Lee 6000 press

[GW Staar]

Thump on...for now.
Hoping Lee will step-up here (or maybe GW Staar. )
If his works he may have to produce and sell them too.

.

Oh, it works.....but the whole priming with folding trays idea isn't the best one Lee's had. I just am not enamored with that. The idea of having to shake it to feed and more to feed the last three is not my idea of a finished product. That said the overall price/product I still like.....we will see if I end up using the priming system routinely.

Anyway I did print it out.....just guessing what to print out.....I designed four bumpers....but only 2 are used. So I have one more redesign.....and it'll have two.....really only enough stroke for that.

What I did determine was that the drop tube has too much flex for good action, so I used the existing hole and made a swiveling "hold-down" to stop it.

I'm including a quick and dirty video. Maybe you all can tell something, or even have an idea or two.

Update: I removed the video below and replaced it in my last post with the updated design that works perfect.

 

[Tilos]

I tried the wire like you and also like your results, but for now I am semi successfully using the plastic roller.

Those wires in the grooves may work combined with the LL plastic roller that you have.
I'd try it if I could...
.
.

 

[Tilos]

Oh, it works.....but the whole priming with folding trays idea isn't the best one Lee's had. I just am not enamored with that. The idea of having to shake it to feed and more to feed the last three is not my idea of a finished product. That said the overall price/product I still like.....we will see if I end up using the priming system routinely.

Anyway I did print it out.....just guessing what to print out.....I designed four bumpers....but only 2 are used. So I have one more redesign.....and it'll have two.....really only enough stroke for that.

What I did determine was that the drop tube has too much flex for good action, so I used the existing hole and made a swiveling "hold-down" to stop it.

I'm including a quick and dirty video. Maybe you all can tell something, or even have an idea or two.



As you can see I replaced the wire with a longer one with a handle.....I'll cut the length to where the "handle" will be next to the downtube.

Nice.
.

 

[LiveLife]

FYI to all those working on the primer tray shake issue.

During my (Part 4) Problem/Solution work, I found two different types of primer flip tray. One type has smooth top surface and another has same flip rings as bottom and I believe primer anvil feet may be hanging up on the flip rings when primers are stacked instead of sliding freely. If this is the case, then Lee Precision could redesign the top cover solid without any flip rings to allow primers to slide likely with very little agitation/shaking of the primer tray. (I already sent an email) https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...-oal-consistency.911743/page-16#post-12489252

Below comparison picture shows cover without flip rings on the left and cover with flip rings on the right.

Another thing that could help your efforts is zip tying the primer chute/trough which is two halves hinged at the top and zip typing at two tab points makes chute more rigid with primer tray to transfer agitation/shaking vibrations to flow primers down. (Note tabs at pin holes and top tabs)

Zip ties at two tab points don't crush the two halves but makes chute/trough more solid/rigid with primer tray.

Now the pin riding the press column/groove rings makes definite "flick" movement of the primer tray as being tapped by finger from the side of tray (Especially accentuated by pen filler sleeve roller)

 

[9mmepiphany]

the whole priming with folding trays idea isn't the best one Lee's had. I just am not enamored with that. The idea of having to shake it to feed and more to feed the last three is not my idea of a finished product

So far I've used the folding primer tray on 3 Lee products: 1) Bench Auto Prime, 2) Automatic Case Primer (ACP) Press, and the 3) Pro 6000 (Pro-6k)

1. The Bench Prime worked well but required a certain stroke to vibrate the tray just right to keep the primers flowing. I found it easier to just tap it as I removed cases...it would feed all the primers in the tray.
The weak point was that it required the use of Lee Priming shell holders and the collar retaining it cracked under pressure.

2. The ACP was a major step forward in that it doesn't require shell holders. It auto fed and auto ejected cases. Cases were centered over the priming ram by fingers in the upper assembly. It primed cases uniformally below flush with good feel. This was my first experience with the last 3 primers not feeding if there wasn't a column of primers pushing down.
The weak point of the ACP was that the reciprocating platform that supported the cases would sometimes flip the next primer when rising. A smooth stroke was required for flawless operation
It is still my favorite priming tool for seating Federal primers for my .38Spl match ammo.

3. The Pro-6k is a huge leap forward in handling primers from the tray to the priming station. I didn't even know there was a pin to vibrate the tray until reading about it here...primed my first 200 .45ACP just fine; maybe I'm just used to looking and tapping the tray. It does have an issue feeding the last 3 primers; I just load another full tray as the chute get about half empty.

What I really like about the Lee systems of priming are the trays. I can dump a whole flat of primers in the tray, shake them for orientation, fold it, lock it, and they are ready to go; I usually load 2-5 up before I start.

I hate filling primer tubes. I've done the hunt-n-peck, the Vibra prime hand tools, both DAA electronic primer tube fillers and the Dillon tool. The only thing that seems easier is the primer collator from Mark 7 for their 10-station presses...they got the price down from $1k to just under $700, but you have to own the press first $3500 - $10k

 

[GW Staar]

I worked on the cad design a little tonight......I shortened it, and added an inside "V" at the bottom to go into Lee's bottom post support groove. It fits really nice and tight around the support, so the "V" should stop any downward travel. IOW's, it should stay put. Since the tube is open in back it's placed so that it does NOT have problems with clearance to any moving part.

I increased the 2 bumps a little, so it should rock the primers a little more. The downtube hold shown in the video really works well, and increases the effect.

The only down, is that I have to be in Albuquerque tomorrow and Wednesday so it'll be Wednesday nite before I can fully test and make another video. But here's what I hope is a final design that will work well. Will take 2 hours and 20 minutes to print.

In the illustration from the .stl file below, you can see the beveled bottom that will go into the groove. If anyone with a printer wants to play with it be my guest.....you won't waste too much plastic or printer time if it doesn't work!

 

[GW Staar]

LiveLife posted this great picture so I can explain how I made the downtube hold-down:

See the hole to the left of the downtube? I inserted a 8-32 hex head screw from the bottom, and tightened a regular nut on top. Then I found a little left over piece of aluminum bar, drilled two holes....the one on the right was a #29 drill so I could tap 8-32 threads. Then I used a brass 8-32 thumb screw (from ace hardwares hardware section...lamp hardware.) the other hole is bigger so the other 8-32 bolt will slide through to be slightly tightened with a wing nut.........so then you swivel it in place over the horizontal bottom of the downtube....and tighten the thumb screw....simple! Good thing LiveLife has good photo skills! BTW, since the nut goes on before the aluminum bar...the bar is raised out of the way of the primer shuttle.

The brass thumb screw was too long...so screw a nut on it, cut it off with a hack saw, use a grinder or file and round the cut edge, then unscrew the nut.

 

[LiveLife]

LiveLife posted this great picture

Good thing LiveLife has good photo skills!

I have to put time spent on two years of photography in High School and processing/"shooting" yearbook photos in college to work somehow before I die. Ahhhhh, fun times with Nikon FM2 35mm camera, then new in 1982 as all mechanical manual operation camera for the purist.

(I had to carry small makeup kit with me in college with no glare foundation everywhere so I could take perfect no oily/shiny skin portrait/action shots for the yearbook. I even made my closet into a temporary darkroom to load reloadable film cartridges from bulk 200 feet of 35mm film canister. So I guess I was practicing "reloading" ... ... I still don't know why they made me class president. )

 

[drband]

I have to put time spent on two years of photography in High School and processing/overseeing yearbook photos in college to work somehow before I die.

(I had to carry small makeup kit with me in college with no glare foundation everywhere so I could take perfect no oily/shiny skin portrait/action shots for the yearbook. I even made my closet into a temporary darkroom to load reusable film cartridges from bulk 200 feet of 35mm film canister. So I guess I was practicing "reloading" ... ... I still don't know why they made me class president. )

I can relate to that! The switch from film to digital got me— at the time, digital cameras with high resolution and multiple lenses were pricey and phone cams were iffy.
Nowadays you can make high quality pics with most phones! Good memories of HS yearbook layout & production.

 

[LiveLife]

Nowadays you can make high quality pics with most phones!

A friend does professional photo shoots for car magazine covers/layouts. He would spend hours waiting for the perfect sunset angle shots that would drive his clients impatient. He would tell them, "Hey, you want perfection, right?"

Even he admitted recent year smartphone cameras were impressive compared to his $2000 DSLR Canon.

Thanks for the trip back down memory lanes when we were young, dumb and stupid to have so much fun ... Then we got married and had kids ... < Just kidding honey! >

OK, back to OP.

 

[GW Staar]

The new shorter bumper column works really well once you turn it to the right position (partway in the video, I rotated it to the right spot). Matching groove filler at the bottom worked as I envisioned....It's tight and and makes it stationary through the press strokes.



View attachment 1120705 illustration.
.STL file downloadable below....

 

[LiveLife]

downtube hold-down: See the hole to the left of the downtube? I inserted a 8-32 hex head screw from the bottom, and tightened a regular nut on top. Then I found a little left over piece of aluminum bar, drilled two holes....the one on the right was a #29 drill so I could tap 8-32 threads. Then I used a brass 8-32 thumb screw (from ace hardwares hardware section...lamp hardware.) the other hole is bigger so the other 8-32 bolt will slide through to be slightly tightened with a wing nut.........so then you swivel it in place over the horizontal bottom of the downtube....and tighten the thumb screw

The new shorter bumper column works really well once you turn it to the right position (partway in the video, I rotated it to the right spot). Matching groove filler at the bottom worked as I envisioned....It's tight and and makes it stationary through the press strokes.

Nice solution thinking "outside" the box to eliminate dependence on the pin and rigidity of primer chute/trough with flip ring issue with primer trays.

This way you are working with more flexible upper part of the primer chute/trough while anchoring the bottom insertion point with bolt/nut/thumbscrew.

With approach to increasing the agitation with pin, which is mounted lower on the chute/trough, I did have some concern that over time, insertion wings could loosen from the slots with added stress/wear put on the pin hole and this approach eliminiates that.

Now, how about flexible/hinged bottom of chute/trough so range of motion is even more free, perhaps held towards the frame column with a spring?

 

[GW Staar]

Try attaching clear.png one more time....doesn't appear. I'm not comprending the last sentence. Perhaps I'm a little on the dense-side. maybe clear.png clarifies? Tell Lee that I'm just trying to give them a fresh view....they can have anything they like of it. Made it for anybody capable of downloading the file.....including them....they may spring board off of it to an even better design.

 

[LiveLife]

Tell Lee that I'm just trying to give them a fresh view....they can have anything they like of it. Made it for anybody capable of downloading the file.....including them....they may spring board off of it to an even better design.

I think you may be onto something by working on shaking the more flexible upper part instead of relying on the pin located lower.

Now that attachment point was made more secure on SPP (Compared to looser attachment on Pro 1000), pin does not move the primer chute/trough as freely as on the Pro 1000.

Shifting the primer tray shaking to higher on the chute/trough where users tend to tap/flick the primer tray to "flow" the primer, your approach may better replicate the movement made by human finger.

And neat idea of using existing hole to secure the bottom of chute/trough at attachment point.

Good job.

 

[LiveLife]

Now, how about flexible/hinged bottom of chute/trough so range of motion is even more free, perhaps held towards the frame column with a spring?

I'm not comprending the last sentence.

Since all of us are essentially trying to move/swing the primer chute/trough side to side to shake the primer tray, why not make the rigid primer chute/trough at flex point a "movable/flexible/hinged" joint designed to move?

Or make the primer insertion point movable?

 

[curlysir]

Checking out the Lee Site and parts for the SPP and noticed that they have replaced the primer trough pin with this, the old pin is approximately .062" in diameter.


and added this as an assembled trough, no mention about the pin diameter in the assembly.



Wondering if this Lee's first attempt at a fix for the primers not feeding.

 

[LiveLife]

Checking out the Lee Site and parts for the SPP and noticed that they have replaced the primer trough pin with this, the old pin is approximately .062" in diameter and added this as an assembled trough, no mention about the pin diameter in the assembly.

Wondering if this Lee's first attempt at a fix for the primers not feeding.

With primer slider/spring end and priming pin redesign that are both "self-cleaning", primers not flowing from primer tray is really the last issue to address and Lee Precision has been working on the solution.

With multiple emails that have been exchanged with Calvin, aspects of "tolerance stacking" were addressed and redesigned priming pin helped in that aspect by providing .025" rotational play to bring primer chute/trough pin to better contact with frame column/groove rings.

Calvin is already shipping the larger diameter pin in the new primer chute/trough assembly for me to test.

 

[curlysir]

With primer slider/spring end and priming pin redesign that are both "self-cleaning", primers not flowing from primer tray is really the last issue to address and Lee Precision has been working on the solution.

With multiple emails that have been exchanged with Calvin, aspects of "tolerance stacking" were addressed and redesigned priming pin helped in that aspect by providing .025" rotational play to bring primer chute/trough pin to better contact with frame column/groove rings.

Calvin is already shipping the larger diameter pin in the new primer chute/trough assembly for me to beta test.

I have 2 of the pins on the way, also ordered a new primer trough but it was not the same part number as this one, so I do not know if will be with the large pin or not. Order shipped today.

And the primers not flowing/feeding from primer tray is now the only significant issue I am having with my Six Pack Pro press. I am getting decent OAL with my loads considering I am not sorting my brass, yet. I may sort them this winter as the OAL on sorted brass is very consistent.

 

[LiveLife]

ordered a new primer trough but it was not the same part number

SKU number should be:

92020 - Six Pack Pro Primer Trough Assembled
​

That's the part Calvin is sending me to test.

And according to Calvin, thicker pin Lee decided to use is the pin for the Pro 1000.

 

[curlysir]

SKU number should be:

92020 - Six Pack Pro Primer Trough Assembled
​

That's the part Calvin is sending me to test.

Yes, that is the part number that is on the site today, but when I ordered it yesterday it was BP5079 Primer trough & slider. If it does not have the bigger pin, I will install one of the pins and test it.

 

[LiveLife]

Lee website shows "Primer trough and pin for Six Pack Pro reloading presses ... Formerly known as BP5079" - https://leeprecision.com/product.php?productid=7244&page=1

It should have the larger pin from Pro 1000.

You could call customer service to make sure it's the new assembly with larger pin installed.

 

[Tilos]

Checking out the Lee Site and parts for the SPP and noticed that they have replaced the primer trough pin with this, the old pin is approximately .062" in diameter.
View attachment 1121382

and added this as an assembled trough, no mention about the pin diameter in the assembly.

View attachment 1121383

Wondering if this Lee's first attempt at a fix for the primers not feeding.

Yea, I recommended that change in another post/thread, maybe they read it.

.
Actually this very thread:
https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/lee-6000-press.905987/page-21#post-12489062
Where I said:
"I believe Lee missed the mark on that one and the SPP pin should also be 0.093"."

.

 

[LiveLife]

I recommended that change in another post/thread, maybe they read it.

"I believe Lee missed the mark on that one and the SPP pin should also be 0.093"."

 

[Gillie Dog]

by providing .025" rotational play to bring primer chute/trough pin to better contact with frame column/groove rings.

I do not have a clue what "rotational play" is but my calculator says the pin will be .015 closer to the column if everything is perfect. Existing pin is .062 diameter, new pin is .093 so .093 minus .062 = .031. .031 divided by 2 = .0155 so the pin is that much closer to the column. Not much if existing pin does not even hit column now as some evidently do not.

GD

 

[GW Staar]

I do not have a clue what "rotational play" is but my calculator says the pin will be .015 closer to the column if everything is perfect. Existing pin is .062 diameter, new pin is .093 so .093 minus .062 = .031. .031 divided by 2 = .0155 so the pin is that much closer to the column. Not much if existing pin does not even hit column now as some evidently do not. GD

That was my finding as well.....which is why I chose to make contact the way I did. It is almost like the vertical path of the chute isn't vertical....yet it appears to be. On mine the top groove hit the wire....the bottom groove did not......yet both two protruding knobs on my modified post seem to hit the chute top the same amount .....it was curious. I'm happy with what I did....it works now. The last three stopping still bug me......there's got to be a better way. Yet, I prefer this to tubes....I hate tubes.

What I wish for is a development on the APS order.