dmallind
Member
OK time to stick my neck out a bit.
While not personally offended (that's exceptionally difficult to achieve trust me) I am often disappointed by the blanket assumption that anyone who is not a die-hard neocon or Libertarian is some kind of anti-American, anti-freedom and of course anti-gun snake. Not only is that of course untrue but it's a sloppy debate tactic. Of course some "Liberals" - let's define that for the sake of discussion as non-hardcore right wing - want to severely limit or even ban guns. I suspect very few are anti-American or anti-freedom - they (heck we I suppose - I definitely qualify as a liberal by THR standards) may however have different ideas about what those conceopts are to the hard right.
So I think it's time to stand up. If I'm the only one who does then so be it but I suspect there is a lot - no not a majority - of THR posters who are by at least some definition "Liberal" (it's not really a dirty word you know - look it up!)
No I'm not a socialist. No I'm not an Al Qaeda sympathizer. No I'm not a pinko fag. Been called all those and worse so go ahead. However I am someone who believes that taxes aren't always evil, that Christianity is not the answer to all political questions (heck make that any), that people should be left alone to live as they see fit with who they see fit as long as they don't harm anyone else, that some attention to the environment which we inhabit may not be a bad thing, that people who live in other countries and have other skin colors and other religions are not inferior and certainly not cannon fodder, and so on.
And yes I have guns. A few of them and looking for more. I like using them. I'm not particularly good with them but I'm getting better. I (along with quite a few Democratic House and Senate members here in MN by the way and against some Republican ones) think we should be able to carry guns if we're not criminals or loonies.
By demonizing and excoriating those who may disagree on politics in other areas but agree on guns what are you doing to advance the cause of gun ownership? What are you doing but alienating potential allies? The first time MNCCRN sent me a notice asking me to call my reps and ask for a passage of the new single-issue carry bill I did so, because I agree with them (for non locals the MN carry law was just ruled unconstitutional on a technicality) on this issue.
The next time the fax came it started with vitriol about liberal judges (the lead judge was a former Marine officer and one of the others was appointed by the gun-friendly Ventura) and then asked me to supoprt them again.
Nope. Blanket insults and demonization do not inspire me to help in the cause even if I do agree with it, sorry guys - until your language gets more restrained and more positive, not to mention more accurate, I'm not calling for you. Neither will I join most of the gun lobby groups - they are political partisans instead of cause and advocacy partisans.
So I think it's time for those who aren't on the hard right to say that we are gun owners and carry permit holders and advocates too - and every time you assume that no one left of Limbaugh is a gun owner you risk losing the support of the many who are.
I suspect some will not want to acknowledge their political views are outside of the THR majority. I suspect some have already departed from these boards - especially the political ones - because of the unwelcoming, adversarial and hateful tone against anyone not in lockstep with the far right, so whatever response happens I suspect it will understate the number of "Liberal" gun owners - but I hope at least there are enough to give pause to some of the less entrenched and partisan who are thinking of making a political post with attacks against a group that is as diverse and as varied as the nation itself.
I am a Liberal. I have guns.
While not personally offended (that's exceptionally difficult to achieve trust me) I am often disappointed by the blanket assumption that anyone who is not a die-hard neocon or Libertarian is some kind of anti-American, anti-freedom and of course anti-gun snake. Not only is that of course untrue but it's a sloppy debate tactic. Of course some "Liberals" - let's define that for the sake of discussion as non-hardcore right wing - want to severely limit or even ban guns. I suspect very few are anti-American or anti-freedom - they (heck we I suppose - I definitely qualify as a liberal by THR standards) may however have different ideas about what those conceopts are to the hard right.
So I think it's time to stand up. If I'm the only one who does then so be it but I suspect there is a lot - no not a majority - of THR posters who are by at least some definition "Liberal" (it's not really a dirty word you know - look it up!)
No I'm not a socialist. No I'm not an Al Qaeda sympathizer. No I'm not a pinko fag. Been called all those and worse so go ahead. However I am someone who believes that taxes aren't always evil, that Christianity is not the answer to all political questions (heck make that any), that people should be left alone to live as they see fit with who they see fit as long as they don't harm anyone else, that some attention to the environment which we inhabit may not be a bad thing, that people who live in other countries and have other skin colors and other religions are not inferior and certainly not cannon fodder, and so on.
And yes I have guns. A few of them and looking for more. I like using them. I'm not particularly good with them but I'm getting better. I (along with quite a few Democratic House and Senate members here in MN by the way and against some Republican ones) think we should be able to carry guns if we're not criminals or loonies.
By demonizing and excoriating those who may disagree on politics in other areas but agree on guns what are you doing to advance the cause of gun ownership? What are you doing but alienating potential allies? The first time MNCCRN sent me a notice asking me to call my reps and ask for a passage of the new single-issue carry bill I did so, because I agree with them (for non locals the MN carry law was just ruled unconstitutional on a technicality) on this issue.
The next time the fax came it started with vitriol about liberal judges (the lead judge was a former Marine officer and one of the others was appointed by the gun-friendly Ventura) and then asked me to supoprt them again.
Nope. Blanket insults and demonization do not inspire me to help in the cause even if I do agree with it, sorry guys - until your language gets more restrained and more positive, not to mention more accurate, I'm not calling for you. Neither will I join most of the gun lobby groups - they are political partisans instead of cause and advocacy partisans.
So I think it's time for those who aren't on the hard right to say that we are gun owners and carry permit holders and advocates too - and every time you assume that no one left of Limbaugh is a gun owner you risk losing the support of the many who are.
I suspect some will not want to acknowledge their political views are outside of the THR majority. I suspect some have already departed from these boards - especially the political ones - because of the unwelcoming, adversarial and hateful tone against anyone not in lockstep with the far right, so whatever response happens I suspect it will understate the number of "Liberal" gun owners - but I hope at least there are enough to give pause to some of the less entrenched and partisan who are thinking of making a political post with attacks against a group that is as diverse and as varied as the nation itself.
I am a Liberal. I have guns.