Loading 9mm self-defense load (SIG 124 gr V-CROWN proj.)

[Alex G]

Will definitely have to look into a chrono now. Thanks guys!

 

[ekv551]

I have been loading the same 9mm Sierra V Crown 124gr JHP #9924 bullets in Winchester brass, 4.0gr Bullseye with Winchester SPP at 1.09" OAL. In my M&P 9 2.0, I'm getting 1070 FPS on Caldwell chrono. The same round in my M&P Shield is right at 1000 FPS. I have no problems in either gun with cycling or any other issues. I'm not sure if I should go any hotter with Bullseye. I have some Power Pistol I'm going to try out.

 

[jmorris]

The Caldwell is a nice chrono but I first purchased this one - it has a Bluetooth connection to a very nice app which helps when dealing with a lot of test load data:
https://www.opticsplanet.com/competition-electronics-prochrono-dlx-with-bluetooth.html

FYI when you order from OP the “ships from 1-7 days” part can turn into longer than that, sometimes much longer.

 

[NMexJim]

First I'll state that I don't believe in carrying reloaded defensive ammo...but that isn't the question.

I've found the LNL powder measure to be very accurate when paired with the Powder Cop die, with just a few simple processes in place. Make sure that the Powder Insert goes all the way to the top of the track, maybe 1/16" short, in the powder measure body when a case is inserted.

Set the O-ring so that it is flush with the top of the die when the charge is correct. Don't reset the Powder Cop on the same charge repeatedly...it compacts the powder. If a charge going through the die isn't quite flush, dump the charge back into the hopper and charge the case again...it doesn't happen that often and is usually a result of inconsistent handle operation

I'll include these cuts outs from the Accurate site to go along with Alex's.

So, I have an LNL and I have a Powder Cop. AA 7 is a very fine, slow-burning spherical powder, and it certainly does meter pretty well and I like it. That said, and if you're pushing max load or even just to control velocity a bit better, I would encourage you to hand weigh. At least, reweigh every few rounds.

My reasoning is that I happen to use AA #2, a very fine, fast-burning spherical powder for my short barrels, and AA #5 for longer (I threw in a cut of AA #5 just for giggles). By no means does AA #7 change velocities as fast as does AA #2, and AA #7 also has a greater spread from min. This certainly makes a tenth of a grain or two less critical.

But, I've found my LNL to vary a few grains from charge to charge. I keep it very clean and de-static-ed. Is that a word? Well, free from static anyway. With AA #2 and a Powder Cop, I got an itchy feeling (that little voice in the back of your mind?) and pulled a few bullets and re-weighted. I was running from just over min to over max. I pulled them all and hand weighed from that point on.

I do keep a few rounds pristinely loaded in case of a Zombie attack, and these were for that purpose If this ammo may become critical for you (and I too do not advocate hand loads for carry - see this forum www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/the-peculiar-problem-of-handloads-in-self-defense-shootings.821474/ ), then I suggest you hand weigh. Ok, all you Lee guys jump on now.

Based on comments from this forum, and on my list of to-buys-once-the-pandemic-is-over is an RCBS Powder Check which physically locks out a progressive press. Here' the title on this forum.

Hornady Lock + Load AP


AA #2


AA #7



AA #5


Powder Cop vs RCBS Lockout Die? | The High Road
Let me edit that title above. Thanks.

 

[Alex G]

I was running from just over min to over max. I pulled them all and hand weighed from that point on.

Yikes!! That’s quite a variation! Any idea if the powder was bridging, or sticking somehow else? Mine has been spot on to the 10th of a grain so far, so that’s kind of concerning. Also, are you running the standard metering insert for pistol, or the micrometer? I tried the micrometer insert and it does not fit the rotor tight enough for the fine grains. With that at least I had charges varying probably 3-4 tenths if a grain, so I swapped it back to the regular pistol insert and problem solved. Not saying that’s what it is, just something worth checking into. Other thing could be static cling to the foot on the powder cop, but I highly doubt it’d be that much...
Also thanks for posting the info! It helps to show the burn rate comparisons well.

 

[GooseGestapo]

I use Acc#7 for my 124gr Hornady XTP’s. I load just under Accurate’s max.
From a 5”bbl, they’re just over 1,200fps. 1,150fps from 4”.
They’ll do.
Very accurate from my S&W PPC-9’s....

 

[ballman6711]

yep, Sierra lists the projectile and specs directly in their load data, which is helpful for sure, and AA#7 is one of the best powders they list as far as obtaining decent velocity and not pushing dangerous pressure limits. (If using the Sierra app, you can see a velocity value, controlled by a slider bar. As you move the slider up to increase velocity, many of the other powders drop off at a lower max velocity because of chamber pressure. I will try to show some photos to explain, with min and max loads shown)
View attachment 975545 View attachment 975546

Please be aware that the data you are referencing is +P data, and not standard 9mm.

chris

 

[Alex G]

Please be aware that the data you are referencing is +P data, and not standard 9mm.

chris

You are correct. I was aware of that, but thanks for pointing it out!

 

[NMexJim]

Yikes!! That’s quite a variation! Any idea if the powder was bridging, or sticking somehow else? Mine has been spot on to the 10th of a grain so far, so that’s kind of concerning. Also, are you running the standard metering insert for pistol, or the micrometer? I tried the micrometer insert and it does not fit the rotor tight enough for the fine grains. With that at least I had charges varying probably 3-4 tenths if a grain, so I swapped it back to the regular pistol insert and problem solved. Not saying that’s what it is, just something worth checking into. Other thing could be static cling to the foot on the powder cop, but I highly doubt it’d be that much...
Also thanks for posting the info! It helps to show the burn rate comparisons well.

A lot of the errors are speed related, I suspect, or maybe a stroke that's a little off. Small errors really mount up with fine grain powders especially fast burn, fine grain. Note that I I tear down the LNL powder drop and clean on a regular basis and have had no bridging issues.

No, no sticking on the powder cops feet. Again, fine grain powder errors are, well, fine. They are hard to pick up with the o-ring in my opinion.

Slower burn powders like AA #7'are probably smarter to use with any progressive unless you need the faster combustion.

Yes, correct insert, etc for pistol. BTW, I buy extra LNL powder drop bottom assemblies for various needs, label them and masking tape the correct insert in the tube.

The point remains that for critical ammo, either hand weigh (or dip for the volume vs weight users) and recheck often. You asked for advice and that's mine.

 

[Alex G]

A lot of the errors are speed related, I suspect, or maybe a stroke that's a little off. Small errors really mount up with fine grain powders especially fast burn, fine grain. Note that I I tear down the LNL powder drop and clean on a regular basis and have had no bridging issues.

No, no sticking on the powder cops feet. Again, fine grain powder errors are, well, fine. They are hard to pick up with the o-ring in my opinion.

Slower burn powders like AA #7'are probably smarter to use with any progressive unless you need the faster combustion.

Yes, correct insert, etc for pistol. BTW, I buy extra LNL powder drop bottom assemblies for various needs, label them and masking tape the correct insert in the tube.

The point remains that for critical ammo, either hand weigh (or dip for the volume vs weight users) and recheck often. You asked for advice and that's mine.

definitely understand, and I meant no offense in all the questions, just curious.

 

[NMexJim]

definitely understand, and I meant no offense in all the questions, just curious.

Oh no, no offense at all. No worries. Life is too short for that.

 

[Mark_Mark]

definitely understand, and I meant no offense in all the questions, just curious.

I’m offended that you have not bought a chron yet! yes get the cheap one because you will shoot it... eventually

 

[WYO]

25 rounds per ladder gradation sounds like a waste of resources to me, especially if not using a chrono. I would start at 5 on the lower ends and get up to 10 when getting close to the limit.

Also, I once loaded 9mm with AA#7 before I got a chronograph. I picked a mid-range amount between the minimum and maximum for the same grain bullet (not the exact same type), used the suggested OAL, and called it good. After I got a chronograph, I learned that the load was hitting +P velocity, which is way beyond what the reloading book said. Now, I would not dream of loading without a chronograph.

 

[Mark_Mark]

25 rounds per ladder gradation sounds like a waste of resources to me, especially if not using a chrono. I would start at 5 on the lower ends and get up to 10 when getting close to the limit.

Also, I once loaded 9mm with AA#7 before I got a chronograph. I picked a mid-range amount between the minimum and maximum for the same grain bullet (not the exact same type), used the suggested OAL, and called it good. After I got a chronograph, I learned that the load was hitting +P velocity, which is way beyond what the reloading book said. Now, I would not dream of loading without a chronograph.

+P is were I like to stay! warm and exciting

YES! buy chron like you buy components

 

[Alex G]

I’m offended that you have not bought a chron yet

Now, I would not dream of loading without a chronograph.

YES! buy chron like you buy components

Hmmm...I process brass (take dirty range brass, mostly 9mm, size it, tumble it, and sell it as processed brass), as a side income to help my wife and I with a little extra cash on the side. Think I could use some of the proceeds from that to get a chrono...since I feel like if there is one thing y’all are saying, it’s that haha

 

[Charlie98]

I could use some of the proceeds from that to get a chrono

A chrono is almost essential when working up a load, particularly if you are trying to duplicate a factory load. Velocity is not the End All in reloading, but it's a key piece of the puzzle, and one of the best ways of telling you what is going on.

For short barrel 9x19 I have had good result with BE-86 and 124gr bullets.

...and that is a prime example of why a chronograph is a good idea. I've used BE-86 for loads in my Kahr pistols, 3.6" and 3.1" barrels. I found, with BE-86, I hit a velocity threshold where more powder did not equate to any higher velocity... I would never have found that without a chronograph.

First I'll state that I don't believe in carrying reloaded defensive ammo...but that isn't the question.

I agree... but, yet, here we are. I just loaded up some Speer GoldDots for SD use, when my last box of Remington is used up.

 

[Mark_Mark]

A chrono is almost essential when working up a load, particularly if you are trying to duplicate a factory load. Velocity is not the End All in reloading, but it's a key piece of the puzzle, and one of the best ways of telling you what is going on.



...and that is a prime example of why a chronograph is a good idea. I've used BE-86 for loads in my Kahr pistols, 3.6" and 3.1" barrels. I found, with BE-86, I hit a velocity threshold where more powder did not equate to any higher velocity... I would never have found that without a chronograph.



I agree... but, yet, here we are. I just loaded up some Speer GoldDots for SD use, when my last box of Remington is used up.

my end goal is Power Factor of the Ammo I’m loading. as for handloading for defensive, why not??? you customize the ammo to the firearm, marriage made in heaven

 

[9mmepiphany]

I agree... but, yet, here we are. I just loaded up some Speer GoldDots for SD use, when my last box of Remington is used up.

I can understand that.

I'm just lucky that I usually purchase SD ammo by the case and start looking again when I'm a half case down. I think I'm on my last 1/2 case of Gold Dots, 1/2 case of SXT, and 1/2 case of Golden Sabre

 

[NMexJim]

my end goal is Power Factor of the Ammo I’m loading. as for handloading for defensive, why not??? you customize the ammo to the firearm, marriage made in heaven

http://www.thehighroad.org/index.ph...f-handloads-in-self-defense-shootings.821474/

I don't doubt that the ammo we build is effective, but Spats McGee makes some interesting points. Take the time to read and make your own decision.

 

[Mark_Mark]

http://www.thehighroad.org/index.ph...f-handloads-in-self-defense-shootings.821474/

I don't doubt that the ammo we build is effective, but Spats McGee makes some interesting points. Take the time to read and make your own decision.

I read it, I still will carry my load and have an attorney on forever retainer.

 

[fxvr5]

...and that is a prime example of why a chronograph is a good idea. I've used BE-86 for loads in my Kahr pistols, 3.6" and 3.1" barrels. I found, with BE-86, I hit a velocity threshold where more powder did not equate to any higher velocity... I would never have found that without a chronograph.

Do you recall what that data was = bullet weight and charge? Thanks.

 

[roque5]

Thanks for the info on the $88 chronograph, I just ordered it.

 

[Mark_Mark]

Thanks for the info on the $88 chronograph, I just ordered it.

when a reloader buys a chrono an angle gets his wings

 

[Alex G]

OAL Length Question
So, I finally got around to loading up some dummy rounds and doing some testing in my various barrels and magazines. At the moment, I’m slightly lost as to what I should choose for an OAL. Sierra data shows an OAL of 1.090”. I know with pistol bullets, you can generally go longer but not shorter on the book listed OAL. Factory V-CROWN’s are around 1.065”, and my magazines/chambers can accommodate up to around 1.200”. I loaded dummy rounds within that range and they all feed/chamber completely fine. Is there an advantage to seating the projectile longer and closer to the rifling, as with a rifle round, or is it better to have them shorter for cross-compatibility in handguns other than my own, and better feeding?
Any advice is recommended here.
Thanks!

 

[Walkalong]

Set OAL for function, go from there.

Factory V-CROWN’s are around 1.065”,

And you have your answer.