Glock & Sigma - (here we go again...:)

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Every time I tell this story, the fanboys call me a liar.

The front sight fell out. The feed ramp needed to be milled before it would feed any ammo. The slide-stop spring broke. The trigger sucks. All three magazines I had acted differently. I had read the magazines and believed the hype, I really thought this was "The real Glock". As I was taking this thing back and forth to the gunsmith, I actually believed this was normal, that ALL guns need three or four trips to the gunsmith. The last time, they were laughing at me. I traded it in, got raped on the deal, and I wept with joy.

Next Gen models might be great. M&Ps might be the best polymer auto on the market. I'll never know. If they ripped off Glock so flagrantly, why couldn't they get it right the first time?
 
True, I have never owned a Sigma. Never needed or wanted to.

I've had six flawless Glocks, and one very, very used one (cost about what a new Sigma is going for) that needed a $5 spring to get it back running.
 
For the price the newest Sigma's are a great value. The ergonomics are great. I had a 9VE and would consider buying another one if I needed a pistol and was on a tight budget. Like someone said earlier the trigger is an easy fix. It will never be a target gun but it is more than accurate enough for its intended purpose and I never had a malfunction with mine.

That being said my edc is a Glock 26. There is something to be said about the ablility to be able to change any internal part on the Glock with 5 minutes and a single punch. The availability of parts is great and I firmly believe that my Glock will outlast my lifetime.

Bottom line is the Glock worth the extra money?? Maybe not but you'll only have to buy it once.
 
Mljdeckard is just a sigma hater. He will never come around or understand the fact that Lemon's are a fact of life in Everything in the market (heck, look at toyota!) and he just doesn't want to accept the fact that company's learn from mistakes and fix them. The reason there is a Gen 2 Sigma...

don't even waste your breath on him, he's a lost cause.

JOe
 
Thanks for the information Kingofthehill.

Your car reference really is a great parallel. Believe it or not, some Honda owners even have problems. Should we all conclude that Honda is not reliable because someone had a problem?

Of course not. But yet.......
 
I have never owned , nor shot a sigma. The Department I work for use to issue the earlier sigmas. They didn't last long due to numerous parts breaking and lots of jams on the range with ball ammo.The department got rid of them quickly and went to S&W 1006s and then to Glocks shortly after.
While I was in the academy, two of the students that were there had sigmas. One was an earlier sigma, and the other was a newer one. Both of them had to be removed from the firing line due to malfunctions. The older sigma went down first, then the newer one about 100 rounds later. Both of the students were issued a Glock 22 from the academy armory and they finished the week long range course with out any problems.

I have spoke with a few people that own the newer sigmas and they say that they like them.
 
Permit me to add my 2 cents and two words "Replacement Parts". Not to mention a vast majority of aftermarket accessories and holsters. To me that takes it down to one word "Glock".
 
the newer sigma 9mm SW9VE will match and exxced the performance of the glock in fact glock sued S&W because what they initaly did was make a better glock i am US navy Police officer and while we use beretta 9mms civilian police use glocks where i live and are in a dissucusion as to wheather or not change to the sugma because the performance is so much better

I'd hate to have to read/edit your reports...
 
as far as durability goes, i've never owned a Glock, but i have owned a Sigma; the sights on Sigmas are plastic, and the front sight is glued to the slide. if you drop it, like i have, you WILL ruin the sights. as for the rest of the gun, the one i owned suffered tons of abuse, and never failed me, which i hear is standard for a Glock. as for the sights, i ent it back to S&W, and they put new ones on for me.
 
Permit me to add my 2 cents and two words "Replacement Parts". Not to mention a vast majority of aftermarket accessories and holsters. To me that takes it down to one word "Glock".


There's no question, this is a significant advantage. There are replacement and aftermarket glock parts all over. Of course, S&W fixes the Sigma for life for free, so that's something.

Oddly, for the number of sigma's they sell, the same type of parts/aftermarket hasn't really materialized.

I agree, advantage to the Glock though. Worth the $200+ price new to new? I don't know, that's up to each person I guess.
 
Maybe he is on a mission to inform the ignorant so they can at least disguise themselves.
 
He does it all the time! He's THR's official grammar/spelling police....nothing better to do I guess?

Aww....it's sweet that you check up on me. Shows that you care!
 
I have both.
Sigma... at first couldn't hit a damn thing,tried wolff striker spring, it broke. Sent to S&W,now I'm fairly accurate. The trigger is much lighter and smoother, I also removed the pigtail spring. I like it so much that I put night sights on it and I have a light/laser waiting on a picatinny rail adapter coming on the big brown truck. It;s my HD piece for now.

Glock 27,fantastic out of the box, extremely accurate, great trigger. Fit and finish is MILES ahead of the Sigma. This is my EDC.

The sigma's frame does flex, you can see it while dry firing.

They are both good guns, is the Glock worth $200 more?

Yes!
 
Interesting Thread. I was looking for another 9mm and the Sigma was on the short list. I am hard on guns too. I need something rugged.
 
When we compare the SW9VE to the Glock 17 (which are comparable pistols) we see many similarities and a few differences. The question we have to ask ourselves is, "are those few differences worth the price difference?"

Action: virtually the same. Browning short recoil system. The one difference is that the Glock will fire when slightly out of battery but the SW will not. (+ 1 for SW)

Magazine: The SW holds one more round than the Glock. The SW magazines are made of stainless steel while the Glock's are made from plastic. Also the SW magazine catch is steel and the Glock's is plastic. (+3 for SW)

Ergonomics: As ergonomics is a matter of taste, experience, and the size/shape of one's hands it is entirely subjective and neither adds nor subtracts from the comparison. (+-0)

Material: Slides on both are stainless steel of equal grade. The frame of the Glock is made from a polymer, the exact formula of which is a trade secret, and the SW is made from nylon (which is also a polymer). (+-0)

Barrel: Glock uses a barrel with polygonal rifling which creates a superior seal preventing excessive blow by and increasing velocity. However, it also is more subject to lead fouling and requires more attention to, and more frequent, cleanings than the conventionally rifled SW. Additionally the steep transition from the chamber to the barrel tends to foul more easily when using lead bullets which may be the cause of Glock's firing out of battery if not properly cleaned. The SW chamber is fully supported, the Glock is not. But on a 9mm pistol this is, for the most part, irrelevant. (This one is a wash. Glock rifling has better seal but SW has fewer problems associated with its rifling. The supported/unsupported chamber does not come into play with a 9mm which is what we are comparing)

Parts and accessories: Glock has been around a long, long time and there are all sorts of after-market parts available. The same is true of accessories. However, many Glock accessories will fit the SW. Holsters are an excellent example. A holster made for a Glock will fit a SW (size/shape are almost identical, within a 1/10 of an inch in most instances). However, the non-standard rail on a SW limits what you can hang under the barrel without using an adapter (which are available and pretty cheap). (Glock +1)

Trigger: The Glock and SW triggers operate very similarly, however, the SW trigger requires almost twice as much pull as the Glock. 9.1 to 5.2 pounds. Additionally the Glock trigger, out of the box, is much smoother (although it is still considerably on the mushy side). The SW can be brought up to the Glock, but it will require some gunsmithing and replacement of some factory parts. (Glock +2)

Greater variety available: The Glock has been around much longer and has morphed into many different models and calibers. Not so the SW. One model, 2 calibers. (Glock +1)

So, that gives us 4 for the SW and 4 for the Glock. I own both but can't defend the price difference in light of the comparison.

Your choice, of course, is entirely up to you. If it is worth it to you, go for it! Value, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder. :)
 
http://thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=6038932&postcount=76

That posts describes how I feel about the Sigma. I personally do not like Glocks and do not own any, but they have proven themselves to be a great platform. Do I think a Glock/M&P/XD, etc have advantages to offset their steeper entry fee? Yes, the main reason being is they have a greater network of after purchasing items that can't be overlooked. Just one thing to consider what I mean:

New Glock 17/19 = +-500
10 factory capacity magazines = +-$200
Total price = +-$700

New SW9VE = +-$275
10 Factory capacity magazines = +-$400
Total = +-$675

So the value can start to diminish once you are the owner of the gun and want to expand upon just the base firearm. This also goes with sights, holsters, parts availability, etc.

Damian
 
ANd the 17 holds one more round than the 9VE.

Holds one more than the 19, but the 19 is also a little smaller than the 9VE.
 
Also, the Glock has metal inserts/supports added into the frame which the slide rides on, while on the Sigma
the slide rides on the polymer frame itself.

This is not true. I have an old Sigma I bought new in like 1996. Model SW40C. Steel inserts in the polymer frame. This has been a fine pistol for me.

100_1032.jpg

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Nice comparison. but really who has 10 mags for their gun?

I have FAR too many guns to have 10 mags per. The higest would be my AR which i have about 35... my Glock 19 i have 8, my M&P i have 4 and most other guns i have 2-3.

The person who buys the Sigma is TYPICALLY a new shooter. Someone looking for a good deal to get their feet wet. Also, with purchase of Sigma you get 2 free mags from S&W so that puts you at 4 from the factory.

Most people do not have more than 4 mags per gun... im saying MOST... this being a gun forum, you will find a lot here that have several mags per gun, but spread out to all gun owners in America? 2 mags per gun

So although interesting observation, its pretty pointless.

JOe
 
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