I kinda wish Glock would make their barrels have fully supported chambers. My 23 has a TIG welded feed ramp and is physically impossible to blow up now with the powders I use, and it's just as reliable as it was before. They don't need that shallow of a feed ramp angle.
Glock 23 kB on film
- Thread starter longwatch
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Flaming aside, some people have good luck with Glocks and some don't. That goes with any gun whether it's a Glock or 1911. My experiances with the Glock plain and simply suck while I never had a problem with any 1911.
Throw a handfull of mud in a SKS and see if it works, bet it doesn't.
Throw a handfull of mud in a SKS and see if it works, bet it doesn't.
Slvr Surfr
Member
Phenom, give up please. If you dont have anything usefull to contribute, dont contribute at all. We all know how pointless it is to argue on the net. 
In my experiance I have never seen any glocks KB. My dept. uses Glock 22 .40 cals. My second gen G22 looks like it has been put through the washer and dryer . Not a lick of paint left on the damn thing. I have personally put approximately 10http://www.thehighroad.org/images/smilies/smile.gif
k rds through her and not one malfunction to date. I cant tell you how many rounds were put through her before I got my hands on her. Ive never heard of any other glocks in the depts KB either. If you use good quality ammo, youll probably never see a KB. That video in my opinion dosnt tell us anything. We have no idea what ammo was used, or the condition of the weapon after. That guy had all five fingers after he tossed the gun. If the glock KBd it did its job of containing the blast. Id buy another just based on that! U own 5 other glocks not including the duty G22 and I trust all of them. I will continue to buy more as well, Wallet permitting ofcourse !
In my experiance I have never seen any glocks KB. My dept. uses Glock 22 .40 cals. My second gen G22 looks like it has been put through the washer and dryer . Not a lick of paint left on the damn thing. I have personally put approximately 10http://www.thehighroad.org/images/smilies/smile.gif
k rds through her and not one malfunction to date. I cant tell you how many rounds were put through her before I got my hands on her. Ive never heard of any other glocks in the depts KB either. If you use good quality ammo, youll probably never see a KB. That video in my opinion dosnt tell us anything. We have no idea what ammo was used, or the condition of the weapon after. That guy had all five fingers after he tossed the gun. If the glock KBd it did its job of containing the blast. Id buy another just based on that! U own 5 other glocks not including the duty G22 and I trust all of them. I will continue to buy more as well, Wallet permitting ofcourse !
Maybe you ought to watch your ass.
Phenom, we try to have better manners than that at THR. I understand its easy to start flaming somebody when you think they are dead wrong. I've done it myself. But this kind of comment is not welcome here.
-David
Phenom, we try to have better manners than that at THR. I understand its easy to start flaming somebody when you think they are dead wrong. I've done it myself. But this kind of comment is not welcome here.
-David
Isn't that what I did with post #52. David, I have somewhat of a short temper when it comes to men. This doesn't mean I would a attack a guy without a very good reason. I never knew that I had a had short temper towards men until a woman brought it up.
swampgator
Member
Actually that is NOT the case. When I worked for a state agency I had, in hand, a teletype via NCIC from an agency (in Georgia IIRC) that was sent Nationwide reporting a catastrophic failure of a Glock 23. I actually thought about posting the teletype on here but a coworker thought I shouldn't since it would probably violate our user agreement with FBI.
Needless to say a lot of LE Agencies know about the Glock issues.
1 LT MPC
Member
Quote:
Needless to say a lot of LE Agencies know about the Glock issues.
And yet they still use them by the scads!!!
Needless to say a lot of LE Agencies know about the Glock issues.
And yet they still use them by the scads!!!
defiant73a
member
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Yep. It's just Gus Grissom said, "Just think, it's all built by the lowest bidder."
That being said, there have numerous catastrophic failure incidents of Glock .40 S&W (and .45 ACP) reported over the NCIC. It is not exactly an uncommon occurrence.
I think you can say with some degree of accuracy Glocks tend to have trouble with the .40 S&W (and .45 ACP) to a greater extent than many competing models. I doubt if that difference is large enough to be considered significant (and evidently none of the failures has resulted in an LEO being killed or injured during a gunfight).
The .40 S&W is a very unforgiving round. I am afraid the Glock does not necessarily handle marginal rounds as well as some other designs do. In other words, if everything is well within specs, the Glock should be fine, but if anything gets just a little out of spec, the Glock does not have the reserve of strength to handle it (where competing models like the 4006 do).
That being said, there have numerous catastrophic failure incidents of Glock .40 S&W (and .45 ACP) reported over the NCIC. It is not exactly an uncommon occurrence.
I think you can say with some degree of accuracy Glocks tend to have trouble with the .40 S&W (and .45 ACP) to a greater extent than many competing models. I doubt if that difference is large enough to be considered significant (and evidently none of the failures has resulted in an LEO being killed or injured during a gunfight).
The .40 S&W is a very unforgiving round. I am afraid the Glock does not necessarily handle marginal rounds as well as some other designs do. In other words, if everything is well within specs, the Glock should be fine, but if anything gets just a little out of spec, the Glock does not have the reserve of strength to handle it (where competing models like the 4006 do).
Research and take it easy!
Wow, religious. But really, take it easy.
There are some key features to the fairly well documented KB problem. Start by reading TheGunZone's FAQ on Glock's and KB's. It's fairly well documented and researched.
Some important conclusions for those who don't want to RTFA:
The vast majority of Glock .40 KB's come from handloads that maybe got a little too spicy. Mostly not a problem even with handloads for 9mm and .45's.
Second: Combining handloads with a chamber that is not fully supported is basically the issue. If you're paranoid, or really want to shoot hot handloads, slap a fully supported barrel from Barsto or somebody. Problem solved.
Every maker has KB's, especially with hotter loads. Glock has some 65% of the LE market, and probably a good chunk of the consumer market. With those absolute numbers, you're bound to hear more about Glock KB's even if the KB's per 100 or whatever probably are pretty low.
If you're really paranoid, get a Sig or H&K that does have a stock fully supported chamber. No need to get angry. They all work pretty well.
Noops
Wow, religious. But really, take it easy.
There are some key features to the fairly well documented KB problem. Start by reading TheGunZone's FAQ on Glock's and KB's. It's fairly well documented and researched.
Some important conclusions for those who don't want to RTFA:
The vast majority of Glock .40 KB's come from handloads that maybe got a little too spicy. Mostly not a problem even with handloads for 9mm and .45's.
Second: Combining handloads with a chamber that is not fully supported is basically the issue. If you're paranoid, or really want to shoot hot handloads, slap a fully supported barrel from Barsto or somebody. Problem solved.
Every maker has KB's, especially with hotter loads. Glock has some 65% of the LE market, and probably a good chunk of the consumer market. With those absolute numbers, you're bound to hear more about Glock KB's even if the KB's per 100 or whatever probably are pretty low.
If you're really paranoid, get a Sig or H&K that does have a stock fully supported chamber. No need to get angry. They all work pretty well.
Noops
Seven High
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- 755
FWIW The Indiana State Police recently got rid of their Beretta 96s for Glock 22s, then dumped the Glock 22s for Glock 17s. The Glock 22s had predictable malfunctions of failure to feed.
swampgator
Member
Never said they didn't use 'in scads'. The post I quoted said 'never had a problem' I showed a case where one agency did. AND sent out national notification to other LE agencies.
defiant73a
member
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- 84
We'd all do well to remember Glock's reputation for reliability and durability were established with the Glock 17. That reliability and durability does not hold true for all Glock models (particularly the .40 S&W and .45 ACP models).
das028
Member
"We'd all do well to remember Glock's reputation for reliability and durability were established with the Glock 17. That reliability and durability does not hold true for all Glock models (particularly the .40 S&W and .45 ACP models)."
Ignorance
Ignorance
defiant73a
member
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Ignorance to ignore the fact you mean. The .40 S&W Glocks in particular have proven to have an extremely short service life (durability) compared the 9x19 Glocks. Ask the Illinois State Police how long their G22s lasted before they started having reliability problems with them.
das028
Member
I agree, that its service life is not compared to a 19 or a 17. But to call them un reliable, come on! I willing to bet that a Glock 19 or 17 cant be beat by any pistol manufactorer in terms of service life.
EDIT:
Thats why I own a 19
EDIT:
Thats why I own a 19
defiant73a
member
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I didn't call them unreliable. I said they have not proven as reliable as the G17. They haven't (and neither has the G19 for that matter). I think you may have fired out of battery.
Texshooter
Member
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- Jan 22, 2004
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- 481
When, oh when, will shooters learn of the dangers in limpwristing?
Perfection means just that, PERFECTION.
Oh the humanity.
Perfection means just that, PERFECTION.
Oh the humanity.
das028
Member
"I didn't call them unreliable. I said they have not proven as reliable as the G17. They haven't (and neither has the G19 for that matter). I think you may have fired out of battery. "
Ok, gotcha, my bad for jumping to conclusions. Actually in my opinion there is not a gun that exists that is more reliable then the G17. I'd be willing to bet that the G19 is equal though.
But on that note, there is nothing wrong with the rest of the glock lineup, and I wouldnt hesitate to grab any glock model in a time of need
Ok, gotcha, my bad for jumping to conclusions. Actually in my opinion there is not a gun that exists that is more reliable then the G17. I'd be willing to bet that the G19 is equal though.
But on that note, there is nothing wrong with the rest of the glock lineup, and I wouldnt hesitate to grab any glock model in a time of need
brownie0486
Member
My experiances with the Glock plain and simply suck while I never had a problem with any 1911.
You had one glock that you could not make run right with ammo changes only and gave up. I know of at least 300 1911's that didn't run right when new and the people had them FIXED till they did run. They didn't stop till the gun was fixed. They didn't turn tale on the 1911, tell everyone they were pieces of crap and go to another weapon platform. They knew enough about the 1911 to stay with it till the problems were fixed and went on to cherish their 1911's.
My first Colt 1911 purchased in 1972 [ yup, a series 70 some 34 years ago ], would not function with aything but ball ammo. If I had decided right them to give them up as pieces of crap [ the 1911 design ], I'd have not gone on to own over 25 of them in the next 34 years and still own several of them today.
It's quite one thing to relate a problem with a weapon [ any weapon ], and quite another to then state to the world that because you had a problem with one gun makers model, they s##k as a whole.
Throw a handfull of mud in a SKS and see if it works, bet it doesn't.
Have you ever owned an sks sir? It doesn't sound like you have from your statement above.
The sks is a battle proven design that predates the AK and has at least the same reputation of reliability as the AK under the same adverse conditions. The AK only replaced the sks for it's ammo capacity capabilities, not for lack of reliability or dependability in any way.
I've seen SKS's and AK's dug up out of caches in the ground unprotected, out of muddy, silty river banks, that were loaded with one in the pipe. ALL of them would fire when the trigger was pulled. The AK has nothing on the SKS except ammo capacity and ease/speed of reloading.
I've also seen AK's that had their handguards burned off them from sustained rates of fire from multiple magazines. You'll not see any SKS in that condition though for the sole reason you can't reload it fast enough or long enough to burn the wood off of them.
In fact, the SKS is more accurate as ranges tend to get past 250 yds as it has a longer barrel [ hence a longer sighting platform ] thus producing higher velocities and less "drop" of the bullet at extended range.
Short temper aside sir, I enjoyed the back and forth/give and take here with you. It's always a pleasure to debate a subject with anyone when I have first hand knowledge through multiple examples and experiences with a particular weapons platform, over the last 35+ years, to do so.
Brownie
You had one glock that you could not make run right with ammo changes only and gave up. I know of at least 300 1911's that didn't run right when new and the people had them FIXED till they did run. They didn't stop till the gun was fixed. They didn't turn tale on the 1911, tell everyone they were pieces of crap and go to another weapon platform. They knew enough about the 1911 to stay with it till the problems were fixed and went on to cherish their 1911's.
My first Colt 1911 purchased in 1972 [ yup, a series 70 some 34 years ago ], would not function with aything but ball ammo. If I had decided right them to give them up as pieces of crap [ the 1911 design ], I'd have not gone on to own over 25 of them in the next 34 years and still own several of them today.
It's quite one thing to relate a problem with a weapon [ any weapon ], and quite another to then state to the world that because you had a problem with one gun makers model, they s##k as a whole.
Throw a handfull of mud in a SKS and see if it works, bet it doesn't.
Have you ever owned an sks sir? It doesn't sound like you have from your statement above.
The sks is a battle proven design that predates the AK and has at least the same reputation of reliability as the AK under the same adverse conditions. The AK only replaced the sks for it's ammo capacity capabilities, not for lack of reliability or dependability in any way.
I've seen SKS's and AK's dug up out of caches in the ground unprotected, out of muddy, silty river banks, that were loaded with one in the pipe. ALL of them would fire when the trigger was pulled. The AK has nothing on the SKS except ammo capacity and ease/speed of reloading.
I've also seen AK's that had their handguards burned off them from sustained rates of fire from multiple magazines. You'll not see any SKS in that condition though for the sole reason you can't reload it fast enough or long enough to burn the wood off of them.
In fact, the SKS is more accurate as ranges tend to get past 250 yds as it has a longer barrel [ hence a longer sighting platform ] thus producing higher velocities and less "drop" of the bullet at extended range.
Short temper aside sir, I enjoyed the back and forth/give and take here with you. It's always a pleasure to debate a subject with anyone when I have first hand knowledge through multiple examples and experiences with a particular weapons platform, over the last 35+ years, to do so.
Brownie
critrxdoc
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- Apr 17, 2006
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- 126
I have seen a KB in a Ruger built like a tank .44mag revolver that blew the cylinder out of the gun and buckled the backstrap. Stuff happens when you are an idiot. KBs can happen in any firearm from any manufacturer when you are an idiot and do things when common sense should prevail. I like glocks because the are quality weapons and I shoot them well. I don't condem other platforms. Stop flaming the glocks and do some more constructive with your time like going to the range/
das028
Member
Hey Brownie,
I'm willing to bet that guy is totally full of it. Typical "1911" guy. While 1911's are fine hanguns, they just are not as reliable out of the box as a Glock is (generally). Its a fact of life! And I'm willing to bet he as never shot a Glock.
Btw, Glocks should eat anu kind of ammo you feed it, period!
I'm willing to bet that guy is totally full of it. Typical "1911" guy. While 1911's are fine hanguns, they just are not as reliable out of the box as a Glock is (generally). Its a fact of life! And I'm willing to bet he as never shot a Glock.
Btw, Glocks should eat anu kind of ammo you feed it, period!
I must say this is the first time I've "read" that Glocks are more durable than 1911's.
Comparing a 9mm, most people shoot the "white box" power level, with a 45 is not valid. Much more "banging" going on to the gun with larger calibers and high power factors.
In fact, it's rare to "read" about any quality 9mm being "worn out" to be honest. There are exceptions of course...+P loads etc.
Lot's of 1911 are rebuilt, like the example of Rob Leatham, because they no longer deliver the "tightness and accuracy" that he or someone wants...not because it's worn out...big difference!
Comparing a 9mm, most people shoot the "white box" power level, with a 45 is not valid. Much more "banging" going on to the gun with larger calibers and high power factors.
In fact, it's rare to "read" about any quality 9mm being "worn out" to be honest. There are exceptions of course...+P loads etc.
Lot's of 1911 are rebuilt, like the example of Rob Leatham, because they no longer deliver the "tightness and accuracy" that he or someone wants...not because it's worn out...big difference!
Manedwolf
member
Does this count?
CZ-52 with wrongly loaded and way overpressured Bulgarian ammo
brownie0486
Member
Lot's of 1911 are rebuilt, like the example of Rob Leatham, because they no longer deliver the "tightness and accuracy" that he or someone wants...not because it's worn out...big difference!
Wrong sir, the sear, hammers, trigger shoes wear to the point of unsafe.
Ask me how I know I've shot two 1911's to the poiint of rebuilds in the rds given earlier. One was ready to go full auto as the sear had been worn so much along with the trigger.
The 60K+ through my glock needs no such rebuilding/replacing of parts. How many 1911's have you had to rebuild? Oh yes, that would mean I've shot 1911's a LOT over the years as well
I'm not talking out my arse, but from actual experience. BTW-I also talk to Leatham from time to time, he lives only a 20 minute ride from my house, and shoots at the same club I belong to every Tuesday night.
Brownie
Wrong sir, the sear, hammers, trigger shoes wear to the point of unsafe.
Ask me how I know
I've shot two 1911's to the poiint of rebuilds in the rds given earlier. One was ready to go full auto as the sear had been worn so much along with the trigger.The 60K+ through my glock needs no such rebuilding/replacing of parts. How many 1911's have you had to rebuild?
Oh yes, that would mean I've shot 1911's a LOT over the years as well I'm not talking out my arse, but from actual experience. BTW-I also talk to Leatham from time to time, he lives only a 20 minute ride from my house, and shoots at the same club I belong to every Tuesday night.
Brownie
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