Lee 6000 press

[LiveLife]

I do not have a clue what "rotational play" is

That's the practical range of play the top carrier cover experiences with the redesigned priming rod/pin (The range of play increased over the old straight priming pin) while still allowing the priming pin to move freely up and down while keeping the index pin inside the top cover hole without rubbing.

Existing pin is .062 diameter, new pin is .093 so .093 minus .062 = .031. .031 divided by 2 = .0155 so the pin is that much closer to the column. Not much if existing pin does not even hit column now as some evidently do not.

That was my finding as well

Yes, very good point as likely mass produced press parts will have some inherent production/assembly variance as not all users will be careful enough to ensure the primer chute/trough pin is inside the lower groove ring and tensioned slightly when tightening the two flathead screws on top.

If assembly of top carrier cover is done with chute/trough pin at the farthest rotation point away from the press column, yes there is going to be issues with pin coming nowhere near the press column, let alone the groove rings.

And this tolerance stacking is what I pointed out to Calvin/Lee Precision over several emails with measurements taken with testing with primer tray. I am quite sure Lee Precision looked at different aspects of primer feeding issue from tray but when existing .062" diameter pin was sleeved with pen filler roller to produce .118" diameter roller with resulting effective shaking of tray (limited by rotational play of old straight priming pin), I think decision was made to increase the chute/trough pin diameter using .093" pin from Pro 1000 they already had in inventory coupled with increased rotational play from redesigned priming pin to arrive at similar pin contact pressure with press column/groove rings.

So that's what I will be testing when I receive the larger pin primer chute/trough assembly Calvin is sending.

 

[9mmepiphany]

Yet, I prefer this to tubes....I hate tubes.

That is how I feel also.

When I first started, i just accepted tubes as the "way things were" and an necessary evil if I wanted to get into progressive loading. Even going to vibratory tube loaders only made it a bit more tolerable.

That is why I'm willing to put with with the quirts of making a Lee folding tray work. I can load up 5 trays in the time it takes to load up one tube

 

[Gillie Dog]

So that's what I will be testing when I receive the larger pin primer chute/trough assembly Calvin is sending.

Yea, I think all this is a band aid on an issue. Proper install of the top cover would be as designed, in my mind, and would be centering the capturing lugs on the adjacent column and centering the primer pin no matter which pin you have installed and it is understood the new pin will be/is the standard. (I have had no problem with the old primer pin)

Note, this comes from someone who made Load Masters work extremely well for decades and is almost 100% Lee presses owner. We will see how this tray shake thing ends up in the end.

GD

 

[LiveLife]

I recommended that change in another post/thread, maybe they read it.

Based on countless email exchanges with Calvin from Lee Precision that involved Stephanie, VP and John Lee, President with prompt responses and clear course of actions taken, I am sure Lee Precision is reading and paying close attention to customer comments and user reviews.

When I first started, i just accepted tubes as the "way things were" and an necessary evil if I wanted to get into progressive loading. Even going to vibratory tube loaders only made it a bit more tolerable.

That is why I'm willing to put with with the quirts of making a Lee folding tray work. I can load up 5 trays in the time it takes to load up one tube

After doing primer "flow" test of both bottom tray cover with cup side of primers and top tray cover with anvil feet side or primers, I do believe the vertical arc'ed flip rings I sketched in this post will help with use of Lee folding tray not experience primer hanging up - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...-oal-consistency.911743/page-16#post-12490988

I sent Calvin the sketch of the vertically arc'ed flip rings and we will see what Lee Precision thinks/finds out in their testing.

I think all this is a band aid on an issue. Proper install of the top cover would be as designed, in my mind, and would be centering the capturing lugs on the adjacent column and centering the primer pin no matter which pin you have installed and it is understood the new pin will be/is the standard. (I have had no problem with the old primer pin)

Note, this comes from someone who made Load Masters work extremely well for decades and is almost 100% Lee presses owner. We will see how this tray shake thing ends up in the end.

And me coming from someone who made several Pro 1000s work extremely well for decades and we resolved essentially all issues on our Pro 1K support thread - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...lutions-no-bashing.507454/page-6#post-9614898

I even thought @GW Staar may had the right approach to think "outside the box" by working on more flexible top of primer chute/trough when everyone else was working around the pin and emailed his posts for Lee Precision to review/consider.

Email replies from Calvin indicate Lee Precision is looking at various solution options and have done testing. I think as we have already seen with longer slider/narrowed spring end and completely redesigned priming pin update that is "self-cleaning" that happened very quickly after product launch, I believe Lee Precision is definitely interested in obtaining resolution with identified issues.

But with launch of new SPP/Pro 6000 and now with new inline bullet feed die/rotary magazine, Calvin indicated they are pushing personnel limits with still one 8 hour shift operation. I think Lee Precision deciding to go with larger diameter pin from Pro 1000 is a good solution that has minimal design/retooling/production/inventory impact as they already stock the part.

I will certainly push the limits on the new larger diameter pin primer chute/trough for operational reliability but if any primer flow issue persists, I am sure Lee Precision will continue to work on the solution (Perhaps adopt the suggestion of using vertical arc'ed flip rings for the primer tray). Stay tuned for the testing of new primer chute/trough with larger diameter pin.

 

[GW Staar]

Based on countless email exchanges with Calvin from Lee Precision that involved Stephanie, VP and John Lee, President with prompt responses and clear course of actions taken, I am sure Lee Precision is reading and paying close attention to customer comments and user reviews..

In that case, John Lee, how about making an offer to buy RCBS from Vista Outdoor Inc. so they can be owned by someone active, interested, and receptive in the business! Betcha their employees would be grateful.

 

[LiveLife]

In that case, John Lee, how about making an offer to buy RCBS from Vista Outdoor Inc. so they can be owned by someone active, interested, and receptive in the business! Betcha their employees would be grateful.

May not be a bad idea ... You know, Lee Precision likely outsells all of their competitors products COMBINED world-wide on an annual basis.

But seeing what they did with the new inline bullet feeding die and rotary magazine, Lee Precision probably prefers to "innovate/improve upon" current market products to make it their own.

I suggested Lee Precision ship the new bullet feed dies with the Ultimate split lock ring as Lee exclusive die wrench maybe easier for those with hand dexterity issues to make fine adjustments needed for different length bullets (instead of knurling the die body) and Calvin sent a confirming email that they will.

 

[curlysir]

Lee needs to go take a look at the primer trough and tray combo for the Load-Master and see why it works whereas the system for the SSP does not. I am referring to the primers feeding out of the tray and the way they moved the trough and tray while in use. I have 3 Load-Masters and have been using Load-Masters for years. I am using the same primer trays on the SSP that I used on the Load-Masters, they would feed primers without a problem, don't remember the last time I had to thump the trays when using the LM. Not the same with the SSP, I have got everything working properly except for the problem with the primers not feeding to the primer trough in a reliable manner, I have to watch the tray to make sure it is feeding and having to thump it with my fingers on a semi regular basis. I have tried the plastic roller, adjusting the carrier, etc, and these have helped but have not fixed the problem. I really think Lee needs to take a look at the design of the trough itself and compare it to the tray on the LM. Personally, I would like to see it angled slightly so it does not interfere with the Mini Mr. Bulletfeeder bullet holder, but that is a low priority as I have a solution for that. The SSP has become my primary loader even with the annoyance of the primers not feeding, I just need to make sure I check the trays regularly.

I really don't think enlarging the pin by itself will fix the problem, I believe it will take something in addition to the enlarged pin to completely solve the problem.

 

[curlysir]

May not be a bad idea ... You know, Lee Precision likely outsells all of their competitors products COMBINED world-wide on an annual basis.

But seeing what they did with the new inline bullet feeding die and rotary magazine, Lee Precision probably prefers to "innovate/improve upon" current market products to make it their own.

I suggested Lee Precision ship the new bullet feed dies with the Ultimate split lock ring as Lee exclusive die wrench maybe easier for those with hand dexterity issues to make fine adjustments needed for different length bullets instead of knurling the die body and Calvin sent a confirming email that they will.

I like those lock rings much better then the o-ring type.

 

[LiveLife]

I have 3 Load-Masters and have been using Load-Masters for years. I am using the same primer trays on the SSP that I used on the Load-Masters, they would feed primers without a problem

Not the same with the SSP

But the SPP's new primer system is not using the same chute/trough as Load-Master.

I have got everything working properly except for the problem with the primers not feeding to the primer trough in a reliable manner, I have to watch the tray to make sure it is feeding and having to thump it with my fingers on a semi regular basis. I have tried the plastic roller, adjusting the carrier, etc, and these have helped but have not fixed the problem.

And I would agree.

I really think Lee needs to take a look at the design of the trough itself and compare it to the tray on the LM. Personally, I would like to see it angled slightly so it does not interfere with the Mini Mr. Bulletfeeder bullet holder

The new Lee inline bullet feed die and rotary magazine do not interfere with the primer chute/trough.

The SSP has become my primary loader even with the annoyance of the primers not feeding, I just need to make sure I check the trays regularly.

I really don't think enlarging the pin by itself will fix the problem, I believe it will take something in addition to the enlarged pin to completely solve the problem.

Same situation for me now SPP/Pro 6000 can load both all pistol and rifle calibers and now Dillon 550 has become my "back up" press which I had planned on using for rifle calibers.

We will see if the new primer chute/trough assembly with larger diameter pin will flow the primers from tray. If not, I still have another option of taping the top cover flip rings around the On/Off/Open switch smooth for no hang ups. Stand by.

 

[LiveLife]

I like those lock rings much better then the o-ring type.

The Ultimate split lock rings are dual purpose as they still have the O-ring to use as regular friction lock rings and you can also tighten the screw to make them non-adjustable.

Win-win, best of both worlds ... Maybe that's why they call them "Ultimate".

 

[curlysir]

But the SPP's new primer system is not using the same chute/trough as Load-Master.


And I would agree.


The new Lee inline bullet feed die and rotary magazine do not interfere with the primer chute/trough.


Same situation for me now SPP/Pro 6000 can load both all pistol and rifle calibers and now Dillon 550 has become my "back up" press which I had planned on using for rifle calibers.

We will see if the new primer chute/trough assembly with larger diameter pin will flow the primers from tray. If not, I still have another option of taping the top cover flip rings around the On/Off/Open switch smooth for no hang ups. Stand by.

Correct, they do not use the same chute/trough. What I was trying to convey it that the method used to shake the trays on the LM works very good with the raised tabs on the side of the press where the SSP utilizes a pin dropping into a depression on the column
.

 

[LiveLife]

What I was trying to convey it that the method used to shake the trays on the LM works very good with the raised tabs on the side of the press where the SSP utilizes as pin dropping into a depression on the column.

Priming system on the LM works with prominent bumps on the frame with articulated primer chute/trough that indeed does a good job of shaking the primer tray.

SPP priming system is based around fixed slider channel/trough with guide that picks up the primer. Articulated primer chute/trough with bumps on frame column (Like @GW Staar 3D printed) that feeds into a flexible/hinged base could certainly work better to shake the primer tray like LM's primer feeder

Now, how about flexible/hinged bottom of chute/trough so range of motion is even more free

Possibilities ...

 

[Gillie Dog]

Email replies from Calvin indicate Lee Precision is looking at various solution options and have done testing. I think as we have already seen with longer slider/narrowed spring end and completely redesigned priming pin update that is "self-cleaning" that happened very quickly after product launch, I believe Lee Precision is definitely interested in obtaining resolution with identified issues.

I will certainly push the limits on the new larger diameter pin primer chute/trough for operational reliability but if any primer flow issue persists. Stay tuned for the testing of new primer chute/trough with larger diameter pin.

I will also as soon as I get it, should be next week. (Holiday might get in the way though)

GD

 

[rotorloader]

I reported earlier about the primer pin getting stuck up and locking up the press. Lee is sending me the new "updated" pin and spring and they have steered me to a video about disassembly which may be more complicated than need be but is needed to replace the bottom cover. Can the pin and new spring be replaced after removing the top cover and reliably replacing it, being careful about the detent ball and spring. or does the video provided need to be followed, Site will not let me link video. On Vimeo number756933295/88d1532b77

 

[LiveLife]

primer pin getting stuck up and locking up the press. Lee is sending me the new "updated" pin and spring

Can the pin and new spring be replaced after removing the top cover and reliably replacing it, being careful about the detent ball and spring. or does the video provided need to be followed, Site will not let me link video. On Vimeo number756933295/88d1532b77

Vimeo video can be embedded but not direct linked (Highlight text and click on "Link" button that looks like a chain to the right of text/font color and size buttons on the toolbar and paste address in the pop up box).

Yes, you can replace the priming pin and spring without completely disassembling the press. Here's the step-by-step directions on disassembly of top/bottom carrier covers and reassembly with pictures - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...ing-for-oal-consistency.911743/#post-12443441

Instructions on enhanced reassembly of top/bottom carrier covers to increase tension on primer chute/trough pin on press column/groove rings - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...-oal-consistency.911743/page-15#post-12482599

Additional disassembly/reassembly and trouble shooting/product update links list - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...-oal-consistency.911743/page-16#post-12493822

"Best Practices" checklist to setup SPP/Pro 6000 for more reliable operation - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...x-pack-pro-pro-6000-kit.913577/#post-12490108

 

[rotorloader]

Vimeo video can be embedded but not direct linked (Highlight text and click on "Link" button that looks like a chain to the right of text/font color and size buttons on the toolbar and paste address in the pop up box).

Yes, you can replace the priming pin and spring without completely disassembling the press. Here's the step-by-step directions on disassembly of top/bottom carrier covers and reassembly with pictures - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...ing-for-oal-consistency.911743/#post-12443441

Instructions on enhanced reassembly of top/bottom carrier covers to increase tension on primer chute/trough pin on press column/groove rings - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...-oal-consistency.911743/page-15#post-12482599

Additional disassembly/reassembly and trouble shooting/product update links list - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...-oal-consistency.911743/page-16#post-12493822

"Best Practices" checklist to setup SPP/Pro 6000 for more reliable operation - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...x-pack-pro-pro-6000-kit.913577/#post-12490108

Thank you for the help.

 

[GW Staar]

I was able to download that Lee video to my own computer's desktop......now I can review it any time. Wish the demonstrator had turned up the mike......

 

[Tilos]

I was able to download that Lee video to my own computer's desktop......now I can review it any time. Wish the demonstrator had turned up the mike......

Turn on the Closed Captions (CC) for on-screen text and watch it full screen...
Thats what I do,

.
Six Pack Pro: Replace Bottom Cover (vimeo.com)

 

[GW Staar]

I have to be frank, if I'd seen this video first, I would not have bought the press. I know me...a very impatient soul. My RCBS ProChucker 7 takes all of 10 seconds to change the small primer rod to the large one. No wonder they only use ONE size rod. Surely there is a faster way.....surely.

I almost didn't buy the PC7 over going back to primer tubes....still hate them, and am using a bench primer mostly. APS on the Pro 2000 wasn't perfect, but it's way better than anything else....at priming fast and safe. But it wasn't better at convincing people to buy it....or at the least RCBS wasn't able to market it convincingly.

Nirvana is still out there waiting to be found to prime progressives safe and well...it's not at Hornady or Dillon either.

 

[Bartojc]

Can the pin and new spring be replaced after removing the top cover and reliably replacing it, being careful about the detent ball and spring. or does the video provided need to be followed

I am not sure if you can raise the ram high enough to get that pan head screw out on the bottom of the cover. If you could you could get away without disassembling the linkage and pulling the whole ram out. I followed the video and LiveLifes pictures. Even if you can get by without disassembling the linkage I see no way around taking the tool head off. It seems like it’s more involved than it should be. Maybe next time I’ll try my above theory. I did follow their recommended procedure though the first time around.
Jeff

 

[curlysir]

I am not sure if you can raise the ram high enough to get that pan head screw out on the bottom of the cover. If you could you could get away without disassembling the linkage and pulling the whole ram out. I followed the video and LiveLifes pictures. Even if you can get by without disassembling the linkage I see no way around taking the tool head off. It seems like it’s more involved than it should be. Maybe next time I’ll try my above theory. I did follow their recommended procedure though the first time around.
Jeff

This video is for replacement of the bottom cover, the early presses did not have the triangle cut out for the primer pin and powder would become trapped in the part where the pin sets.

If you are only replacing the primer pin you do NOT have to remove the carrier top cover or disassemble the linkage. You remove the shell plate, remove the bottom screw, and the top 2 screws and the bottom cover will come down and you can replace the primer pin, just watch the detent ball and make sure it doesn't fall off.

 

[LiveLife]

I am not sure if you can raise the ram high enough to get that pan head screw out on the bottom of the cover.

Sure you can. When you raise the shellplate carrier up, not even all the way, you can fit a stubby Phillips screwdriver underneath to remove the panhead screw.

Bottom carrier cover removed after loosening panhead screw (Shown in front of ram) and carefully lowered to show detent ball/spring, index pin and priming rod/pin with spring to the right of ram)

Even if you can get by without disassembling the linkage I see no way around taking the tool head off.

Member rotorloader is only replacing the priming pin and spring.

Lee is sending me the new "updated" pin and spring

Can the pin and new spring be replaced after removing the top cover and reliably replacing it, being careful about the detent ball and spring

I have now disassembled and reassembled the top/bottom carrier covers over 20 times and when the redesigned "self-cleaning" priming rod/pin and spring were sent by Lee Precision, I outlined the replacement process here - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...-oal-consistency.911743/page-15#post-12482599

Picture showing new pin/spring dropped in place, ready for reassembly of top/bottom carrier covers.

I called "Enhanced" because the new priming pin allows slight more rotation of top carrier cover to add more tension on the primer chute/trough pin with press column/groove rings. Focus needs to be made before tightening the two top cover flathead screws to place the pin in the lower groove ring and apply tension.

Picture showing pin inside lower groove ring and tensioned while tightening two top flathead screws to show slight twisting of primer chute/trough. When this "Enhanced" method is used, pin ends up making "enhanced" contact with frame column/groove rings to shake the primer tray better.

And due to manufacturing tolerance variance, if pin does not making sufficient contact with frame column/groove rings, you can cut a piece of pen filler to make a sleeve roller that will make up the different (Notice even greater twisting of primer chute/trough with DIY roller mod). The updated primer chute/trough assembly with larger diameter pin (.093" from Pro 1000 instead of .062") does same to take up the tolerance variance.

 

[trdjohn]

This video is for replacement of the bottom cover, the early presses did not have the triangle cut out for the primer pin and powder would become trapped in the part where the pin sets.

If you are only replacing the primer pin you do NOT have to remove the carrier top cover or disassemble the linkage. You remove the shell plate, remove the bottom screw, and the top 2 screws and the bottom cover will come down and you can replace the primer pin, just watch the detent ball and make sure it doesn't fall off.

exactly what he said, LL said he's done it 20 times, I've done it 4 times and it took all of 5 min the first time, after you've done it once, it takes all of 2 or 3 minutes... just keep an eye on the ball

 

[LiveLife]

just keep an eye on the ball

Yup, eye on detent ball or it will roll off the spring and you will have to look for it all over the place ... only to find it fell into the bottom carrier cover.

< Don't ask me how I know ... And done it a few times already >

 

[Tilos]

Yup, eye on detent ball or it will roll off the spring and you will have to look for it all over the place ... only to find it fell into the bottom carrier cover.

< Don't ask me how I know ... And done it a few times already >

And while you are in there, it's a good time to swap out that steel ball with a nylon replacement.

.