Help turn a pansy lib into a gun nut!

Status
Not open for further replies.
Another new member here though not new to firearms.

Also a left libertarian/liberal who has been mightily impressed with the knowledge and willingness to share that knowledge that resides in these pixels.

Esp the smithing threads aith old fuff and 1911 tuner shareing their many years of expertise. I think reading through the 1911 clinics I've found the cause of my crunched brass on the last round!

Thanks to all here for being so open and y'all just might see a whole lot more of us lefty types here as the climate is changeing on our side of the political aisle.

Hell even on the Great Orange Satan, Daily kos, any attempt to resurrect gun control of any type including the ridiculous AWB is usually shouted down with over 50 % of any respondents being gun owners and many ex LEO and Military.

As for your first gun, I've got to admit I'm a little biased. Either an old Ruger Security Six or a 1911 my pref. Springfield Armory though that one is probably out of the price range.

The Security Six in .357 is a heck of a defensive weapon and when you want the matching carbine Marlin makes a couple of beauty lever actions that will complete the combo.


Good luck on your first and enjoy.

And to the rest of you, great to be here and hope to be bugging Tuner real soon as I have a couple of q's on my SA 1911
 
I was under the impression I could only apply for CCW in the county I live. Where can I find out more about the Utah non-resident CCW program?
Click to expand...

I don't want to give you the wrong idea, a non-resident Utah CCW will let you carry concealed in dozens of states but NOT in California. California doesn't recognize any other states CCW permit.

You can find more info about the Utah CCW permit in the following links.

San Jose Classes

Utah Department of Public Safety - CCW Information

See which states will honor your non-resident Utah CCW permit here
 
I'm also a new gun owner and new to this forum. Totally agree with the basic NRA course. I had to take this to get the CCW permit, but it was a full day of instruction well worth it.

Shot a .22 rifle as a kid and a shotgun a bunch of times, but I'm new to handguns.

Rented several 9mm, 45's and wheel guns, but fell for the 1911. Have fun learning and buying your first gun!!!
 
No gun I own will ever be used for hunting. I'm a vegetarian!

I know I'm not the "usual sort" around here. Thanks again for the warm welcome.
Click to expand...
You might want to consider takng it anyway, just to learn some basic gun skills.
 
I would suggest you might not be as liberal as you think you are, maybe that California is having a negative effect on you, subconsciously of course.
 
I think that somebody had mentioned the S&W Model 10 .38 Special Revolver as a good choice for a first handgun. I'd just like to say that I totally agree with that.

My very first handgun was a mid-1960's era S&W Model 10-5 with the standard weight 4" barrel. I got it about 3-4 years back for $175 (US). I really like this revolver, it is about as "basic" as can be. For what I use it for, which is just basic target shooting, it is perfect.

As for a decent first rifle, last year I bought an early 1970's Marlin (Glenfield) Model-25 .22 Calibre Bolt-Action Rifle for $100 (US). This rifle has a 7 round detachable magazine. So far I have been real happy with this little rifle. I think it is still in production, but re-named the Model 925 Rifle?, that might be worth checking into as well.

I hope that helped out a bit.
Thanks
Mark
 
I just want to repeat everyone that said get some kind of .22 first. Yes, it'll be a little lacking in power in the event you should need to use it for defense, but that's less important than gaining initial proficiency. A .22 that you can use to hit the eye of a bird flying is way more useful than a 9mm that you can only hit a man-sized target (somewhere) at 10 yards some of the time.

It sounds like you're on a pretty tight budget (I am, too!), and with the economy today, it would be absolutely insane to not own a .22. The cheapest 9mm, you're going to be paying about $180 with shipping, for 1,000 rounds. Go into a Wal-Fart, and you can get 1,100 rounds of .22 for less than $30 with tax. You can shoot a lot more .22 than anything else, for a given amount of money.

I'd recommend a Ruger Mk.III or Browning Buckmark, and an Ultimate Cliploader. Here's a video I found. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAN_v8pDr4w I think it woulda gone faster if she lost those fake nails, but those loaders are incredibly convenient.

When you're just starting out, you want to practice as much as you possibly can. 500 rounds in one range session wouldn't be out of line at all. And just about the easiest and cheapest way to get that kind of training in would be a .22 with a magazine loader.

Oh, for your second gun, I'd recommend one of these.
serbu3.jpg

http://www.serbu.com/top/superShorty.php

You'd need to make a living trust to register it to, and they're a little pricy, but it's worth the money and time. And you actually can own AOWs (other than pen guns) in CA.
 
Last edited:
Well, I went to the first day of my NRA "Basic Pistol" class. It was about an hour away, and the instructor didn't have a range of his own, so we actually ended up doing the shooting at Reed's Indoor Range anyway, as recommended by a few people in this thread.

In my opinion the instructor did a poor job of marketing the class before hand. I really didn't know what I was heading into, and the uncertainty was giving me the feeling I was being conned. Once I got there however, the quality of instruction was terrific! As ignorant as I was heading into this, I'm very happy about what I'm learning and how I'm being taught. That said, they are nickel-and-dimeing me. The instructor assured my that the price of the class included all ammunition costs and range fees and the like, and they did end up making me pay extra for all of that, they didn't honor a $20 off offer from the website, and based on what I've seen and what I've paid so far, the entire thing is going to cost me $280 when all is said and done. I'm kinda pissed about that when other places offered the same thing for $125 (though I have no way of knowing the veracity of those offers either). But I am quite happy about the quality of instruction, so I'm not going to rock the boat.

There were seven people in the class on the Saturday after Thanksgiving, much to my surprise. It seems the interest in learning about firearms is indeed strong right now. The three of us "first time" shooters showed up first, and we spent about an hour and a half just learning basic safety rules and mnemonics about what to think about when shooting, etc. Then the rest of the class showed up and they took out the guns and we spent about an hour and a half playing with them (empty), practicing loading (fake cartridges) unloading, checking the chamber, racking, stances, and of course holding them without putting our fingers on the triggers and without pointing them at anyone.

Then we headed to the range. I got paired with the instructor's helper, who was ex-navy and a great teacher and very confidence inspiring. I fired the Glock in .40 S&W. Several comments about actually shooting...

First, I was fine handling the gun right up until the trigger was depressed up to the break point. Every time I rode that point on the trigger I got got laughably nervous and the gun began to shake. When that would happen I would back off and start my trigger pull over again. This just wants to make me want to practice until *bang* no longer surprises me.

Also, while the Glock is the only gun I put a significant number of rounds through, I don't think its the gun for me. It felt like I was scrunching my hand to fire it. I think the distance from tang to trigger is too small for me.

And last, firing the .40 S&W reinforced my idea to get a 9mm for myself. Despite being a "pansy lib" I'm a pretty big and strong guy - 5'10" and 250. I was surprised by how much the kick from the gun affected me. Right now I don't think I'd want to fire a .45 ACP, and .40S&W is about the biggest I'd want to handle to comfortably fire off multiple shots and still maintain complete control of the gun. I'm hoping my control is even better with the 9mm.

In terms of accuracy, the instructors said I was rather good for a first time shooter. I wasn't so hot at hitting the bullseye, but by placing a hand on the target you could cover probably 2/3 of my shots on the piece of paper, even if that spot was low and to the left of where I was aiming.

We returned to the classroom and learned how to take apart the guns for maintenance and cleaning and about the different parts. I only fired the Glock, but I got to handle the Glock, a Sig P226, and a SA XD40 a fair amount. I was out of time for the day and had to leave, but I will be returning next weekend to finish the class, which I understand is mostly the "academic" portion - powerpoint, written material, and a test.

I'm definitely thinking more about my eventual purchase. Unfortunately, the budget is not cooperating. After the class I plan to find somewhere to rent all the handguns I'm considering and fire them. So between the class, the rental fees for the guns, the cost of ammo, the range time, the licensing, etc., it really looks like my $500 budget is going to be exhausted before I even buy a gun. *sigh*

The front runners now, just going off of what I read and not having fired them yet, are the CZ75B (on the high end), the Bersa Thunder Ultra Compact, and a Browning Buckmark.

Yeah, that's right, the .22LR autopistol has made it back into the running. It may be a while after I buy my first until I can afford a second handgun, so I was initially very keen on having the first handgun be an appropriate weapon for self-defense and home defense. But putting a few rounds through the Glock at the range made it clear to me how important it is that I practice practice practice to be comfortable with a gun for it to be of any use to me. And in that case, the .22LR is now back on my shortlist as a nice firearm that will let me put a lot of lead downrage for a not a lot of money.

I'm still interested in hearing about any tips, advice, or feedback.
 
I am glad you enjoyed the training. Too bad they seem to have misled you on prices.

As posted above and with your experience, a .22 is a great first gun. Although you will want something bigger for self-defense, a .22 with 10 rounds in the hands of an experienced operator is a heck of a lot more effective than a baseball bat.

I forgot to mention - when you do look at 9mm pistols, do not rule out the Rugers. You can sometimes find them very cheap. They are not pretty, but the one I have handled had a GREAT trigger in both DA and SA.

Best of luck to you. Shoot safely! BA/UU/R!
 
IME .40's flip more than .45's, the .45 is more of a push. I've gotten rid of all my .40's over the years. That's not to say it isn't a good round or hard to control, it just isn't my cuppa IYKWIM...
 
Congratulations on attending the class--you're on your way. I applaud your decision to consider a .22 as your first gun.

I'm with SuperNaut: the .40 cal Glock that I've shot felt very snappy to me; I didn't like the recoil. The .45s that I've shot seem like the recoil impulse is smoother: "a push" is how I'd describe it, too. Still, 9mm's a lot cheaper to shoot. There's no wrong answer there as long as the gun fits you.
 
Oh for God's sake people...

My first gun was an AK-47. I never grew up around guns. Get something meaty (an AW), treat it like a deadly weapon when you go shoot it. You'll be fine.

Frankly, if you can't operate an AK-47, you shouldn't be let around a toaster, let alone a firearm.

The key is something that's easy to shoot and easy to maintain.
Click to expand...
+1

I don't want to knock anybody else's advice down, but a lot of people around here tend to treat firearms ownership as a great endeavor, as though there is some sort of multi-year progression from newbie to "competent" gun owner which involves buying the simplest and cheapest type of firearm and slowly working your way up to more "complicated" weapons. There's a certain amount of arrogance attached to that perspective. Is it a tremendously serious responsibility? Yes. Is it technically or intellectually demanding? Not in the least.

Granted, it takes great skill to shoot well, but simply operating just about any firearm in a safe and responsible manner is almost mindless. Treat every firearm as though it is loaded. Don't point it at anything (especially people) you don't intend to shoot. Keep your finger off the trigger until ready to shoot. Always carefully check the chamber and magazine before handing a firearm off to another person, or after accepting a firearm from another person. Follow these simple steps at all times and you won't have any problems. It's really that simple. Download some videos from the internet (Youtube is actually a great resource for this) to learn how to disassemble and/or clean your particular weapon and have at it.

I have to imagine that anybody that would have trouble with this is pretty stupid and/or careless. The fact that such people are out there in quantity is a sad reflection upon the state of our society as a whole. :(
 
by placing a hand on the target you could cover probably 2/3 of my shots on the piece of paper, even if that spot was low and to the left of where I was aiming.
Click to expand...

Sounds like the trigger reach was too short, as you thought. I'd look into a "true" double action only auto. Actually, you can (or at least, used to be able to, I haven't looked in quite awhile) find all kinds of police trade-in S&W autos, at budget prices. The DAO ones are usually the cheapest. Try CDNN investments. http://www.cdnninvestments.com/
 
jws527, what you've written makes a lot of sense, but I don't see a lot of arrogance here. I see shooters who've been at it a while responding to a request for suggestions, for advice and for information about their own preferences.

I see people considering various shortcuts they've discovered and writing down helpful tips for someone who's expressed a sincere desire to become proficient and to enjoy shooting.

Besides, guns and ammunition cost money. It's fun to help someone else spend their money. It's satisfying to watch someone new spending it effectively for the maximum possible fun and utility.
 
Welcome to THR,

Lots of good advice here so far. I hope mine also measures up.

Cost seems to creep into the discussion of yours rather significantly.

As you seem to want to do your best in all aspects of "being a responsible owner", many are advocating to become proficient with whatever you decide to purchase. This involves shooting the thing, and shooting it some more.

Pretty much the cheapest centerfire there is, is the 9mm, (ammo wise).

However, even this adds up after shooting it a lot, and this will quickly eclipse the cost of the firearm itself.

That said, I bought a Ruger p345 (.45) as my first pistol about 3 years ago. I bought a Ruger .22 the next month. (I was 38 at the time, and I ain't no pansy lib :))

I ended up shooting 1000s of rounds out of the .22. Cost was so much easier to bear. I would shoot lefty (I am lefty) and then righty (why not? it didn't cost anything really but a couple of cents a round?), two handed, short range, long range, etc., etc. ( I now shoot about 6000-8000 rounds a year, super cost effective)

I would get a .22 and shoot the heck out of it.

Some here have said to go to a range (private). I agree. I was lucky in that mine was $100 a year. I had everyone and his brother offer me their guns to shoot, and I would expect that your experience in San Fran would be the same with those folks there. It is a heck of a lot cheaper to borrow than rent all the options out there. For me the 1911 was the ticket. (You also said that you weren't ready for the .45 yet. My experience was that it was one of the finest feeling pistols that I shot. In fact I liked it so much I bought one and now shoot Bullseye)

Also, really, as long as you always keep the muzzle pointed down range and always check (and re-check) that it is empty, no one will ever need to get hurt.
 
jws527, what you've written makes a lot of sense, but I don't see a lot of arrogance here. I see shooters who've been at it a while responding to a request for suggestions, for advice and for information about their own preferences.

I see people considering various shortcuts they've discovered and writing down helpful tips for someone who's expressed a sincere desire to become proficient and to enjoy shooting.

Besides, guns and ammunition cost money. It's fun to help someone else spend their money. It's satisfying to watch someone new spending it effectively for the maximum possible fun and utility.
Click to expand...
Fair enough. :)

I suppose I should add that there's absolutely nothing wrong with starting with a .22LR - if only because it's one of the few cartridges that's still downright cheap to shoot today, and a beginning shooter will need a lot of practice to become consistent. Frankly, I wish I had one at this point in time.
 
I just ran across this thread. You are me! Well, I'm more independent than liberal but I've been voting against republicans lately. I started shooting about 8 months ago and went through the same process. Here are a few thoughts in no particular order.

1) Darn it's expensive out there. I took a similar training course except it was 1:1 with a national champion competition shooter for $65. Gun rental and ammo was included in that charge.

2) I bought a 9mm for the same reasons as you are thinking. Also, you can develop bad habits if you start to anticipate the recoil.

3) Around me you can rent pistols for $5 each. I strongly encourage you to do something like that.

4) A pistol is really a personal decision. It's about fit and personal appeal. If you're like me and internet research is your style that works against you. It's a lot like using internet research to pick a good pair of jeans. It might help a little but whats right for me might not be right for you.

5) I remember my first day at the range I felt kind of nervous too. I'm 35 years old and 6' tall and I was actually wonder what my mom would think if she knew I was shooting guns. :) Now it's just a fun thing to do on a weekend or a good way to open the eyes of an anti-gun person.

6) This is a cool site for looking at 9mm pistols. I wouldn't pay much attention to their order but it's useful for using as a catalog of guns you want to consider.

7) The mainstream 9mm semi-autos seem to be Glock 17, S&W M&P, and Springfield XD(M). They seem to have a lot of support for holsters, tac lights, etc.

8 ) Get a holster even if you don't plan to carry. I like to use it as sort of a safety. Getting a gun out of a range bag, safe, or any place I can't see it is a little less dangerous when it's in a holster.

9) I bought the S&W M&P if that means anything to you. If I was starting over I'd get it again.

10) I've also bought a rifle and started to enjoy it even more than the pistol. I'm glad I have both but I something about the rifle and its precision is fun to me.

That's all I have for now. It's too bad you're not in NC, I'd take you to the range.
 
I'm 35 years old and 6' tall and I was actually wonder what my mom would think if she knew I was shooting guns. :)
Click to expand...

No kidding! lol

Anyway, I thought I'd update y'all. I finished up the NRA class, and this weekend I checked out a couple of the local gun shops. I wanted to get my hands on a couple guns to see if there was some reason I should splurge on a CZ-75, or if I should get a more reasonable Bersa, and handle a few other guns I hadn't shot yet.

Well, no one had any Bersas. Very disappointing, as the Thunder 9mm was reasonable priced and everyone had good things to say about it. The only CZ in stock was a polymer 75 Compact in 40S&W. :( Not really what I had in mind in a CZ. I checked a couple stores too, but returned to the one that was most recommended to me, on the way I was building the case in my head that I'd start with something in .22LR. I can get started shooting at the range, it won't be too expensive, good first gun.

Well, something very unexpected happened. I ran across something which I had totally missed on the California approved handguns list. Say hello to my first gun:

IMG_1207.jpg

Rock Island Armory 1911 Tactical in .45 ACP

What does tactical mean anyway? I'm guessing the wooden grips, but if someone could enlighten me that'd be great. Eight round clip, full length guide rail, ambidextrous safety, and I figured with the way people rave, I couldn't go too far wrong with a 1911.

Price was $499, plus license, fees, and tax brought it to $600 even. This has been a costly journey... I'm a hair over $800 right now. And I haven't yet bought *spare magazines *holster *ammo to shoot with *snap caps to practice with. My guess is I'll end up around a grand for my first gun. I set aside $1k for a gun and a BoB, figuring half for each, but blew the entire budget on the gun. C'est la vie.

All that's left now is to wait the 10 days to pick it up. Mabe now that I'm armed I'll go shooting with some of the friendly Bay Area THR folks. :)

Thanks all!
 
Please contact the NRA for a handgun/firearm safety class near you. Either in-expensive or free. The books are a good start as well. If you can afford it, something like gunsight might be an option but a little extreme for most folks (cost, travel, time) I think a good revolver would be the choice here. Easy to maintain, plenty of the greats circulating in the used market, and a .357 offers the flexibility of full powered fight stopper to .38 plinker. If you have a range near you, call them and inquire about a NRA approved safety or training program they're almost always happy to oblige.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

H
  • Locked
Gun Nuts!
2 3
Replies
72
Views
3K
rogertc1
R
W
  • Locked
The gun nut and depression
2 3
Replies
57
Views
4K
ArfinGreebly
ArfinGreebly
G
  • Locked
Gun Nuts
2
Replies
36
Views
2K
Oldtimer
O
E
  • Locked
Cultivating a gun-nut harvest
Replies
4
Views
428
effengee
E
D
  • Locked
Accumulating guns...Am I nuts?
2 3
Replies
65
Views
3K
ZekeLuvs1911
Z
Back
Top