Just my .02 YMMV
Click to expand...


The lee is way better than thet. Id say better than the LNL. Also above a 550b per dollar
 
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