Glock Officially Protests Army Selection of Sigs

[entropy]

Dang! How do all the novice shooters I teach know that one already......

 

[stoky]

Is it just me? When somebody uses the word ^^^protest^^^ I'm done; turn the page.

 

[toivo]

Even though it is really cheap for big contracts, reliable, and probably the least trouble to carry it relies on Glock the company to replace damaged or overly worn plastic frames, because quite frankly a plastic frame may work for a huge round count, but can not take a lot of direct damage.

That's the good part about the SIG P320. The FCU can be swapped into a new frame in less than a minute by a trained monkey. Frames currently retail for around $40 and will (we hope) cost our military substantially less due to economies of scale.

 

[Solomonson]

Eh, I was so going to leave this silly thread alone, but it appears that there's a lot of butt-hurt extant by those who cannot let go of the Army's decision ... and presumably, most probably, likely zero people in this thread actually have a horse in this race other than their love for Glocks or distaste for SIG, otherwise, why all the fuss?

Nope, the guy wasn't just "being rude now." This statement:
"Like many others have noted in this thread, the actual use of these modular options by the military will be limited."

Sorry to say that's just projection and quite possibly wrong. It's all speculation by the "many others" (again, likely a number of folks no longer on active duty) that the military will not use the modular options. I kinda think they might, actually. It make sense to be able to change out a few pistols for different uses (and missions); giving the O's, senior NCO's, medics and a few others a full-size combat pistol for going outside the wire, on-base duty/watches or in garrison, a different pistol for aviators/aircrew, MPs and investigators ... Doesn't this make more sense than keeping a hodgepodge of assorted pistols, M9s, P-226s, M-11s, G19s and whatever, all requiring different parts, different magazines and different manual-of-arms?

Okay, I could be very wrong, but I'm just gonna go out on a limb here and say that maybe, for once, some portion of the military is going to doing something that indicates some common sense and might just in the long run, save some taxpayer dollars.

Love the way someone brings up "all the Glock-haters in this thread" when there's really been no "Glock-hate" displayed.

All you offer is your personal opinion, and you do so in a rude manner. Perhaps it's you that is "butt-hurt"? Historical behavior is often times the best way to predict future behavior. It's the US Military's past behavior (and not merely personal "projection") that makes me believe this entire program is a boondoggle.

There are legitimate upgrades to the M9 available from a variety of manufacturers today. The Army should simply have chosen one (or two), following a thorough test. Instead they created the HMMWV of "modular systems" that do nothing but needlessly consume tax dollars. in other words, a boondoggle paid for by taxpayers.

 

[TrickyDick]

I highly doubt they will use them....I think this things claim to fame is going to be the "gun" part is just the little stamped metal inside.....after the plastic gets fubar, a new bit of plastic gets stuck on and away you go.

Do you really think the military is going to be stocking hundreds of thousands of different sized frames for everyone....this is not boots.

Everything will be standard....it is just the way it is.....if not it is going to be a huge waste of money.....I can see tons of frames sitting for years not going anywhere and being sold off or given away to law enforcement like all the other crap they give us. I have 100 new back packs all free, not to talk about hummers, trailers and our "tac" vehicle. All free, and most of it with very little use. Who knows it might make us give up our old sig's for these new one if the army is going to give away grips they have no use for.....great use of tax payer money.

Well there's only 3 sizes of frames, not "hundreds of thousands". 3 sizes. The ceramic armor plates, come in 3 sizes. The ACH, comes in 4 sizes. The M40 gas mask comes in 3 sizes.

There's a reason for this.

Soldiers come in different sizes.

The Army understands.

If the equipment properly fits the soldier, it'll make them more effective. And if it comes down to something as simple as switching out a frame, then easy enough. If they can do it with other equipment, it should be no problem.

 

[Old Dog]

All you offer is your personal opinion, and you do so in a rude manner. Perhaps it's you that is "butt-hurt"? Historical behavior is often times the best way to predict future behavior. It's the US Military's past behavior (and not merely personal "projection") that makes me believe this entire program is a boondoggle.

Well, yes, yes I did offer only my personal opinion; not clear why you say I did so in a "rude manner." I'm hardly butt-hurt, though, but thanks for asking. I left active duty (after well over twenty years in two branches) and thus have zero stake in this game. I simply pointed out that this thread has numerous folks -- who, like me, are not affected by the Army's choices -- spouting hyperbole and predicting the future when they cannot possibly know how this situation will turn out. So if saying that some people are indulging in pure speculation is being rude or otherwise an indication that I'm butt-hurt, well, whatever ...

There are plenty of examples of the U.S. military branches' past (collective) behavior that have shown me that quite often the different branches of the armed forces make some darn good choices and things work out well for all concerned. Sometimes even the Army gets some things right.

 

[tipoc]

According to this report Sig can go ahead with it's fulfillment of the contract, meaning that it can begin to send the guns and gear to the Army. The earliest reports had stated that Glock's protest had put a hold on the fulfillment. The reason they state that Sig can do this is that Glock missed a deadline.

Seems that the Army held a debriefing with Glock, Sig and others telling them of their choice on Feb. 17th this year. Any protests of that had to be filed within 10 days to receive attention. But within 5 days to stop the work of supplying the Army with the product. Glock took 7 days to turn in the protest. This means that the protest is still valid but that it was not submitted within the 5 day time frame to stop Sig from beginning to fill the order.

http://taskandpurpose.com/glocks-protest-service-pistol-award-wont-halt-sigs-contract-going-forward/

tipoc

 

[strambo]

It would be easy for the Army to issue these right. Armorer issues pistol to soldier for first time with all 3 frame sizes (who signs for all of them). When pistol is turned in later (after training, whatever), soldier turns it in with the grip frame installed that fits them best, hands the other 2 back to the armorer. Done. There is "supposed" to be a PMI (primary marksmanship instruction) class before every qualification.

So, first time unit quals with the 320, actually do a proper PMI class where they get shown how to swap the grip sizes and pointers on how to tell which one is right for you. Then with the grips installed best for each shooter, proceed with the rest of the class. After it's over, turn them in as I said above. Only time it will change again is if the pistol get assigned to a new person.